New RV systems designs

[RV_]

Soon two new RVs are coming that have their own motors and are self-propelled so no reduction of range of any tow vehicle gas or electric. I believe they will redefine how RVs are built and come with and without motors. But the heating, cooling, cooking systems are radically new. No drapes because the windows go opaque at the touch of a switch. The stabilizers and steps all are automatic – just too many new inventions and design improvements to mention. Worth a look at what I consider the first improvement in RV systems in decades. Pricey too.

Already beginning production now - The L1 Lightship is taking orders already. It is also an all-electric RV that powers itself: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9_8W4keDWb0 

Here is the newest one, The Pebble Flow: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Qmk5lCaPvII

We towed a 36 foot 5h wheel RV for seven years of full-time living with a 1992 Dodge Ram 1 ton Diesel Dual rear wheel long bed diesel truck. It got almost 20 mpg with no load but dropped to 10mpg when the heavy trailer was being towed. So diesel and gas vehicles will lose a lot of range towing as well as EV cars and trucks, depending on the load weight and size. But those trailers had no engine or solar, just the old fashioned RV 5th wheel. The Pebble Flow above is in prototype so may be another two years before it comes to market.

 

Edited April 17 by RV_

[Lou Schneider]

So they're basically motorhomes minus a front axle and driving compartment.

[2gypsies]

Ugly....

[GlennWest]

I would not call it ugly. It is definitely different. If I was still in the market I would consider one. 

[Kirk W]

The Pebble Flow     The Pebble Flow Is the All-Electric, Stress-Reducing Camper Trailer of the Future   from Motor Trend Magazine

Dimensions

Exterior length: 25’

Exterior width: 7’6”

Exterior height: 8’8”

The Lightship L1      Tesla Graduates Electrify the RV Industry to Infinity and Beyond With Lightship L1 Camper     From Motor Trend Magazine

Exterior length27 ft

Exterior width8 ft, 6 in

Exterior height, Road Mode6 ft, 9 in

Exterior height, Camp Mode10 ft

Interior height, Camp Mode7 ft, 6 in

You best be really into the ecology and with very deep pockets since either of these small RVs will cost you more than $100,000 and you still need a tow vehicle. 

Does anyone know if Airstream has ever produced the Airstream eStream Trailer? I haven't seen anything about it for a year or more now. 

  

[RV_]

1 hour ago, GlennWest said:

I would not call it ugly. It is definitely different. If I was still in the market I would consider one. 

Same here Glenn. Aerodynamic does look different than a flat front acting like a sail. Saves some fuel or battery charge depending on the tow Vehicle.. I like the complete autonomy to boondock for up to seven days using heat or A/C, inductive cook top, coffeemaker, al at once without carrying any propane, or generators. I really liked the office desk in the  Pebble Flow prototype that turns into a Murphy bed with no hassle. no curtains with glass that goes opaque at a touch of a switch. All for the price of a top tier Airstream trailer. I may take several years but with or without motors the modern appliance designs and forward thinking use of solar and batteries is amazing Especially the motors handling braking without brake controllers, and taking care of sway and braking on a hill within the motors themselves. It's all pretty new to me.

I had to add a transfer flow diesel tank in the bed of my Ram 1 ton long bed dually to get the original range off load when towing. 

No more backing in and how about that magic hitch automatic hitching up?? 😮👍😉

Edited April 17 by RV_

[RV_]

31 minutes ago, Kirk W said:

The Pebble Flow     The Pebble Flow Is the All-Electric, Stress-Reducing Camper Trailer of the Future   from Motor Trend Magazine

Dimensions

Exterior length: 25’

Exterior width: 7’6”

Exterior height: 8’8”

The Lightship L1      Tesla Graduates Electrify the RV Industry to Infinity and Beyond With Lightship L1 Camper     From Motor Trend Magazine

Exterior length27 ft

Exterior width8 ft, 6 in

Exterior height, Road Mode6 ft, 9 in

Exterior height, Camp Mode10 ft

Interior height, Camp Mode7 ft, 6 in

You best be really into the ecology and with very deep pockets since either of these small RVs will cost you more than $100,000 and you still need a tow vehicle. 

