Old Goat's corner. He's at it again & again & again

[phoenix2013]

Wife is looking at the Old Goat with a jaundice eye and says "what happened to your retirement" and "chasing nannies, forget it!" 

It all started few months back with this,

this morning there is an another "offspring".

And in a week or so this prodigal son is coming back for a checkup.

The rig is on the third owner and apparently required some skilled work, which turned out to be not so "skilled". Will have to have a heart to heart with the "son". Visits are OK, moving back into the spare room is not.

 

[Danfreda1]

Nice looking Kenworth 

[phoenix2013]

Took the Kenworth for a spin around the town.

Did little bit of shopping.

 

and parked it at Old Goat's domicile.

Tomorrow we are starting the prep for frame extension and prep (removing unneeded stuff), Jackalopee install and DirecLink brake controller install. Few interesting details cropped up, more on those later. As you can see there quite a transition from the street, up the driveway (flat street steep driveway). Slow approach didn't work, as the rear axle went up the middle axle just freewheeled in the air. I thought the rear axle was the driving axle and you could lock the middle, what gives on Kenworth, help the Volvo guy.

But, all the good feelings just rushed right back in after more than a decade away from semi. Offered wife to take it for a spin, she said "no way, I might want one again".

[rickeieio]

1 hour ago, phoenix2013 said:

I thought the rear axle was the driving axle and you could lock the middle, what gives on Kenworth, help the Volvo guy.

On a "live tandem",  the driving force is spread among all 8 drive tires.  On most trucks, (all 8 of the tandems we've owned), engaging the "power divider" locks the differential between the front and rear drives.  The notion of one axle or the other being the "driving axle" is a myth.

There are variations.  Our KW has a feature where I can flip a switch and all 8 tires pull together, at the same speed, regardless of traction.

Edited December 4, 2023 by rickeieio

[GeorgiaHybrid]

You can also have a load carrying axle in the rear that does not have a differential. They are fairly common for long haul road tractors due to reducing the tractor weight and allowing for a higher cargo weight.

Those are commonly referred to as a 6x2 configuration. A normal tandem where both axles have a differential is known as a 6x4. Something like a military Oshkosh with a front differential where every axle is a drive axle is a 6x6.

You can also have lift axles and tridems but those are another matter entirely...

[phoenix2013]

This is the big day,

these two will be installed in the truck, follow the process. We are counting on the help of Eric, the owner. Tommy and I were discussing the need to go under the truck to install the harness, however we decided against it, because of our advanced ages. The only way for either one of us to go under there would be with a rope tied to our ankles to egress. Our solution is to send Eric under there.

[phoenix2013]

The Old Goat made a video of the process of wiring. What's the posting sequence of the video (vs. pictures). Does it have to be on utube?

[Moresmoke]

On 12/3/2023 at 9:26 PM, rickeieio said:

On a "live tandem",  the driving force is spread among all 8 drive tires.  On most trucks, (all 8 of the tandems we've owned), engaging the "power divider" locks the differential between the front and rear drives.  The notion of one axle or the other being the "driving axle" is a myth.

There are variations.  Our KW has a feature where I can flip a switch and all 8 tires pull together, at the same speed, regardless of traction.

Also, the suspension makes a big difference on uneven terrain. My opinion, and many will disagree, the KW 8 bag suspension is not that great.  The Volvo/Hendrickson Z bar air ride is actually half decent at articulation.

The gold standard in off road performance is a walking beam/ Mack camelback design, but they come at a cost of ride quality. Neway used to build an air ride that could keep up with a walking beam, but it was heavy and maintenance intensive.

[rickeieio]

Agreed on all points. 

While wondering about a junk yard in Tok, Alaska, I looked at a KW suspension that had 1/2" or bigger air lines connecting the bags, rather than the spaghetti lines most of us have.  Those big lines would allow the suspension to react to uneven terrain much quicker.

We had three Macks on the farm, one air ride and two camelback.  Once or twice a year, those old camelbacks would shine.  The rest of the year, they sucked.

[phoenix2013]

The shop is ready to work on the 680, they installed the bison catcher,

and started prepping the rails to put rail extensions on it.

Here's the question for all you gurus. The truck had a green wrench on the display for a while. Today when the shop moved it a message came on "The engine will derate in 5 minutes". They are nervous about moving it into the shop. They are a welding shop, not a truck service shop. It has Cummins X15 with a full auto transmission (D-N-R). Someone mentioned to the customer that the wrench might be about tranny computer, it doesn't shift down "nicely" under heavier breaking.

Any thoughts would be appreciated before tomorrow morning.

 

[Darryl&Rita]

Derate points to emission equipment.

[GeorgiaHybrid]

More than likely it's the DEF sensor head. That one unit measures DEF quality, level of DEF and is also the DEF tank heater. I had to replace mine a couple of years ago. Another thing to check would be the DEF filter and make sure the injector is working correctly. 

