Dash cams and insurance fraud

[Newt]

I was involved in an accident a few years back.  It was the other guys fault and he lied to LEO.

I've had a dash cam ever since.  It takes pictures front and back all the time the truck is running.

 

Newt 

Edited December 13, 2020 by Newt
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[Nwcid]

We have dash cams on our work vehicles.  They have been used a lot to prove that we were not at fault in small and large incidents.  

They are very cheap "insurance".   

I do not have one in any of my vehicles now, yet it is a good idea.  I am hopefully moving to an HDT soon.  A dash cam is a must have item for me.  I see the stupid things people do around me now, and around HDT's.  

I hope I am never in an incident with any vehicle, let a lone an HDT.  I will carry insurance to protect my liability, I will dash cam to protect it even more. 

[lenp]

Have one in both cars, motorhome AND front and rear on the Harley.  Kind of fun reliving the twisty roads we ride. 

https://www.facebook.com/100010142166047/videos/1364395643908495

Hope the link works.

Lenp

[durangodon]

I bought a dash cam after about the fifth time I saw something in front of me which I wanted to share with others.  It was a moose casually walking across the road.  The camera cost me about $50.  It's not IMax quality, but it's good enough to post on youtube and share with friends and family.  That was about ten years ago, had one on all vehicles since.  The first one is still going strong and I've bought a couple more cheap ones since which are still working.

[CFerguson]

23 hours ago, Kirk W said:

So are you saying that this makes your opinion fact and everyone now needs to have one? My opinion is unchanged. If it makes you feel better and fits into your budget, that is justification enough for you to buy one. I don't feel it is important to me so that is my justification. We should each spend our money where we believe it gives us the most satisfaction for the cost. I probably have spent money on things that you wouldn't buy but that doesn't make either of us right or wrong. 

Kirk, i'm sorry if i have offended you in some way. that was certainly not my intent. I was only answering your question on the basis of my experience. I in no way attempted to suggest that anyone do anything, especially something they didnt want to do. I hope everyone will take my posts in that spirit. 

fwiw, i was a deputy in a small southern community for 12 years and was answering based on my experiences in court.

[Kirk W]

1 hour ago, CFerguson said:

Kirk, i'm sorry if i have offended you in some way. 

No offense taken  I do not disagree that the camera could prove useful, only in the priority for purchase I would give to it. If new RVers tried to go out and buy every additional item that we on the forums consider to be important, the cost could be prohibitive to many. We tend to assign priorities to what we add to the RV based on our own experiences. I happen to have entered the RV community with a very limited budget and even when I went full-time we were not in the financial position to buy every add on item that someone on these forums could point to valid reasons to have. Those cameras have come down in price a lot since I last looked at them and that could raise the position for one on a list, but what each of us believe to be a vital to have is still more opinion than fact. Everyone is entitled to their own opinion and the debate of importance can useful to readers, so long was we realize that our belief is an opinion and not everyone will agree. We do not disagree in the usefulness of these cameras, only on the importance of having one. 

[Twotoes]

Having a video of an accident that was recorded by your dash cam may be helpful with your insurance claim buy may not be admissible in a Court of Law It would be hard to prove the chain of custody after sharing it with law enforcement, insurance companies and all attorneys involved. Additionally many intersections, if that is where the accident occurred, have traffic cams already installed whose videos would be used in Court. 

[Second Chance]

2 minutes ago, Twotoes said:

Having a video of an accident that was recorded by your dash cam may be helpful with your insurance claim buy may not be admissible in a Court of Law It would be hard to prove the chain of custody after sharing it with law enforcement, insurance companies and all attorneys involved. Additionally many intersections, if that is where the accident occurred, have traffic cams already installed whose videos would be used in Court. 

From a law firm that does accident cases: "As long as dash cam footage is relevant to the case, recordings are almost always admissible in court. ... While most dash cams only record visuals, a few record audio, which is typically not admissible in court, as it is difficult to obtain the advance consent of those the audio is recording."

Rob

[GeoKat]

40 minutes ago, Kirk W said:

If new RVers tried to go out and buy every additional item that we on the forums consider to be important, the cost could be prohibitive to many.

I agree with this statement and do not subscribe to that habit. The tools and insurances that fit my needs has nothing to do with what others find important or about collecting gadgets. Finding opinions and information that'll help solidify my choices is the whole purpose of forums like this. We all share common interests despite the fact that everyone rvs their own way. 

[GeoKat]

I feel a dash cam could be a easily accessible positive. I have an app on my phone through my car insurance that gives me discounts for safe driving, shows if I use my phone while I'm driving and has accident detection. It's not a have to and I haven't been in an accident or had a ticket since I was 17 and still learning to drive but definitely gives me a little peace of mind and cheaper insurance.

