Interesting-Toyota's 2nd Warning

[Al F]

So what if EV trucks that can tow our trailers and power our motorhomes are 50 years away.  

I believe that since the demand will be there for 3/4 and 1 ton trucks and engines for motorhomes they will still keep building them.  

It is not, just the small number of RV'ing folks who want the trucks, there are lots of construction companies and farmers that need them.   Over the road 18 wheelers need the engines to go cross country.  Local deliveries probably will work fine with EV's.  Maybe the large warehouse buildings they deliver to will be installing charging ports so the tractors can be charged while the trailers are unloaded.  

While it has not been broadcast about GM going to EV's by 2035, I have seen mention that GM is not going to stop building large gas and diesel trucks for those who need them.  The news and hype that GM is going to EV's overrides the detail that if GM can make money by still building gas/diesel trucks they will build them.  Besides if GM doesn't then Ford or Dodge will.  Or they will sell the gas/diesel business off and some other named company will still build them.

None of this is happening in just one year.  It will evolve over quite a few years. 

Edited March 22, 2021 by Al F

[NamMedevac 70]

Thanks for timely clarification about HD trucks.  I also saw the super hype news about GM going all electric by 2035 which I thought was misleading BS by GM and media.  SITRIP. Situation Normal. Cheers

https://www.facebook.com/Bill-Perkins-at-Lake-Tahoe-Crater-Lake-Black-Rock-Desert-and-PNW-1061410727212374

 

[Barbaraok]

Only problem with nuclear is that we don't have a repository for spent fuel.  And it is a political problem not a scientific problem.   

[Al F]

8 minutes ago, Barbaraok said:

Only problem with nuclear is that we don't have a repository for spent fuel.  And it is a political problem not a scientific problem.   

I agree totally. 

If it ever becomes important enough, politicians (and the public) will use eminent domain to take over land in the west for a repository.  They do it all the time in cities to build things enough people feel is important.  

Don't get me wrong, I am not dismissing the importance of being able to visit certain places in the west, we love the wide open spaces much more than the forest.  If we can boot a few hundred people out of a city location we can do the same in 50-100 square miles (maybe much more) in the desert.   

While I don't know the details, I believe France recycles their spent fuel so is there a reason we can't do that here?  

[NamMedevac 70]

I heard a news report a long time ago that we are now or in future will allow other countries to send their spent fuel rods and other nuclear material to USA for storage/disposal.  There was never any follow up news on this that I am aware of.  True or Not true RV?   This was long before 2016.  Ciao.

Pilot Bill Perkins Exotic Living And Travels in Far East and S.E. Asia | Facebook

[noteven]

Norway has a large per capita electric auto fleet.

They began sytematic planning and infrastructure about 20 years ago.

[sandsys]

7 hours ago, docj said:

For example, for those who live in urban high rises and park their vehicles in multistory garages who is going to cover the cost of wiring those parking structures with chargers?  Even for those who live in suburban garden apartments who is going to cover the investment of providing chargers in the parking lots?  Will there be enough that everyone can charge his vehicle every day?

We live in a multi-story suburban complex with hundreds of apartments and underground parking. As far as we know there are three electric vehicles plugged in here and one has to park two spaces away from his plug. He used to park by the plug before the unit assigned to that spot became occupied.

However the U of M and the Minneapolis parking garages have lots of plugs for the use of people who spend their days there so not everyone needs to plug in at home or spend hours at a fueling station.

Linda

[Barbaraok]

6 hours ago, Al F said:

I agree totally. 

If it ever becomes important enough, politicians (and the public) will use eminent domain to take over land in the west for a repository.  They do it all the time in cities to build things enough people feel is important.  

Don't get me wrong, I am not dismissing the importance of being able to visit certain places in the west, we love the wide open spaces much more than the forest.  If we can boot a few hundred people out of a city location we can do the same in 50-100 square miles (maybe much more) in the desert.   

While I don't know the details, I believe France recycles their spent fuel so is there a reason we can't do that here?  

