Truck Has Some Issues

[rickeieio]

20 hours ago, SuiteSuccess said:

 My Davco is in the way of the starter but noticed fuel level is below rim of Davco.  Filter was changed last year and was above rim at servicing.

There's your red flag.  The fuel level should never drop.  Only way that happens is if air is leaking into filter.

[SuiteSuccess]

41 minutes ago, rickeieio said:

There's your red flag.  The fuel level should never drop.  Only way that happens is if air is leaking into filter.

Today going to redo Davco. After pondering most of the night, just going to change out ball valve, replace filter, O rings and top cap since I already have the parts. If it works good for me. If it doesn’t, points more to the electrical issue and that requires more expertise than I presently have although YouTube may help. Ran across a video yesterday discussing how to check the voltage on the modules if I can locate them. Couldn’t hurt to try.  My time is not costing me anything and I’ve got plenty of it. 

Edited May 25, 2023 by SuiteSuccess

[Deezl Smoke]

1 hour ago, SuiteSuccess said:

Voltage to the ECM has been suggested once before by someone on a phone conversation.  I really don’t have the know how to diagnose that issue so going to try everything else I can safely do myself and then if no success…off to dealer.  One bit of good news (if you call it that), I priced the tow to the dealer and it was quoted half of what I thought it would cost.  Oh well, one or two more days of getting greasy and a little blood then decision time.  Thanks everyone for the help.

 If you have a good relationship with your dealer, they would print a pin out diagram for you from the manual, that shows the pins with voltages. It is a simple thing to do, but for sure can be daunting to think about as it is dealing with a very expensive ecm to replace should things go wrong.

 Low voltage, or many loss of signal issues at the ecm will/can cause random and inconsistent dash codes. Some of them show up on a obd hand held scanner, but many do not. And to make matters worse, you can have these issues one day, and a few days later if the weather changes, the issues can go away.

 On the Davco. This is a youtube link to how the Davco works.

 If you would rather not follow links, youtube search "how the davco fuel filter works" and you will see a video put up by Davco technology. This video will explain to you how the system works and why the davco bowl is clear to view the fuel level inside.

[usbusin]

That is a great video!! 

[SuiteSuccess]

2 hours ago, Deezl Smoke said:

 If you have a good relationship with your dealer, they would print a pin out diagram for you from the manual, that shows the pins with voltages. It is a simple thing to do, but for sure can be daunting to think about as it is dealing with a very expensive ecm to replace should things go wrong.

 Low voltage, or many loss of signal issues at the ecm will/can cause random and inconsistent dash codes. Some of them show up on a obd hand held scanner, but many do not. And to make matters worse, you can have these issues one day, and a few days later if the weather changes, the issues can go away.

 On the Davco. This is a youtube link to how the Davco works.

 If you would rather not follow links, youtube search "how the davco fuel filter works" and you will see a video put up by Davco technology. This video will explain to you how the system works and why the davco bowl is clear to view the fuel level inside.

Ok latest truck update. Went over and completely redid the Davco.  Interestingly the check ball on the intake had a broken spring and the cage was cracked, so glad I replaced it.  That's why my fuel level remained low.  It was draining back into the tank.  Also saw A LOT of gunk in the bottom of the bowl so completely emptied it and cleaned that all out.  Found half the check ball spring in the bottom.  Was very fine almost like dust not stringy like previous bacteria/algae that was cleaned out when I bought the truck.  I also run biocide in my fuel every fill up.  Refilled the bowl, replaced all O rings, new filter, new top cap.  Will start for couple seconds then run rough then die.  Interesting still considering prime issue.  I can pump the manual pump several times and it will be soft, then gets hard.  Seems to me that means may still be air in line.  One more try to get wires to starter checked then off to dealer next week if no solution.

[SuiteSuccess]

Update, replaced ring connectors at battery on small wires (assume to ECM and other modules), crawled under truck searching for anything loose or broken…no joy.  Still same issue.  On bright side ( if there is one) got a quote on towing the 25 miles to dealer..a mere $750 but I was expecting twice that amount.  Hopefully something simple and relatively inexpensive.  Also on a good note, my Davco refurb seems to be performing as advertised.

[Nigel]

Carl I’ve seen that code before but I’d be surprised if yours is the same.  My truck had an e-log communication system similar to a Qualcomm.  There was a t connector on the communication port and the cable went under the floor mat to the transmitter.  When they removed the transmitter the cable was cut and the end was stuffed under the mat.  After a couple of years of stepping on it the end developed a short and threw a code.  The repair was to remove the t connection and pull out the cable that ran under the floor.  I also saw a video some years ago with someone having a similar problem with a Volvo,  his solution was to remove the Qualcomm fuse from the fuse box in the centre of the dash.  Let’s hope you get lucky and it’s this simple.