Does anyone know if Airstream has ever produced the Airstream eStream Trailer? I haven't seen anything about it for a year or more now. 

  

Kirk the prices were in the videos for both with or without motors and just battery packs to run the systems. No generators no noise either and 25% battery charging on sunny days for the Pebble Flow's built in solar roof..

Airstream partnered with Porsche on a battery powered Trailer/RV trailer. NO prices yet However Pricey is in the eye of the beholder.

Just for comparison Airstream trailers without the batteries and with old fashioned propane and other systems identical to all the rest cost $100k and up.

Flying Cloud^® 28RB

Starting at $117,500

The 28 foot Pebble flow with all the advanced systems starts at about the same and the larger L1 is just a bit higher. But for about $20k more motors can be added for all shown in the videos. When you find that Airstream price with Batteries and self-propelled versions I'd be interested in seeing that.

Here is their page. https://www.airstream.com/configurator/tt/

BTW I just did an about face on the Ford EV Lightning. I test drove one last Friday and was impressed. the extended range XLT with everything we want is $52k before TT&L He brought it to our home to see if it could fit in the garage and no way with this house. With the hail here annually our cars are in the garage. So we are pricing Carport designs and checking the permitting and if allowed. We pretty much wanted to move anyway to a Ranch with no stairs and a much bigger garage, three car this time.

Edited April 18 by RV_

[Ray,IN]

Those are really cool! Thanks for posted them Derek.

[Kirk W]

14 hours ago, RV_ said:

We pretty much wanted to move anyway to a Ranch with no stairs and a much bigger garage, three car this time.

So you are thinking of another move? We just moved a few hundred feet to a bigger apartment and moving seems to get to be more work with every passing year. We thought we were buying our last home when we left fulltime life but that has not turned out to be the case. And we are to a point of downsizing even with the vehicles. I believe that you are about 10 years younger than I so here's hoping that health treats both of you better than it has Pam.

[fpmtngal]

I thought it was interesting that they said something about dry camping for 7 days - it almost sounds like the trailer will use more power than the solar can produce.  I’d either want more solar so I could dry camp indefinitely (as far as power goes) or have something that runs on propane.

Having a trailer with its own propulsion makes sense if you have a TV that’s undersized power-wise.  However, I noticed in one of the videos how much the back end of the TV squatted when the tongue dropped onto it - so what would be the tongue weight?  Would it overload the rear axle of the TV?  Can you use a WDH?

I’ll always cheer on these innovative trailers and their technology - my ideal would be to be totally energy independent (both vehicle and RV) and a full-timer.  Not sure I’ll see that in my lifetime.

[GeorgiaHybrid]

They obviously have never boondocked much. 7 days on the tankage they have is not going to happen. One of them uses a combined black and grey tank and neither one carrys much in the way of fresh water.

[RV_]

20 hours ago, Ray,IN said:

Those are really cool! Thanks for posted them Derek.

YW Ray. Pretty significant improvement over the old systems in my book too.

[RV_]

9 hours ago, Kirk W said:

So you are thinking of another move? We just moved a few hundred feet to a bigger apartment and moving seems to get to be more work with every passing year. We thought we were buying our last home when we left fulltime life but that has not turned out to be the case. And we are to a point of downsizing even with the vehicles. I believe that you are about 10 years younger than I so here's hoping that health treats both of you better than it has Pam.

Sorry to hear Pam is not doing well. I hope you guys are set now.
Yes we want to get another truck and drove the Ford F-150 Lightning XLT extended range and it is awesome! We can't fit it in our too short garage. They brought one to our house and Lynn drove it after I did at the dealership. She is as enthusiastic as I am and wants to move and get one so we don't get to be your age with four flights of stairs in the house like we have now counting the basement stairs.

[sandsys]

4 hours ago, GeorgiaHybrid said:

They obviously have never boondocked much. 7 days on the tankage they have is not going to happen. One of them uses a combined black and grey tank and neither one carrys much in the way of fresh water.

Depends on your conservation efforts and how many people you have. In my last van I had 40 gallons fresh and 20 each black and gray and I could easily go a week or more. I also had 400 watts solar and 400 amp hours with everything being electric except for the diesel furnace. I never came close to using all my fresh water before I found a dump because I got nervous since my sensors did not work. 