The repository is already built - Yucca Mountain.   Senator Harry Reed stopped it being able to take wastes.  It was done out of fear, not real science concerns.  

[ms60ocb]

4 hours ago, Barbaraok said:

Only problem with nuclear is that we don't have a repository for spent fuel.  And it is a political problem not a scientific problem.   

I agree and the serious accidents can be put to human error

3-Mile Island I don't recall the problem to well but the plant was built too many eggs in one basket. That is the main control cables and the back-up control cables were in the same raceway. It was all about money but MANY Nuke plants were shut-down until they could show they didn't have a problem or problem correct

Chernobyl was a cookie cutter design of obsolete technology. Then the plant was told to do something it wasn't designed to do but the Engineers say disable the alarm and continue dropping load, this happened repeatably until and you know the rest of the story. 

Fukishima build on a earth quake zone.

Man designed and build the plants

Man run the plants and man did what they were instructed to do

Man ok'ed the siting and plans.

We need small Nukes and fossil fuels to control the critical loads. And then we need some Buck Rogers age of Technology. The electric utilities have always had method to save the plant (that is matching system load to generation(s) as to maintain frequency at 60 hertz and if frequency drops, action starts dropping breakers should open and cut load). Early days the substation and the plant control room were all the together. the operator knew what substation breakers to open. As technology advanced allowing protective devices remote from the plant monitor to open breakers as needed in the advent a serious drop in frequency.

Technology advances more where utilities would control some load remotely before the frequency dropped and would return to normal automatically. This was worked out with the consumer and a special rate applied. Some large customers preferred to volunteer removing their load.

Then came the subsidized renewables. 36 years ago I heated my hot water with solar technology. For every effect there a result. If you didn't have storage you had to use electric to heat the water, so you wanted a proper amount of storage. The disadvantage turned out to be my teen-age daughters liked long hot showers thus larger water bills.

Now we have the renewable solar, wind, water & such (many mandated) putting electric on the grid. Because you can't predict what the bulk of the renewable generation will provide for output, those electric sources is not called firm generation. Here is where Buck Rogers is needed. Non critical loads like Dish washers, Laundry facilities, battery chargers,pool heaters, freezers,  refrigerators and  I'm sure the list goes could on.  Homes or equipment/appliances are not build out to for that advancement yet. 

Just like when cars started populating the country the roads weren't build so the the horses couldn't be retired as long as cars got stuck. There was a rather smooth transition in recent years from the Analog TV to Digital TV. We transitioned from trains to planes. Over the years we have gone from TV commercial breaks of one minute to five minutes over 60 years. I guess not all is bad as I don't move as fast now but I can still complain that I seem the same commercial too many times. 

So keep my power on 24/7 at a reasonable rate.

Clay

 

[Mark and Dale Bruss]

On 3/21/2021 at 11:20 PM, RV_ said:

Mark,

My vet disabilities make driving more than a couple hundred miles about my limit too.

What range do you get on a full charge with your mustang?

100% Charge is 273-305 miles on the Mach-e gauge which compensate for environmental conditions.

[Al F]

7 hours ago, Mark and Dale Bruss said:

100% Charge is 273-305 miles on the Mach-e gauge which compensate for environmental conditions.

Is there any info available about:

--  What affect does running the air conditioner in 95-100 degree weather have on the distance you can drive on a full charge?

--  What affect does running the heater in 0-15 degree weather have on the distance you can drive on a full charge?

--  What affect does leaving the car outside in the sun in 95-100 degree afternoons have on the battery?  Any affect on distance you can drive on a charge?

--  What affect does leaving the car outside and charging in 0-10 degree temps have on the battery?   Any affect on distance you can drive on a charge?

Edited March 30, 2021 by Al F

[Mark and Dale Bruss]

There are tons of into on the (6) Mach-E Forum | Ford Mustang Mach-E Forum and News (macheclub.com)

and the Ford Mustang Mach-E Forum – MachEforum.com – Ford Mustang Mach-E Forum – MachEforum.com | Ford Mustang Mach-E Forum - MachEforum.com forums.

