A tractor and trailer for re-purposing?

noteven · September 6, 2015

http://www.truckpaper.com/listingsdetail/detail.aspx?OHID=5658773

Not a lot of info. Allison never made a 12 speed transmission that would fit in a class 8 that I am aware of... possibly a Freedomline automated.

Good DIY project...

Phil D · September 6, 2015

Yes, that's almost certainly a FreedomLine. While they aren't common, there are some '02 and '03 C15/FreedomLine trucks around.

peety3 · September 7, 2015

I don't like what I see. With trailer axles that far aft, you're going to have to work hard to keep the trailer generally light OR keep the center of gravity behind the middle of the trailer. Figure the drive tires have 8k on them bobtail, and they're limited to 34k loaded, so trailer + cargo needs to not put more than 26k on the pin. With the axles that far back, they're almost as close to the rear wall as the pin is to the front wall, so you'd have to get the cG about 55-60% of the way back, or otherwise keep the weights down.

It's probably also long enough that in many states you'd have to register it commercial. Aside from the usual can of worms, those axles are WAY too far back to take the trailer into CA (40' pin to centerline of rearmost axle). Some states don't care about axle position at all, some limit to 40' to center of ALL axles, but CA wants it real short, perhaps for their twisty mountain roads.

VegasFlyer · September 7, 2015

The truck is a truck tractor, they would not need to license as commercial, as long as the licensed state allows Private Truck licensing.

If the length of the trailer places it where the pin to rear axle length is beyond 40 feet, being commercial does not give them relief.

Out of fairness it is hard to tell the overall length of the trailer.

The pin to rear axle limits are due to bridge laws.

Dollytrolley · September 7, 2015

We are at our place in Bend OR for the next several weeks so I could wonder down and take a peek at the rig if it would help .......only a few miles from our place.......

Let me know or call me 520.891.3695 cell.

Drive on .........(Big RED KW...........)

Deezl Smoke · September 7, 2015

That trailer so low would severely limit your travel roads to those without RR crossings on a raised bump. That's easily as low a low bed detach, but longer.

noteven · September 7, 2015

We are at our place in Bend OR for the next several weeks so I could wonder down and take a peek at the rig if it would help .......only a few miles from our place.......

Let me know or call me 520.891.3695 cell.

Drive on .........(Big RED KW...........)

Hi Dollytrolley - if your offer was directed to us (OP) thank you very much but we are not in the market to buy at the moment. In the thread I started about a true 4 season capable trailer idea I had the discussion against such a unit being feasible has us pursuing other avenues. Hosses could walk up those ramps with a little bit of work by the way but let's keep that our secret not to mention numbers of motorcycles that would fit

noteven · September 7, 2015

I don't like what I see. With trailer axles that far aft, you're going to have to work hard to keep the trailer generally light OR keep the center of gravity behind the middle of the trailer. Figure the drive tires have 8k on them bobtail, and they're limited to 34k loaded, so trailer + cargo needs to not put more than 26k on the pin. With the axles that far back, they're almost as close to the rear wall as the pin is to the front wall, so you'd have to get the cG about 55-60% of the way back, or otherwise keep the weights down.

It's probably also long enough that in many states you'd have to register it commercial. Aside from the usual can of worms, those axles are WAY too far back to take the trailer into CA (40' pin to centerline of rearmost axle). Some states don't care about axle position at all, some limit to 40' to center of ALL axles, but CA wants it real short, perhaps for their twisty mountain roads.

Hi peety3 - if we were pursuing our 4 season unit idea (see post above) a guy would haul the trailer with a tandem tractor - weights wise. We look at this kind of unit because our home and native land allows trucks to be registered for their actual purpose including a private truck. No requirement for "commercial" if you aren't. Thanks

peety3 · September 8, 2015

The truck is a truck tractor, they would not need to license as commercial, as long as the licensed state allows Private Truck licensing.

If the length of the trailer places it where the pin to rear axle length is beyond 40 feet, being commercial does not give them relief.

Out of fairness it is hard to tell the overall length of the trailer.

The pin to rear axle limits are due to bridge laws.

Perhaps I was too quick in my typing. Yes, it's a truck tractor, so the power unit could be registered as Motorhome or Private Truck if the particular state of domicile allowed. However, the trailer looks to be at least 48' if not 53'; regardless, it certainly looks to be long enough that the rig's overall length is >65 feet, which is a common length limit for truck+trailer non-commercial combinations. Hence, my comment that it'd need to be registered as commercial.

