From 11 to 6 to 3, 5th Wheels - Eeny, Meeny, Miny, Moe

[Nomad Hiker]

We've come a long way baby, but we still have a ways to go! After going to the Pamona, CA RV show in mid-October for 3 mind-numbing days, doing a plethora of research and more planned, AND traveling to 4 RV dealers in Arizona and California yesterday and today, we have narrowed our search for our 1st 5th wheel to 3. The Montana 3720; the Solitude 384 GK, and the VanLeigh Vinlano 365RL. We have done more research on the Montana and the Solitude since the Vilano just appeared on our radar as one to look at within the last week. We know the history of the Vilano, we know it just came out in 2015 so is relatively new. I'm guessing there won't be a lot of research out there so I'm hoping someone here has one or knows someone who does. We are choosing these 3 as our finals as they have many of the features we want. So now, I'm asking for any feedback you want to send my way! Thanks in advance!

 

Nomad Hikers

[Capt Frank]

I just looked at the Vilano for the first time today. I gotta admit, I really liked it!

 

Frank

[Nomad Hiker]

Ya, it's pretty nice looking Frank!

[sandsys]

I vote for the Grand Design Solitude.

 

I compared only floor plans.

They all had straight on TV viewing.

They all had good access to fridge when slides are in.

They all had a coat closet.

The Montana looked like slides in could block access to bathroom.

The Solitude had the best kitchen counter space.

The Solitude had those wonderful pull out trash cans.

The Solitude had a desk!

 

I spend hours every day at my desk. So, for ME, the Solitude wins the best floor plan contest.

 

Linda Sand

[Big Greg]

My two cents is take a close look at something folks often don't, I learned the hard way. Examine the suspension system. Axles 6K, 7K, 8K. The MOR/ryde IS would be even better. 17.5" H rated tires are great and dependable. Disc brakes for better stopping and reliability. An auto leveling system if you plan to travel a lot. Greg

[Second Chance]

My two cents is take a close look at something folks often don't, I learned the hard way. Examine the suspension system. Axles 6K, 7K, 8K. The MOR/ryde IS would be even better. 17.5" H rated tires are great and dependable. Disc brakes for better stopping and reliability. An auto leveling system if you plan to travel a lot. Greg

 

 

I vote for the Grand Design Solitude.

 

I compared only floor plans.

They all had straight on TV viewing.

They all had good access to fridge when slides are in.

They all had a coat closet.

The Montana looked like slides in could block access to bathroom.

The Solitude had the best kitchen counter space.

The Solitude had those wonderful pull out trash cans.

The Solitude had a desk!

 

I spend hours every day at my desk. So, for ME, the Solitude wins the best floor plan contest.

 

Linda Sand

 

We full-time in a Grand Design Reflection (the "little sister" to the Solitude series). So - on that count - I'll agree with Linda. That said, the Lippert components are the weakest parts of the Grand Design RVs... especially the suspension and brakes. As someone said on one of my many forums, solid axles and leaf springs with no shocks amounts to my grandfathers' suspension system (and both of my grandfathers were born in the late 1800s). For that reason, we had the suspension and brakes replaced, as Greg suggested, with the MOR/ryde independent suspension and disk brakes. What a difference in ride, stability, stopping ability, and confidence! (We had already upgraded to load range G Sailun tires and replaced the solid Lippert pin box with a Demco Glide Ride.)

 

My wife and I just rehashed the "What would you change about our rig if we were to do it all over again" conversation. Other than the things mentioned above, we would not change a thing - especially regarding the floorplan. We like everything about it. Grand Design customer service is, at this point in time, among the best in the industry, too.

 

Rob

[artywoof]

Montana 3720: The W/D area is big allowing for internal storage of lots of things and even hampers in those closets, since the hall for W/D is opposite the walk area for the Bed you have to squeeze around the corner of the bed to walk to the front closets, technically there is a second vanity one in bathroom the other in bedroom allowing for separation of stuff, counter space between fridge and pantry is very narrow and the overhead cabinets may impede your vision to cook in the small area, in the big picture I think the wardrobe in the entrance is kinda ugly but could store lots of little things that are easy to access, windows on the kitchen W/D side are all very small ones, Living TV seem quite big. Has out door TV.

 

Solitude 384 GK: Hall from steps to front closet is open flow since the dresser is a slide out creating better living open space, sink in bathroom slides out creating more open feeling (but is that an issue to have plumbing in a slide for freezing?), Desk is ok small but to me small but there is one, the overhead cabinets at the stove are in a U shape giving more viability and there is a window there for more light, Pantry is likely bigger, Living TV seems smaller.