[durangodon]

4 hours ago, Al F said:

Is there any info available about:

--  What affect does running the air conditioner in 95-100 degree weather have on the distance you can drive on a full charge?

--  What affect does running the heater in 0-15 degree weather have on the distance you can drive on a full charge?

--  What affect does leaving the car outside in the sun in 95-100 degree afternoons have on the battery?  Any affect on distance you can drive on a charge?

--  What affect does leaving the car outside and charging in 0-10 degree temps have on the battery?   Any affect on distance you can drive on a charge?

Simple answers based on my reading various EV forums for a couple of years.  Most of the EV's are now using heat pumps for cooling and heating the cabin and also for maintaining battery integrity in both hot and cold environments.  From what I've read, running the air conditioner has minimal effect on mileage range, less than what I would have thought.  In fact, many EV owners leave the a/c on while they're inside the grocery store or waiting in vehicle for whatever.  Cold weather does have a detrimental effect on battery efficiency and overall mileage range.

[Al F]

8 hours ago, Mark and Dale Bruss said:

There are tons of into on the (6) Mach-E Forum | Ford Mustang Mach-E Forum and News (macheclub.com)

and the Ford Mustang Mach-E Forum – MachEforum.com – Ford Mustang Mach-E Forum – MachEforum.com | Ford Mustang Mach-E Forum - MachEforum.com forums.

Thanks, I'll take a look.

[Al F]

For those that have replied in this thread about EV vehicles, both positive and negative, here are two videos giving some perspective on the drivability and charging of the Mustang Mach-E car. 

I found the videos very informative and interesting.  

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IMPpumtCbZQ

Mustang Mach-E - Denver Road Trip (and Charging Problems) - YouTube

 

[noteven]

I watched a live stream of the opening of the Tesla store in Saskatoon. 

Owners chatting to each other reported their range in cold weather (-25 or -30C) is about 1/2 their normal warm weather range. 

 

[Kirk W]

1 hour ago, Al F said:

I found the videos very informative and interesting.

I consider the entire thread to be so. As one who has not yet moved to even a hybrid automobile, I do accept that they are a growing phenomenon and will continue to a greater share of the automobile market, at least for the foreseeable future, I rather enjoy the pro and con debate. Both sides have some valid points. As the consumption of oil products in automobiles per mile traveled continues to drop, some means of collecting funds for highways from the people not using much or any gasoline/diesel will have to come. 

[noteven]

Kirk I understand you have some experience in ocean going hybrid electric propulsion...

[kb0zke]

I, too, find this thread interesting. We need to remember that each of us has differing needs. Yes, there are lots of people who can easily use an EV as their only vehicle. There is a place for an EV truck, too. Rural America may not be the best choice for an EV, though. Right now I'm in a town of 15,000 and we have the only Wal-Mart for over 100 miles in some directions. Assuming that people in those places have a need/want to go to Wal-Mart, how useful is an EV for them?

Now move to the RV world. We currently have a 40' motorhome and normally don't travel more than about 250 miles on a travel day. If our MH was an EV, I'm guessing that the motors and batteries would weigh about as much as the engine. When we get to the campground, how do we recharge those batteries? Could we even do so? While we prefer 50A sites, we all know that there are lots of campgrounds that have only 30A service. Does that mean that the coach would be plugged into the 30A outlet and the charger into the 20A one? How long would it take to charge the batteries?

What about boondockers? How do they recharge their batteries?

My thought is that there will always be a need for conventional vehicles, if only for those situations that simply can't be handled with an EV. Think about the fire trucks that are working around Mount Rushmore right now. Can anyone imagine those being powered only by batteries?

[Kirk W]

3 hours ago, noteven said:

Kirk I understand you have some experience in ocean going hybrid electric propulsion...

That is true, but my experience is very dated now as such propulsion systems have evolved over time, as most things do. I have a grandson doing that same job today, but like most such people, he takes his security clearance seriously so doesn't share much with me.  😊

[Mark and Dale Bruss]

Our Mustang Mach-e is our only vehicle.  We live in Mission Texas so we are about as south as you can get. 