As far as pin to rear axle distance goes, my commentary was indieed focused on the assumption that the rig was registered commercial (since it's likely to be too long for 65' OAL non-commercial). If it's commercial, THEN it's going to fall into various state's pin-axle length laws. You're right that being commercial wouldn't give them relief - in this case it'd actually give them heartburn. They couldn't go into California, and may have difficulties in other states. I believe there's an exemption for trailers used in automobile racing (i.e. NASCAR and the like) to allow 46' pin to rear axle spacing, but obviously that wouldn't apply to a commercial "RV-like" trailer.

peety3 · September 8, 2015

Hi peety3 - if we were pursuing our 4 season unit idea (see post above) a guy would haul the trailer with a tandem tractor - weights wise. We look at this kind of unit because our home and native land allows trucks to be registered for their actual purpose including a private truck. No requirement for "commercial" if you aren't. Thanks

Understood. I don't know where your native land is, so you'll have to forgive me and/or educate me. Weight wise, glad to hear it'd be on a tandem tractor. You'd have to figure out how to register and insure the trailer. If it's behind someone else's truck, you'd have to identify whether you were hiring that person to transport your trailer (in which case commerce is involved, and commercial regs are involved) or if they're doing it as a friend (to which there's probably little clear standard about how you and the friend could share the fuel cost. You could draw a parallel to the US FAA's view that a private pilot can carry a friend to a destination and the friend can share in half of the OPERATING expenses, but none of the CAPITAL expenses, but who knows how well that'd hold up.)

noteven · September 8, 2015

Hi peety3 - home base is Alberta -

VegasFlyer · September 9, 2015

Pretty3,

I would suggest you research the difference between RV and Private Truck.

peety3 · September 9, 2015

Pretty3,

I would suggest you research the difference between RV and Private Truck.

I surrender. Noteven, I suggest you ignore every word I've typed in this thread, as apparently I'm a clueless loser.

noteven · September 9, 2015

Hi peety3 - your commentary and the others will be useful to readers looking at unconventional rigs depending on what registration rules they fall under. As I said I posted the link in case a unit like that one interested someone.

VegasFlyer · September 10, 2015

I surrender. Noteven, I suggest you ignore every word I've typed in this thread, as apparently I'm a clueless loser.

Peety3,

I am sorry if a simple suggestion offended you. Your prior post shows that you may be confusing what a Private Truck is when you keep stating that the length laws are at one standard for commercial and another for non commercial or RV.

In every state that I have seen that has a Private Truck category, you declare a gross weight for the truck at the time of registration and can then haul any non commercial load that you own with any legal trailer for that truck. If you have a truck tractor Private Truck, you could legally haul a 53 Foot trailer. The 65 foot RV limitation does not apply to a Private Truck.

A Private Truck is similar to a Farm Plated Truck, with the Farm Plates usually having more restrictions.

I am not writing this based on a bit of Internet research, I have owned trucks that have been registered commercial, farm and private and have written citations to people that didn't get it right.

Phil D · September 10, 2015

The 65 foot RV limitation does not apply to a Private Truck.

Most states still have overall length regulations on the books, even though commercial rigs on the National Network and designated feeder roads are exempt. They are still enforced for non-commercial rigs, regardless of how they're registered.

If a state sets an overall length limit that is specific to recreational vehicles, then yes, vehicles registered as a private truck would be exempt from that requirement when bobtail, but may or may not be when towing, since the combination is still recreational because it would include the trailer. If, however, the original overall length limit is still on the books, as is the case in most states, a combination involving a private truck would still be subject to that limit. That being the case, and with vehicle and combination lengths not being reciprocal between states, length laws become irrelevant when deciding how to register a retired truck tractor for recreational use.

VegasFlyer · September 11, 2015

Phil,

If you want to be technical, the states that have the reduced overall length limits, like California, could enforce those laws for all trucks that are not within the National Network area, regardless of whether they are commercial, non- commercial or RV.

The main point I was trying to make is that quite a few folks on here have either forgotten or did not realize that a Private Truck is not necessarily the same as an RV. The other point is that there is a big difference between an HDT with any sort of bed and a Truck Tractor. There are several states that have reduced overall lengths for RV's, if you read the verbiage it nearly always specifically says recreational vehicles, not non commercial. In a case like that, the RV limitation does not apply to a private truck.

Dollytrolley · September 11, 2015

Phil,

If you want to be technical, the states that have the reduced overall length limits, like California, could enforce those laws for all trucks that are not within the National Network area, regardless of whether they are commercial, non- commercial or RV.

The main point I was trying to make is that quite a few folks on here have either forgotten or did not realize that a Private Truck is not necessarily the same as an RV. The other point is that there is a big difference between an HDT with any sort of bed and a Truck Tractor. There are several states that have reduced overall lengths for RV's, if you read the verbiage it nearly always specifically says recreational vehicles, not non commercial. In a case like that, the RV limitation does not apply to a private truck.

Example........ 45ft for RV in Oregon.......Period........no slack on that one.......

Drive on...........(Past 45ft RV.....so sorry0