[Danfreda1]

Had the same sensor replaced at 30000 miles but had 3 hour derate when it came on. 

[phoenix2013]

Update, local mechanic hooked his computer to the 680 and it would not talk at all to the truck computer. Local Peterbuilt is coming out Monday to try it. They suggested that with the amber wrench being on for a while we refrain from moving the truck until they diagnose it. 

[Danfreda1]

Hey Henry has there been anymore info on the et hitch jaws from young’s? When we were looking at ours a year and a half ago at the national hdt rally and found that with any pull on the jaws they opened 3/16-1/4. I fixed mine from doing that but have you found out what has changed since you were building them. The older hitched we checked stayed closed tight. 

[rickeieio]

And ours is the same.  I suspect Young's has been less than precise in the machining, thus the cobbled on "security pin" rather than just doing it right.

[phoenix2013]

3 hours ago, Danfreda1 said:

Hey Henry has there been anymore info on the et hitch jaws from young’s? When we were looking at ours a year and a half ago at the national hdt rally and found that with any pull on the jaws they opened 3/16-1/4. I fixed mine from doing that but have you found out what has changed since you were building them. The older hitched we checked stayed closed tight. 

They have new welder/fabricator on ETs and he's sharp. Last time I talked to PopUp (the sales guys) they said he knew about it and fixed it. I had the same problem when I made the ETs, but I would fix it before shipment. Two critical things drive it, the depth of the spring hole in the block and positioning of the slide box in the head welding it in. There was jig for that I made 20 years ago. It was part of all the jigs they got. Maybe there was a need for a new jig after all that time. The heads they are fabricating are much more accurate than I could make them (precision bending etc.). My problems were the cast jaws which were all over the place size wise and the guys doing the secondary machining on the jaws and blocks sometimes would drill the spring hole too deep. My trick was to cut 3/16" slug off a 5/8" bolt and drop it into the spring hole. How did you fix it?

The safety pin was a suggestion from RVH Lifestyles, apparently they have more and more customers of the type that requires signs on ladders "DON'T STAND UP ON THE TOP RUNG" and don't latch the hitch completely, not do the tug test, etc. Having the pin in avoids stupid, but on some rigs it interferes with the pin box. 

Edited February 11 by phoenix2013

[Danfreda1]

1 hour ago, phoenix2013 said:

They have new welder/fabricator on ETs and he's sharp. Last time I talked to PopUp (the sales guys) they said he knew about it and fixed it. I had the same problem when I made the ETs, but I would fix it before shipment. Two critical things drive it, the depth of the spring hole in the block and positioning of the slide box in the head welding it in. There was jig for that I made 20 years ago. It was part of all the jigs they got. Maybe there was a need for a new jig after all that time. The heads they are fabricating are much more accurate than I could make them (precision bending etc.). My problems were the cast jaws which were all over the place size wise and the guys doing the secondary machining on the jaws and blocks sometimes would drill the spring hole too deep. My trick was to cut 3/16" slug off a 5/8" bolt and drop it into the spring hole. How did you fix it?

The safety pin was a suggestion from RVH Lifestyles, apparently they have more and more customers of the type that requires signs on ladders "DON'T STAND UP ON THE TOP RUNG" and don't latch the hitch completely, not do the tug test, etc. Having the pin in avoids stupid, but on some rigs it interferes with the pin box. 

I put slug in the spring hole but did not fix it. I can see where the slide box slightly out of place could do it. I’ll put a picture of it here. 

[rickeieio]

My "safety pin" had to be inserted upside down because of the trailer pinbox.  I eliminated it and fabricated a safety chain which doesn't require cleaning the truck bed with your shirt to engage.

In my eyes, Young's needs to tighten up their tolerances and listen to someone who knows what they're doing, rather than RVH.

[Danfreda1]

2 hours ago, rickeieio said:

My "safety pin" had to be inserted upside down because of the trailer pinbox.  I eliminated it and fabricated a safety chain which doesn't require cleaning the truck bed with your shirt to engage.

In my eyes, Young's needs to tighten up their tolerances and listen to someone who knows what they're doing, rather than RVH.

X2

[phoenix2013]

Peterbilt tech found a bad NOX or knock sensor (something like that), it's by the turbo on the Cummins engine. All is good. The customer still had engine warranty in place (less than 500,000 miles on the engine) so it was done under warranty.

[GoatRoper]

It’s a Diesel Nitrogen Oxide (NOx) sensor. They are expensive. Glad it was covered under warranty.

[rickeieio]

Ours was under $400, plus $100 labor and programming.  Lots cheaper than the oil pump last week.

EDIT: price for sensor was $715.  Kinda spendy, but still cheaper than the oil pump and all the diagnostics time.  No warranty left on ours.

Edited February 17 by rickeieio

[phoenix2013]

New design addition?

[GoatRoper]

Brace for frame rail extensions?