The Mach-e is really fun to drive. 

[RV_]

This just confirmed today. Folks, Tesla will be selling the new $25k Model 2, made in their Shanghai Plant and do the beta testing in China and opening shipments to the rest of the world just after.

And Musk slipped in that full self driving will also be available in the inexpensive Model 2.

Folks got all riled over Toyota, a top ICE Age manufacturer and I posted here how Mr. Toyoda embarrassed himself first by failing after five years to personally see their electric drive train and car through. So Now it looks like you can get Toyota quality in a Tesla drive train soon:

Tesla and Toyota Are Trying for a New Electric Baby

by Allison Barfield on April 2, 2021

Excerpt:

"Tesla and Toyota might be partners 

According to Fox Business, Tesla and Toyota might be coming together to build a new electric vehicle platform. Their potential partnership has been under review since last year, but now they are revisiting their plans. 

An official from the Japanese automobile industry told a South Korean newspaper, Chosun Ilbo, that they are discussing the possibility of jointly developing a small electric SUV platform. This is slightly shocking news, as Tesla CEO Elon Musk recently mentioned separate plans to build a sleeker, more affordable electric car for his own fleet. 

If this partnership actually happens, Toyota will reportedly offer the vehicle platform, and Tesla will utilize its electronic control platform. As a result, the sales of Teslas in Japan are expected to increase. 

Combining Tesla’s unmatched engineering with Toyota’s reliability could result in a widely popular vehicle. If the vehicle features Tesla’s industry-leading software, then the vehicle will be even more enticing. 

According to Motor Authority, this isn’t the first time the two automakers have come together. Toyota was an early shareholder of Tesla but sold off its stake in 2016. In 2012, Toyota rolled out an electric RAV4 that used a Tesla powertrain. 

What’s new for Tesla? 

Aside from the possible Telsa and Toyota partnership, Elon is working on providing a cheaper electric vehicle. In September of 2020, Tesla announced it is working on new battery technology to enable the production of smaller, more affordable cars within the next three years. 

The technology should enable the vehicles to travel much further distances on a single charge. Three years feels like a long time, but it would result in a new Tesla model that starts at about $25,000. That’s quite the discount compared to the Tesla Model 3, which starts at about $35,000. 

Tesla recently overtook Toyota as the world’s most valuable automaker. According to Auto Economic Times, shared os Tesla more than doubled since the beginning of 2020, providing a market capitalization of $207.2 billion, surpassing Toyota’s $201.9 billion. 

What’s new for Toyota? 

The idea of Tesla and Toyota coming together could be very beneficial for Toyota. It’s been dragging its feet when it comes to battery-electric vehicles. Toyota has been focusing on hybrids and hydrogen-electric vehicles instead. 

https://www.motorbiscuit.com/tesla-and-toyota-are-trying-for-a-new-electric-baby/

Way more Toyota news as you scroll down. I am posting the Tesla news with pics down in investments and finance, the mini Fission Nuclear plants, and a one year review about the Tesla which includes in that video the Tesla way to punch in the trip, how long you want to drive between charges, and it routes you through. If you liked the Mustang Denver video you'll love this 30 minute comprehensive review of the facts of driving a Tesla Model Y like mine. He is dead on in the comments about the rougher ride of the Model Y, and that fit and finish were worse on the early models like mine. But he shows the times to charge and actual road trips and effects of cold and heat on it.

Musk was early on the Model Y by six months, and it looks like the same with the budget Model 2 production.

 

[noteven]

Toyota...Toyota...oh ya! That Toyota....The largest manufacturer of real world practical automobile transport and the company that made its hybrid tech available to competitors and one of the companies that put the bite on The Big Three until they finally quit marketing junk and the company that got told not welcome in NASCAR the series is for pushrod engines so stay out so they went and built one and won a couple races since and ....

anyways I told you Mr. Musk is no dummy...