Linda

[GlennWest]

we can go a week without dumping our black tank. We have 4500 watt of solar. This time of year, not too hot, we can go many days on solar and batteries. During the 100 degree summers ac pull more and batteries will run out at night. But our camper a lot bigger than this one. That one has only 1 ac also. With enough battery I can see 7 days in it. I can't judge on water usage. We have never went days without water hookup. Should add we have mini splits for ac

Edited April 19 by GlennWest

[RV_]

Linda and Glenn, they also have to take into account the state of the art systems that use much less power or use it in new ways. Look at the storage capacity of the batteries versus the 12 volt/six volt battery AGM versus other types of batteries versus these dedicated battery packs with very large energy density.

I don't even remember what we had in our first 1990 rig for holding and fresh but it was a lot less than our second rig we only had for a year or two then sold. But we could go a week easily on our fresh and holding tanks. I believe we had 50 fresh and 30 black and 20 gray or some such.  However we did overflow the gray once and it backed up into the shower drain! With their combined black and gray I hope they have a holding tank back-flow preventer valve of some sort.

Regardless I find the actually new systems instead of the same old reefers. roof A/C units, big Propane furnaces and water heaters, very interesting. A friend of mine who repaired and sold used cars once remarked that there is an a** for every seat, meaning one size does not fit all.

Lots more info here:

"WARNING! This New RV Will DESTROY The Entire RV Industry! (Pebble Flow)"

Wow this video shows a bunch more from an experienced RVr.

 

[Ray,IN]

On 4/18/2024 at 10:40 AM, Kirk W said:

So you are thinking of another move? We just moved a few hundred feet to a bigger apartment and moving seems to get to be more work with every passing year. We thought we were buying our last home when we left fulltime life but that has not turned out to be the case. And we are to a point of downsizing even with the vehicles. I believe that you are about 10 years younger than I so here's hoping that health treats both of you better than it has Pam.

I'm sorry to hear Pam's getting worse, becoming a caregiver for your life mate is difficult, for me anyway. That IMO is what we signed up for when we married.  My wife has gotten so much worse in the last 2 years we are not able to use our MH when/if we ever get it back from the body shop. It's almost too late for us to move to a smaller house. It's all I can manage to keep up the outside work and the inside work.  I suspect our move will be from our house directly to assisted-living or a nursing home.

Lins want's to downside, sell our 40' MH and buy a smaller RV. One of these electric units appears to meet her needs; if they become available this year. At this point, whatever she wants I plan to make happen while she remains mobile.

[bruce t]

Years ago when I was involved in the RV industry I got a lot of questions from new folks wanting to know the "best" RV and the "best" setup. My stock answer was "I don't know". Simply because everyone has a different set of expectations of what the RV lifestyle is.

In our last RV, a 20ft B class, 40gal of water would last us about 8-10 days. Navy showers helped a lot. Our 200amp batteries and 200watt solar would never run out. 12volt fridge and propane only for cooking and hot water. In 4 years we never turned our TV on. Used only led lights. My point is that we went RVing for the "simple" life. Friends or ours have a 40ft pusher. They never turn off their 3 a/c units. Have 3 TV sets on all the time. She loves her hair dryer. 

It's nice to see what others have and how they live. Be it in a resort or boondocking up a dirt road. It's what makes us all different.

At 73 and bad health I do a lot of dreaming. An 8 ton 4x4 truck with a roof top tent goes around and around in my head. Camped up a dirt road smelling the smoke from our camp fire just staring at the stars.

Mind you a big DP in a resort sounds fine to.

[kb0zke]

Bruce, you nailed it with your first paragraph. What works for you may not work for me, and what works for me may not work for you.

The biggest problem I see with both of those trailers is that they are designed by EV engineers, not campers, and certainly not by full-timers. I didn't poke around on their websites much, but I didn't see much about weights, tank capacities, etc. How will these things perform on cloudy or rainy days? What about wooded campgrounds, like may State parks?

