Hayes air brake controller install

[chief916]

So I'm installing the Hayes brake controller today and 2 questions to the users of this product.  1.  Does the red wire to the brake switch need to be absolutely hooked up???  And 2.  Anybody have any suggestions as to the best way to connect the controller wires to the system.  Final options would be butt connectors but would not look nice.  I was thinking a 4 wire trailer wire harness or maybe a connector that is suitable to the Delphi connector I have installed now.  Any thoughts on this are appreciated .

Thank

Ben

[alan0043]

1 hour ago, chief916 said:

So I'm installing the Hayes brake controller today and 2 questions to the users of this product.  1.  Does the red wire to the brake switch need to be absolutely hooked up???  And 2.  Anybody have any suggestions as to the best way to connect the controller wires to the system.  Final options would be butt connectors but would not look nice.  I was thinking a 4 wire trailer wire harness or maybe a connector that is suitable to the Delphi connector I have installed now.  Any thoughts on this are appreciated .

Thank

Ben

Hi Ben,

I was able to find my instruction sheet from my Hayes controller. The black wire is your positive power supply. They want you to use 12ga. wire and have a 20 amp automatic reset circuit breaker. I used a 20 amp fuse  instead of the circuit breaker with no problems. The red wire is for the stop light circuit. I did not find what size wire to use in the instruction sheet but I used 12ga. wire on my truck. The blue wire is the brake connection wire. They want you to use 12 ga wire there. I ran my blue wire to my Jackalopee for an easy hook-up. The white wire is your ground. With the other wires being 12 ga why not make the white 12 ga. I used a Delphi style connector myself. My thought was if the brake controller goes bad, I can unplug it.

I hope this helps,
Al

[Alie&Jim's Carrilite]

Yes on the brake light switch.  If you have a Jackaloppe you can pull off of that for the brake light signal.  If you could find a Delphi connector that would be the neatest, but sometimes practical and neat don't go together.

[chief916]

2 hours ago, alan0043 said:

Hi Ben,

I was able to find my instruction sheet from my Hayes controller. The black wire is your positive power supply. They want you to use 12ga. wire and have a 20 amp automatic reset circuit breaker. I used a 20 amp fuse  instead of the circuit breaker with no problems. The red wire is for the stop light circuit. I did not find what size wire to use in the instruction sheet but I used 12ga. wire on my truck. The blue wire is the brake connection wire. They want you to use 12 ga wire there. I ran my blue wire to my Jackalopee for an easy hook-up. The white wire is your ground. With the other wires being 12 ga why not make the white 12 ga. I used a Delphi style connector myself. My thought was if the brake controller goes bad, I can unplug it.

I hope this helps,
Al

Thanks Al...I would guess that if the red wire is optional then I could just leave it unconnected at this time and that I would have an option to connect it later.  I just wanted to be sure that it wasn't lmpearative.   Could you tell me where you found the Delphi connector?  Even though the wires won't show.. would still like to have the option to disconnect without having to chop wires.

[chief916]

2 hours ago, Alie&Jim's Carrilite said:

Yes on the brake light switch.  If you have a Jackaloppe you can pull off of that for the brake light signal.  If you could find a Delphi connector that would be the neatest, but sometimes practical and neat don't go together.

Hi Jim.  Yes my plan is to...if need be.. to connect to the red wire back to the jackalopee.  Primary for me now is to source a Delphi connector so I can keep everything neat.  Any ideas??

Thanks

Ben

[mr. cob]

Howdy Ben,

PLEASE post photos and part numbers as you do your install, I would sure appreciate this and I am sure others would also.  Thanks.

Dave

[DesertMiner]

https://www.amazon.com/Delphi-Completed-Circuits-Weatherpack-Waterproof/dp/B075LZGX4T/ref=sr_1_15?ie=UTF8&qid=1519241427&sr=8-15&keywords=delphi+connectors

[alan0043]

39 minutes ago, chief916 said:

Hi Jim.  Yes my plan is to...if need be.. to connect to the red wire back to the jackalopee.  Primary for me now is to source a Delphi connector so I can keep everything neat.  Any ideas??

Thanks

Ben

Hi Ben,

I have my controller mounted on the lower part of my dash. I can see the controller when driving. It is across from my right knee up and out of the way. By have the controller in the location because  it helps make the tug test a lot easier for me. My Delphi connectors are located behind the lower part of the dash. My wire length from the controller is about 12" / 16" total ( this is from memory ) to the Delphi connector. I used two 2 wire connectors. The reason was it saved me some room under the dash. The Delphi's came thru Amazon. I don't remember the style or series number.

Al

https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B005F8YSG4/ref=oh_aui_detailpage_o06_s00?ie=UTF8&psc=1  I found it !

[chief916]

51 minutes ago, mr. cob said:

Howdy Ben,

PLEASE post photos and part numbers as you do your install, I would sure appreciate this and I am sure others would also.  Thanks.

Dave

I sure will Sir.

[chief916]

2 hours ago, DesertMiner said:

https://www.amazon.com/Delphi-Completed-Circuits-Weatherpack-Waterproof/dp/B075LZGX4T/ref=sr_1_15?ie=UTF8&qid=1519241427&sr=8-15&keywords=delphi+connectors

Thank you Sir.

[DJohns]

I am still struggling between Direct link and the hares controller. Some groups say direct but seems like some the hayes is more old school without all the electronics.

