Pulling doubles in washington state

[runaway parents]

So dose any body know if they changed the law on pulling doubles in Washington state? Reason why I am asking I followed a one ton pulling a Montana fifth wheel with a chevy blazer tied on back. Thinking it was an out of state rig got close  enough to find out it had Washington plates. Interesting.

[I'mdonewiththis forum]

I looked but can't find anything that says it is legal to do so. I have seen a lot of recreational doubles that were blatantly illegal but no LEO did anything about them.

[runaway parents]

He probably thought it was ok so far that I new it was illegal in  Washington seems like a lot of things are changing around here. Cant  keep up with whats legal and whats not .

 

[peety3]

51 minutes ago, runaway parents said:

He probably thought it was ok so far that I new it was illegal in  Washington seems like a lot of things are changing around here. Cant  keep up with whats legal and whats not .

 

Shouldn't be hard to print out the laws from WA, as most of them should include a "last revised date" on them. Then merely compare the last revised date on your printouts with what you see online; flipping through the printouts will help you zero in on the relevant law you need.

It'd be nice if LEOs would require a double/triple trailer endorsement to do this kind of double tow.

[Darryl&Rita]

It's only illegal, if you get caught.

[Big5er]

9 minutes ago, peety3 said:

It'd be nice if LEOs would require a double/triple trailer endorsement to do this kind of double tow.

It's not up to LEO's to "require" anything. It is up to the legislature to pass a law mandating what you want. LEO's only enforce existing laws.

[I'mdonewiththis forum]

10 hours ago, Darryl&Rita said:

It's only illegal, if you get caught.

That's it in a nut shell

[runaway parents]

Can you say license vehicle registration proof of insurance? yes sir any thing you want sir please don't give me a ticket I wont do it gain lost my insurance threw blue ski insurance had a devil of a time getting a replacement.

[noteven]

Whacky California requires you to have a "doubles" endorsement or equivalent license class from your province.  Double tag tow is ok with correct hitch equipment and brakes on every axle. That was all the Internet Knowitall Database info I could get from the CHP officers I shared the outdoor lunch table with then they wanted to talk motorcycles ?

[peety3]

16 hours ago, Big5er said:

It's not up to LEO's to "require" anything. It is up to the legislature to pass a law mandating what you want. LEO's only enforce existing laws.

OK, sorry, didn't phrase that as I should have.

It'd be nice if LEOs saw that sort of rig driving down the road with an apparently burned-out taillight, and pulled it over to provide an opportunity to check license (and registration). Upon discovering that the license holder is not in possession of a license with the T endorsement, issue a ticket for improper license class for the vehicle being driven, and perhaps require that the second trailer be left behind, to only be towed singly or by a driver with the proper license/endorsement. Surely if there's a double/triple trailer endorsement, there's got to be a law requiring such for driving said combinations.

[Nuke-E]

2 minutes ago, peety3 said:

OK, sorry, didn't phrase that as I should have.

It'd be nice if LEOs saw that sort of rig driving down the road with an apparently burned-out taillight, and pulled it over to provide an opportunity to check license (and registration). Upon discovering that the license holder is not in possession of a license with the T endorsement, issue a ticket for improper license class for the vehicle being driven, and perhaps require that the second trailer be left behind, to only be towed singly or by a driver with the proper license/endorsement. Surely if there's a double/triple trailer endorsement, there's got to be a law requiring such for driving said combinations.

That's the worst possible kind of stop.  That "apparently" burned-out taillight would be plainly visible on the dashcam video, and would be grounds for throwing out any other evidence obtained during the stop.

Most states that allow recreational doubles don't have a special endorsement for them, so there's no law requiring such an endorsement in them.  And it's likely that it would be very difficult to prosecute a licensee from a state that doesn't allow doubles in a state that has an endorsement requirement.  Nonresident operating privilege is very broad in what kinds of driving it allows, just very short in the amount of time you're allowed to do it.

[noteven]

San Diego USA off road club was having a Big Weekend Rally Deal out by Salton City USA. I'm riding along gawking at the outfits in the desert and I met a diesel pusher flat towing 3 Jeeps. My first thought was "Those are good looking Jeeps!" 

 

[Alie&Jim's Carrilite]

North Carolina is another one of those tricky doubles towing states.   

If you have a license and vehicle registrations from a state that allows towing doubles, then you can tow/pass thru the state on the FEDERAL highway system.....

Once you transition to a state highway then it's illegal.  So I-40 / I-85 /I-95 / 1-77 east west north south,you're fine.... good luck finding a campground with direct access to those interstates.