 

[rynosback]

1 hour ago, Twotoes said:

Having a video of an accident that was recorded by your dash cam may be helpful with your insurance claim buy may not be admissible in a Court of Law It would be hard to prove the chain of custody after sharing it with law enforcement, insurance companies and all attorneys involved. Additionally many intersections, if that is where the accident occurred, have traffic cams already installed whose videos would be used in Court. 

Not sure what chain of custody would have to do with it. If I recorded someone getting killed I would think it would be admissible. As you have no right to privacy when in a public space. As long as the video has not been modified or doctored in anyway it will never lie. As it just records what happens with no bias.

[Twotoes]

Chain of custody is a legal term. It has nothing to do with right of privacy, which is not the issue here. A proper chain of custody is proof that the video has not been modified or doctored in any way. Absent chain of custody there is no proof that the video has not been edited and it would not be admissible in a court of law. Law enforcement may still use it for the purpose of their investigation.  

[Jinx & Wayne]

7 hours ago, Twotoes said:

It would be hard to prove the chain of custody after sharing it with law enforcement, insurance companies and all attorneys involved.

Here's how it is done.

Atty 1- Mr. X, can you tell me what exhibit A is?

Mr. X - It is a DVD containing a dashcam video recording of the crash from my truck camera.

Atty 1 - Have you reviewed it?

Mr. X. - Yes.

Atty 1 - Does Exhibit A accurately show the view from your windshield at the time of the accident?

Mr. X - Yes.

Atty 1 - Your honor, I offer Exhibit A into evidence.

Judge- Atty 2, do you have any objections.

Atty 2 - Chain of custody

Judge - Overruled. The witness has adequately authenticated the exhibit.  Exhibit A is admitted.

[CFerguson]

Folks, listen to Wayne. I have reviewed his posts in this thread and found them to be 100% accurate within the scope of my experience.

Kirk, glad you didnt take it wrong. I think the average RV might not even be able to move if it contained every gadget available. We all have different personal situations and preferences- whats right for one person may not even be a consideration for another.  There arent many things that are Right or Wrong for everyone.

I will add that audio recording consent varies from state to state. I sure dont want to go down that rabbit hole.

[rynosback]

7 hours ago, Twotoes said:

Chain of custody is a legal term. It has nothing to do with right of privacy, which is not the issue here. A proper chain of custody is proof that the video has not been modified or doctored in any way. Absent chain of custody there is no proof that the video has not been edited and it would not be admissible in a court of law. Law enforcement may still use it for the purpose of their investigation.  

I understand the legal term chain of custody. The point was I do not think police could take my dash cam if I was in an accident. I would think that they would need a warrant for that. 

[Jinx & Wayne]

2 hours ago, rynosback said:

I would think that they would need a warrant for that. 

They could probably impound it fr a day or so to protect it from being altered while they obtain a warrant.  You are correct that they would need a warrant to search it for data.

[orca]

I am a fan of dash cams ever since my first close call when a semi-tanker lost control in front of me and came into my lane. We passed so close that our mirrors almost touched! I will now not put the truck in gear without starting the camera! 

A camera will in no way prevent an accident but it will help investigators reconstruct the accident and find fault (because in every accident someone is at fault)

My current cam is the Rand McNally GPS 

[Nwcid]

I am not sure about chain of custody or how things work on the court side. 

Aa a supervisor at my last job, if one of our vehicles go in an accident we would get the key to unlock the camera from the lock box at the headquarters.  Take a fresh card to install in the camera.  At the scene, or appropriate place, we would take the old card out, install a new one and re-lock the camera.  

The SD card would then be downloaded at headquarters and saved into a mp4 format since they used their own propriety software.  The mp4 would then be put on a drive and turned over to law enforcement at their request.  

I am not sure how they were used after that but I know it saved our employees and company a lot of hardship. 

[packnrat]

dash cams are great protection. and entertainment some times.

but as to not wanting your video to be seen pocket the chip asap.

there used to be this motor bike rider ( country? not english speaking).

he posted a lot of videos of his crazy riding in traffic. could not understand one word but his cussing out every one.

one day he was just driving his car, had a accident. the other driver died. the other drivers family sued him cause of the videos. and the state put him in prison for life.

so any video of you doing crazy or stupid should never get posted online. or seen by anyone.

 

[durangodon]

Here's the one I've been using for a couple of years, on sale.  Not professional quality video, but pretty good.  Never a problem.  Not a major investment.

[Jinx & Wayne]

On 12/20/2020 at 9:10 AM, packnrat said:

but as to not wanting your video to be seen pocket the chip asap.

I'm pretty sure pocketing the chip can also get you into prison for evidence tampering if a reasonable person would know an official investigation was reasonably likely or occurring.  Florida will give you five years for that.  The feds can give you 20.  If you have a camera and the data chip/card is missing after a serious accident, "Splain that if you can, Lucy."

[palmeris]

 perhaps it was missing prior to said serious accident....

[packnrat]

the one in my ford keeps saying to reformat.  even just after i had reformatted it.