[GeorgiaHybrid]

Dan, if your truck can use the Direclink controller, that would probably be your best option IMHO.

[Scrap]

Six pin unsealed Metripack 280 is what trucks give when there is an electric trailer brake option.  That would probably be the right connector to use for standards sake.  Female is on the truck side, male is on the controller side.  Of course be sure to use the terminal TPA's, but since it is a braking system also be sure to use the green connector lock, or CPA.

Now you just have to decide to pin it like a truck, where:

C= Brake switch

D= Ground

E = Out to trailer brakes

F= 12V unswitched batt

Or wire as a motorhome, which I don't know myself, but how this guy lists in his description:

https://www.ebay.com/i/142448862415?chn=ps

The four pin controller side is also a MP280 unsealed so buy enough terminals to build that end on your harness as well and it'll all plug right in.

 

[dan412]

I did not use the red wire on mine works fine.

[Moresmoke]

With the Hayes controller the purpose of the red wire is to turn your brake lights on if only using the manual knob on the brake controller.

If you connect it to the Jackalopee, you should have trailer brake lights, but it may not trigger the truck brake lights depending on how the truck is wired.

[lockmup68]

I hooked it up to the jackalopee, easy peasy.

 

[chief916]

On 2/22/2018 at 6:27 AM, dan412 said:

I did not use the red wire on mine works fine.

Dan...does the red light on the controller come on when you hit brakes when your not hooked up to your trailer?  Ex: bobtailing.

 

[dan412]

14 hours ago, chief916 said:

Dan...does the red light on the controller come on when you hit brakes when your not hooked up to your trailer?  Ex: bobtailing.

 

Yes the red light comes on even bobtail when you use the brake.

[alan0043]

26 minutes ago, dan412 said:

Yes the red light comes on even bobtail when you use the brake.

2X. 

Al

[phoenix2013]

Good morning gentlemen.

On most controllers the brake light connection is to source the brake lights on truck and trailer from the CONTROLLER ONLY!

Why is that needed and under what circumstances? When I owned fifths with electric brakes (not air over hydraulics BluDot system), frequently I would engage the trailer brakes only, particularly going down hill, without touching the truck brakes using the manual brake lever on the controller. If you are not touching the brakes on the truck your brake light on the truck and the trailer are not on. If you are using the the manual brake lever on the controller, the brake controller will send to the brake lights +12V signal out to "inform" the people behind you that YOU ARE INDEED BRAKING! So the most logical way to look at these is as two parallel systems doing the same thing, supplying the +12V to the brake lights circuit (truck and trailer). Therefore it doesn't matter where you tie the two together, under the dash of your truck or in the Jackalopee, either system will light up brakes on both truck and trailer.

OK couple of other things:

There are brake controllers (or there were) which utilize what they call a "power ramp-up system", these "wait" for the truck brake lights to get going. Absolute piece of garbage, good enough for pop up trailers. I am assuming that among you gentlemen no one is so cheap as to even consider this piece of crap.

Using the manual override on the brake controller should not be an "unusual" routine to anyone pulling  RV trailers. Electric brakes suck, they vary from trailer to trailer and even from pull to pull, if the fifth was parked for a while. You test manually whether the brakes are even there or whether you need to fiddle with the gain. They don't engage as quickly as the truck brakes and as robustly particularly behind the air brakes of your semi. Frequently going down the hill I would engage the electric trailer brakes manually before I would hit the truck brake pedal, why because four time in my pulling career the fifth started going around me, every time it had to do with either the controller or uneven brakes between the truck and trailer. The reason I can talk about it today is because in all of those four circumstances I hit the gas and not the brakes (or more brakes) to save my bacon.   

[noteven]

I just removed the jerk-a-matic Tekonsha my dually come with. I plumbed my Hayes so as it operates when I use the trailer air brake control (aka "Johnson bar" "trolley valve" "trailer spike" ) on the column. 

I like using what is for me the "normal" trailer brake control vs reaching for the handle on the Hayes down under the dash.

Also the "not for parking" hold position on the trailer brake control leaves the hand free for tug test, putting slack in the fifth wheel, 

I haven't test flown it on the public road yet but the binders on the trailer are getting many volts when I set the control in the not for parking park position  

My outfit also now has a "hill start aid"  ... 

 

[chief916]

5 hours ago, alan0043 said:

2X. 

Al

Ok....I guess I've done something wrong.  Only place I could put the controller was on the dog house.  It says that I may have to ground the box if it's on plastic surfaces.  I get no response from the controller other than the airbrake line will slide the knob over to the right...hard.  I'm going to try to make a ground strap and try to find a way to ground the box.  If I'm going about this all wrong.... somebody please let me  know.

Thanks

Ben

[Alie&Jim's Carrilite]

I didn't ground mine, light never worked on either of the 2 I've had.  But the controllers worked fine.

[Hewhoknowslittle]

56 minutes ago, Alie&Jim's Carrilite said:

I didn't ground mine, light never worked on either of the 2 I've had.  But the controllers worked fine.

Same here, do you have 12v to the black wire?

[chief916]

16 minutes ago, Hewhoknowslittle said:

Same here, do you have 12v to the black wire?

I do now.  The light still don't work but now the brake controller is working......bad pin connector in the metripack connector.  Removed/replaced pin and everything is hunky dory.  I will take photos of the install and post them.  Thank you to all for your support.