[Darryl&Rita]

1 hour ago, peety3 said:

OK, sorry, didn't phrase that as I should have.

It'd be nice if LEOs saw that sort of rig driving down the road with an apparently burned-out taillight, and pulled it over to provide an opportunity to check license (and registration). Upon discovering that the license holder is not in possession of a license with the T endorsement, issue a ticket for improper license class for the vehicle being driven, and perhaps require that the second trailer be left behind, to only be towed singly or by a driver with the proper license/endorsement. Surely if there's a double/triple trailer endorsement, there's got to be a law requiring such for driving said combinations.

I would submit that this is the worst possible thing that could happen. We definitely don't need more Big Brother oversight to protect us from ourselves. 

[peety3]

4 hours ago, Darryl&Rita said:

I would submit that this is the worst possible thing that could happen. We definitely don't need more Big Brother oversight to protect us from ourselves. 

Explain to me why the bleep I bothered to get the damn endorsement then. Sorry, but I'm a little pissed here...you know what I meant the first time, and you know what I meant the second time: there's got to be valid reason to pull over a rig like that and ask a few questions, as you and I both know the odds of that driver having the correct license are a very low number. Because there's got to be an existing rule on the books for Big Brother to enforce. Maybe the reason isn't a taillight, maybe it's because they're driving 62 in a 60, or a safety chain was loose/dangling/missing, or something. And fine, if there's nothing amiss visually, let 'em go.

[VegasFlyer]

1 hour ago, peety3 said:

Explain to me why the bleep I bothered to get the damn endorsement then. Sorry, but I'm a little pissed here...you know what I meant the first time, and you know what I meant the second time: there's got to be valid reason to pull over a rig like that and ask a few questions, as you and I both know the odds of that driver having the correct license are a very low number. Because there's got to be an existing rule on the books for Big Brother to enforce. Maybe the reason isn't a taillight, maybe it's because they're driving 62 in a 60, or a safety chain was loose/dangling/missing, or something. And fine, if there's nothing amiss visually, let 'em go.

In the words of a very wise man, "I'm your huckleberry!"

The reason why you got your required endorsement was not because it is easy to drive down the road without one, when it is required.  It was not because the odds of being pulled over just to be checked is nearly as good as winning a lottery.  It is because if you get into an accident and the circumstances are such that there was control issues having to do with your vehicle, your insurance company is going to pay the other party through the nose, quite possibly refuse to pay for your loss since you did not meet qualifications, drop you and you would find yourself hard pressed to ever get coverage again, other than from one of the companies like Dairyland.

While the odds are still so great, I would prefer to buy lottery tickets.

 

[WeBeFulltimers]

The doubles/triples endorsement for a CDL is nothing more than a fundraiser for the states. I trucked for 20 years logging 3.5 million miles with MANY of them pulling doubles. If you can properly "build/break-down" a set of doubles/triples you will have no problem passing the DMV test for the endorsement. You never have to retest at renewal time like you do for Hazmat but be assured they do want the fee every time!

[Ronbo]

I know I wouldn't like being stopped multiple times a day just to check if I had my non-cdl class A license. That is harassment and is a fishing expedition. I may be retired but my time is still valuable and I don't want to spend it on the side of the road. 

[Big5er]

6 hours ago, Ronbo said:

I know I wouldn't like being stopped multiple times a day just to check if I had my non-cdl class A license. That is harassment and is a fishing expedition. I may be retired but my time is still valuable and I don't want to spend it on the side of the road. 

And that children is why the police need a reason (probable cause) to stop you. They can't just look at a vehicle and say "oh lets stop him to see if he has a license".

Or, maybe they do it like this?

[Striper]

1 hour ago, Big5er said:

And that children is why the police need a reason (probable cause) to stop you. They can't just look at a vehicle and say "oh lets stop him to see if he has a license".

Or, maybe they do it like this?

 

Big 5er, I agree, there are certain things that SHOULD be followed.  However up here is Washington State, better known as the People's Republic of Washington, the Weight GESTAPO will put a trucker on the side of the road in a heartbeat just to check him out.  And rather than inforcing the LAW, most of them INTERPET the law.  Yes it is a hard job and I would not want to do it, but I've seen them in action to many times to really have a lot of respect for them up here.  Actually had to help educate more than one during my career.  Helped having the name and phone number of a Captain in Headquarters to call on if things got to ugly in the field.