Water usage varies quite a bit. We met some Airstreamers last year that say they go 7-10 days on a tank of water, but I noticed that they were making several trips each day to use the campground facilities.  How long would their water last if they didn't use other water? Next week we're going to experiment some. Sunday afternoon I'm going to fill and dump, then we'll go as long as we can using as little water as we can while still using only our own water. That will tell us how long we can boondock.

[sandsys]

16 minutes ago, kb0zke said:

Sunday afternoon I'm going to fill and dump, then we'll go as long as we can using as little water as we can while still using only our own water. That will tell us how long we can boondock.

Testing your boondocking limits where you have full hookups available makes it less stressful. I wish I had done that because I always wondered how much longer I could have gone if I'd been willing to push the limits. I did once have my gray water back up into my shower but I never waited for the toilet to burp.

Linda

[fpmtngal]

I once had a long conversation with someone who full-timed in a sprinter van, mostly all boondocking.  He had some good insights into water management - he said he tries to use his water twice, like using dish water to flush the toilet, and so on.

The Pebble is an interesting concept, but I look at it as just that - an interesting concept.  It wouldn’t work for me for a number of reasons, but it’s going to work for others.  And in a few years they may come out with one that would be perfect for me.

I was able to go 2 weeks dry camping with 45 gallon tanks (all 3 of my tanks were 45), but that’s about it.  My new trailer has 40 gallon grey and black, 45 fresh, so I’m thinking 10 days is the max.  I did a little more than that once, but the last 5 days were somewhere with restrooms, which I used  part of the time.

[Kirk W]

13 hours ago, Ray,IN said:

That IMO is what we signed up for when we married. 

I sent a PM so that we won't hijack this thread.  ☺️

12 hours ago, kb0zke said:

What works for you may not work for me, and what works for me may not work for you.

And I probably wouldn't like what either of you do. That is the reason that the US market for RVs has so many brands and models. When our boys were growing up in Wyoming, we had a pop-up that we considered to be luxurious! It had a 15 gallon water tank, a hand water pump, a propane capable refrigerator, and lots of storage. We towed it with a 4X4 Dodge Ramcharger and did most of our camping in forest service campgrounds that were far off of the paved roads. We usually stayed where there was an outhouse (Pam sometimes insisted) but occasionally went farther out where we just found a proper bush and dug a pit. It was really great when the campground had both a toilet and a well with a hand pump! We thought that we were into the backcountry until we visited bruce-t in Australia where they laugh at what we think are boondocks! But lifestyles change and today we do not do any dry camping, even in a parking lot. 

[sandsys]

15 hours ago, fpmtngal said:

I once had a long conversation with someone who full-timed in a sprinter van, mostly all boondocking.  He had some good insights into water management - he said he tries to use his water twice, like using dish water to flush the toilet, and so on.

Things I learned about water in my Sprinter van:

3 ounces of water is enough to dampen a wash cloth to use on your critical areas between showers. When it's cold out, put the water in the microwave for 30 seconds before pouring it on your cloth.

3 ounces of water in a cup is enough to brush your teeth and rinse your brush.

A bowl in the sink will let your dampen your hands for washing then rinse them multiple times if you don't go overboard with the soap. It only takes a drop of a liquid soap to do the job unless you've been greasing your bearings or something like that. For those jobs, wearing disposable gloves removes the need for extra hand washing.

Our daughter went to an environmentally conscious camp and the sign in the bathroom said, "If it's yellow, let it mellow. If it's brown, flush it down."

If you put used TP in an air tight bag, you won't fill up your black tank as quickly.

Edited April 20 by sandsys
fix typo

[noteven]

G’day! Powered trailers with engine driven axles have been used in mining road trains in Australia for years.

[bruce t]

Kirk we would have loved to take you further into the bush and shown you "real" boondocking. But that would have required more time and a "real" setup. Next time!

For those interested in what is now quite common in Australia Google ' All Terrain Warriors Australia' on Facebook.

Another source of what is common in Australia is Molly Dixon on YouTube. Ignore Molly if you can but look at her setup. No her RV setup! Yeah I know it's hard to take your eyes off Molly but her rig is a very typical setup. No a/c. No shower. No toilets. But lots of fun.

Keep in mind that just like food, we all like something different.