 

Nigel

 

I think this was the video I saw.  https://youtu.be/6R38pKqUq6c

 

Edited May 26, 2023 by Nigel

[SuiteSuccess]

32 minutes ago, Nigel said:

Carl I’ve seen that code before but I’d be surprised if yours is the same.  My truck had an e-log communication system similar to a Qualcomm.  There was a t connector on the communication port and the cable went under the floor mat to the transmitter.  When they removed the transmitter the cable was cut and the end was stuffed under the mat.  After a couple of years of stepping on it the end developed a short and threw a code.  The repair was to remove the t connection and pull out the cable that ran under the floor.  I also saw a video some years ago with someone having a similar problem with a Volvo,  his solution was to remove the Qualcomm fuse from the fuse box in the centre of the dash.  Let’s hope you get lucky and it’s this simple.

 

Nigel

Nigel, glad to hear from you.  Hope all is well.  As you might imagine I’ve been YouTubing and iPadding a lot.  Just found that video.  I have the same cable and setup.  Mine had Qualcomm and I once pulled back the mat and was going to take that cable loose but didn’t really know where and if I should mess with it.  Actually asked Greg Shields at an ECR and he didn’t know about it either.  Do you happen to know where the t connector is located and where to disconnect?

Below are pics of bare cab floor.  Cable runs in tread groove.  Second picture is under passenger dash with cable connections.  Will check this theory out tomorrow.

Edited May 26, 2023 by SuiteSuccess

[Nigel]

Actually it was Gregg’s guy that found my problem.  Mine was plugged into the diagnostic port above the pedal for the tilt column.  Take the grey panel off and look.  They undid the mount connected the two cables together and mounted the new one in the original spot so you may not see it without removing the panel.  Same kind of idea as when you use a t-connector for trailer wiring in your car except I think these may be threaded together.

Edited May 26, 2023 by Nigel

[SuiteSuccess]

23 minutes ago, Nigel said:

Actually it was Gregg’s guy that found my problem.  Mine was plugged into the diagnostic port above the pedal for the tilt column.  Take the grey panel off and look.  They undid the mount connected the two cables together and mounted the new one in the original spot so you may not see it without removing the panel.  Same kind of idea as when you use a t-connector for trailer wiring in your car except I think these may be threaded together.

Thanks 

[SuiteSuccess]

Not sure it adds any to the thread but my good friend dropped by and suggested we try bleeding the fuel line as a trial to see if there was air in the system.  Found the high point and using manual pump did get some air out.  Motor would turn over and catch for a few seconds then die.  Does this mean I may be lucky and it may not be a toasted ECM?  Professional help will be employed next week.

[lappir]

6 hours ago, SuiteSuccess said:

Not sure it adds any to the thread but my good friend dropped by and suggested we try bleeding the fuel line as a trial to see if there was air in the system.  Found the high point and using manual pump did get some air out.  Motor would turn over and catch for a few seconds then die.  Does this mean I may be lucky and it may not be a toasted ECM?  Professional help will be employed next week.

Did you try and start it again after the spits and sputters? 

If I left my 2001 set too long it would loose prime. I'd have to crank the starter for a bit, it would catch run for a bit and then die, repeat a couple times and then it was good to go until the next time it sat for too long. 

Of course the other problem with the Volvo motor is the oil in the wiring harness. That's what toasted my ecm. Have you had it looked at? 

Rod

ps don't remember if your motor is blue, read or whatever color a Detroit is. 

rl

 

[SuiteSuccess]

1 hour ago, lappir said:

Did you try and start it again after the spits and sputters? 

If I left my 2001 set too long it would loose prime. I'd have to crank the starter for a bit, it would catch run for a bit and then die, repeat a couple times and then it was good to go until the next time it sat for too long. 

Of course the other problem with the Volvo motor is the oil in the wiring harness. That's what toasted my ecm. Have you had it looked at? 

Rod

ps don't remember if your motor is blue, read or whatever color a Detroit is. 

rl

 

Volvo D12. Had wiring harness replaced about 6 years ago. 

[rickeieio]

After each prime/bleed cycle, it would run for a few seconds then miss until it quit.  It seemed to run a little longer the more we tried, but never more than perhaps 5-6 seconds before sputtering.  The fact that were getting air out of the system seems to prove my theory that this is a fuel issue, not electrical.  Also, after a few attempts, the engine would catch again on a second try, but not always.

One other possible clue is that fuel is leaking our of the hand primer as we pumped it.  I don't think that's a good sign, and possibly where air is entering the system.