Joe

[VegasFlyer]

10 minutes ago, Striper said:

Big 5er, I agree, there are certain things that SHOULD be followed.  However up here is Washington State, better known as the People's Republic of Washington, the Weight GESTAPO will put a trucker on the side of the road in a heartbeat just to check him out.  And rather than inforcing the LAW, most of them INTERPET the law.  Yes it is a hard job and I would not want to do it, but I've seen them in action to many times to really have a lot of respect for them up here.  Actually had to help educate more than one during my career.  Helped having the name and phone number of a Captain in Headquarters to call on if things got to ugly in the field.

Joe

Joe,

I do have to say that you do have valid points there.

The last commercial truck that I owned was a part time project that I drove while working as a Deputy Sheriff for a Sheriff's Office in Oregon on a 4 day on and 4 day off schedule, running mainly the western states.

It never ceased to amaze me at just how bad the Washington weights and measures guys were, in comparison to everyone else.  I never had any personal bad dealings, other than one time when I called ahead asking about an overwidth permit, to confirm that, as was listed in thier handbook, I could obtain the permit at the port of entry.  When I rolled across the scale, the officer working the scale, jumped out of the scale to look at the tires I was hauling and came up to my window all red faced and pissed.  He yelled at me "You're overwidth, do you have a permit for that load?" As I tried to answer, explaining I was had called ahead...etc. The guy just yelled, "Park this truck and get your ass inside!!

When I went in the scale shack and the guy took my paperwork and while still acting like I peed on his cornflakes, wrote out a permit, took my 35.00 and slammed the permit on the counter and said, "You need to post this in the front corner of your windshield!"

At that point I calmly asked if I was free to go and he replied " I told you, put the permit in the corner of your windshield!  Are you stupid?

Well interestingly enough, there was another fella, in uniform at an adjacent desk and he just happened to have a patch that said "SUPERVISOR" on it.  I asked him if I could talk to him for a mi use and he was quite professional and cordial during our contact.  I calmly explained the circumstances to him and asked if possibly I had read the Washington Administrative Code or the Commercial Driver Handbook wrong and should have possibly obtained the permit prior to hauling the load into the state.  He assured me that I had done nothing wrong.  At that point I calmly asked him to explain to me then how the scale master had acted like a complete ass and he, being the scale master's supervisor, had just sat there reading a newspaper?  I also pointed out what my main profession was at the time, along with the fact that I had been a deputy sheriff in Washington for 6 years prior to moving to Oregon and that in either location, any deputy or city police officer that treated someone on the street, the way I saw his subordinate act, would not be in that line of work very long.

On my out of the scalehouse, a couple truckers who were standing in line when this transpired, thanked me....lol

That was my only encounter with the Washington boys, but I heard similar stories quite a lot.

There are a lot of folks out there who plain don't like cops, under any circumstance, but unfortunately, there are a FEW folks wearing a badge that have thier priorities askew....

[VegasFlyer]

2 hours ago, Big5er said:

And that children is why the police need a reason (probable cause) to stop you. They can't just look at a vehicle and say "oh lets stop him to see if he has a license".

Or, maybe they do it like this?

Phil, 

You're letting the secrets out!

 

[Dollytrolley]

Not sure about getting by double in Wash but best unhitch before you cross into Oregon......LEO's get a toaster and two cases of Dr Pepper for the first double pinch of the day and a two-pinch day they might get a jug of Crown Royal......just enough en-cent-ives  to lure Big5er to come to Oregon to become a Bear  after he retires from the Lone Star......

 

For the most part Oregon only has two freeways and the rest of the roads are pretty poor narrow hilly two--lanes with some 100 ft log trucks taking up much of the curves so it's not a very nice place for some long-two-jointed-RV's......

 

Drive on........(Best stay one-hitched in ..........poverty with a view (Oregon))

 

 

[Jack Mayer]

If you are commercial a DOT officer can pull you over for inspection without probable cause.....Right, Phil?   But probable cause would come into play when inspecting the inside of the cab.

The "in between" life we live as RV-oriented truck owners can cause a stop to occur - they don't necessarily know you are not commercial. But USUALLY once they determine you are not (commercial)  the "inspection" is over.

[HERO Maker]

Just like the guy who came flying out of the weigh station as we headed east on I 70 from Kansas towards the ECR this year.  Saw him come out of the "office" and jump in the car and took off!  He caught up to me real quick, didn't try to pass me but hung behind for about a mile.  Was probably the bikes on the back of the trailer that that had him end the chase.