We finally gave up due to worry that we were going to cause a premature demise to the starter.

[Sculptor]

You guys know more. But….  Here goes,  I heard the vent tubes on my gen 2 get clogged and cause fuel problems.  Each tank vent tube has a kind of a breather or filter on the end.   When the breather gets clogged or malfunctions the engine can’t get fuel. The solution is to clip the end off.  Leave the raw end hanging. 
This might be bad info or not apply to your truck, Carl. Just something I ran across on FB.  

[SuiteSuccess]

9 hours ago, Sculptor said:

You guys know more. But….  Here goes,  I heard the vent tubes on my gen 2 get clogged and cause fuel problems.  Each tank vent tube has a kind of a breather or filter on the end.   When the breather gets clogged or malfunctions the engine can’t get fuel. The solution is to clip the end off.  Leave the raw end hanging. 
This might be bad info or not apply to your truck, Carl. Just something I ran across on FB.  

Thanks Kevin.

[lappir]

14 hours ago, rickeieio said:

After each prime/bleed cycle, it would run for a few seconds then miss until it quit.  It seemed to run a little longer the more we tried, but never more than perhaps 5-6 seconds before sputtering.  The fact that were getting air out of the system seems to prove my theory that this is a fuel issue, not electrical.  Also, after a few attempts, the engine would catch again on a second try, but not always.

One other possible clue is that fuel is leaking our of the hand primer as we pumped it.  I don't think that's a good sign, and possibly where air is entering the system.

We finally gave up due to worry that we were going to cause a premature demise to the starter.

If fuel is coming out of the hand pump it's for sure time to change. Anyway that's what my mechanic said several years ago. Didn't fix my issue, but I didn't pump it anymore because I could almost always get it to start and run the second time. 

 

Rod

[rickeieio]

58 minutes ago, lappir said:

If fuel is coming out of the hand pump it's for sure time to change. Anyway that's what my mechanic said several years ago. Didn't fix my issue, but I didn't pump it anymore because I could almost always get it to start and run the second time. 

 

Rod

I'm pretty confident the hand pump is the problem.  That said, I've never worked on a Volvo motor, only Cummins and Mack, pre Volvo.

[SuiteSuccess]

Ok truck going to dealer end of the week or first of next. Went to two places that provide mobile mechanic and they listened then said they wouldn’t touch it especially if a J1939 communication issue popped up. (It did). Oh well, it’s only money, they print it every day. 

[rpsinc]

19 hours ago, Sculptor said:

You guys know more. But….  Here goes,  I heard the vent tubes on my gen 2 get clogged and cause fuel problems.  Each tank vent tube has a kind of a breather or filter on the end.   When the breather gets clogged or malfunctions the engine can’t get fuel. The solution is to clip the end off.  Leave the raw end hanging. 
This might be bad info or not apply to your truck, Carl. Just something I ran across on FB.  

Might this thought point to a vacuum issue rather than getting air into the fuel system.  If the vent is plugged then NO AIR is available to fill the tanks when the engine is using fuel.  Perhaps just remove the filter for a test and see if it runs longer?  Although I would be surprised that the short run times you are experiencing would be enough to starve the engine of fuel but priming it could force enough fuel to let the engine run for a short time as you described.

Just another direction.  Seems that it could be tested without any cost.

[GeorgiaHybrid]

Carl, most of the independent companie's  techs don't have the equipment a dealer does to solve a canbus issue. Every good dealer that I know of has one tech that is their guru with electrical bus issues. Hopefully, your dealer has a good one.

[Deezl Smoke]

 I went to the truckers report forum and searched for J1939. Interesting reading. If you have'nt already, you might do that.

[SuiteSuccess]

Have one more question for you smart and experienced folks.  Spoke to another reputable tow company in town and they are even cheaper than first quote, however, they use a stinger and tow from the rear so they don’t have to disconnect driveshaft or axle.  My bed hangs low in back so I actually think it is a better solution.  Trouble is my truck is sitting butt first in my storage site so it is not accessible from the rear.  The pictures below show my quandary.  The red device is a thing Charlie Lord told me about years ago which hooks to the nipple in the compressor line and allows you to pressurize the tanks with shop air.  So saying I can do that and release the brakes, I can pull forward with a heavy tow strap I carry and my Dodge Ram (very level ground) but using brute force will I be able to turn the steering wheel to position for the tow truck?

 

 

[Deezl Smoke]

Yes.

[SuiteSuccess]

3 minutes ago, Deezl Smoke said:

Yes.

Thanks Deezl and is the TruckersReport the correct Facebook page?  You have been a great help.