 

VanLeigh Vinlano 365RL: Hall from steps to front closet is open flow since the dresser is a slide out creating better living open space but the dresser in bedroom impedes walking a bit, no carpet except in the bedroom closet and dinning slide, Linen in bath might be difficult to get to over toilet, only one entrance to bath (I prefer give bath more space rather than loose a wall to a two doors), counter with stove is the smallest space to work in, one pic shows a Dish Washer on end of island not noted in floor plan, Pantry is huge maybe to huge the stove counter could have been bigger, the Hutch area is kind a waist of space to me, NO W/D hookups noted in floor plan but features says its prepped?, retractable desk at TV is cool if you only have a laptop that can be moved easily. To me the cabinetry is very boxy and non of them have glass fronts or design of any kind, kinda modern style but to me seems plain.

 

I would go with the Solitude 384GK

[Nomad Hiker]

Thanks for all the input. When I can figure out how to "quote" I will so you know what I'm responding to. Big Greg (Rob L) yes, we agree. My husband is an engineer so we definitely have the finer points that you mentioned covered! Artywolf, thanks for all your feedback. Some of the things you mentioned works for us and some don't. We agree about the boxiness and lack of glass on the Vinlano and it is a bit "plain" compared to others, however; we love the functionality. We have a "likes & dislikes" list of the ones you commented on and this one is ahead even with it's plain jane look. We don't "think" 2 doors to the bath will be an issue and my husband actually prefers that, but again we are newbies so we may say down the road "Artywolf told us so"! . Yes, there is a washer/dryer hook-up in the Vinlano. We don't know if we want a W/D. So we will start out without it, but certainly want the prep. We will not get the DW but will have the cabinate space instead. The pantry is perfect for 2 cooks.

[Big Greg]

If you haven't already spend a day (at least several hours without a salesperson) pretend living in the units you like, get in/out of the shower, try the bed and walk around it, sit at the table, relax in the chairs and look at the TV, pretend cooking a meal in the kitchen, access the basement storage, check were the water heater, furnace, converter, batteries are located for maintenance, use the roof ladder. These things helped us decide between a motor home and the fifth wheel we liked. Greg

[sandsys]

I like to sit in what I think will become "my" chair and read whatever manuals are available. That keeps me in the chair long enough to know if it will be comfortable beyond it just feeling great to sit down for a minute.

 

Linda Sand

[kb0zke]

Maybe I missed something, but I couldn't find anything on the VanLeigh site about construction. That bothers me. As Big Greg said, the "foundation" is the important part. Look at the tires, axles, brakes, and frame. Just for grins, look at an Elite Suites or New Horizons in those areas. You may not be able to afford one of them new, but I would think that for what one of the three you mention would cost you could get one of those two that is only a couple of years old. It may not have a warranty, but most of the issues would be taken care of. I'm assuming that you are thinking about a full-time coach.

 

One of my pet peeves is skimping on the axles. A fifth wheel should have 20-25% of the weight on the pin, so some manufacturers use that 25% number to figure the axles. For example, a trailer with a 16,000 pound GVWR should have 3200-4000 pounds on the pin. The manufacturer will use the 25% (4000 pounds), leaving 12,000 for the axles. Two 6000 pound axles takes care of it. What happens if only 3200 pounds is on the pin? The axles are overloaded by 400 pounds each. That may not cause a problem for a year or two (until the coach is out of warranty), and then the axles fail. Guess who is stuck with the bill? I'd suggest that you look at the axle capacity and make sure that the axles are rated for somewhat OVER what they are expected to normally handle.

[Nomad Hiker]

If you haven't already spend a day (at least several hours without a salesperson) pretend living in the units you like, get in/out of the shower, try the bed and walk around it, sit at the table, relax in the chairs and look at the TV, pretend cooking a meal in the kitchen, access the basement storage, check were the water heater, furnace, converter, batteries are located for maintenance, use the roof ladder. These things helped us decide between a motor home and the fifth wheel we liked. Greg

 

 

One of my pet peeves is skimping on the axles. A fifth wheel should have 20-25% of the weight on the pin, so some manufacturers use that 25% number to figure the axles. For example, a trailer with a 16,000 pound GVWR should have 3200-4000 pounds on the pin. The manufacturer will use the 25% (4000 pounds), leaving 12,000 for the axles. Two 6000 pound axles takes care of it. What happens if only 3200 pounds is on the pin? The axles are overloaded by 400 pounds each.

Thanks guys, my husband is an engineer (we had a clipboard with questions !), and while we have never owned an RV, we did quite a bit of research and we did ask many of the questions you posed (especially axels, tires, pin weight etc) and if not comfortable with the standard equipment, we upgraded. We talked construction, insulation, H20 tanks etc. We sat in some Rv's so long that the dealers thought we were "homesteading"!!! We had no problem asking the sales people to leave us alone for a while. We cooked, we cleaned, we got the clothes from the closet! Yes, we even tried the shower AND the toilet..well, NOT literally! We sat in a LOT of RV's, and had about 3 that we spent time in or went back and visited multiple times. Having done that, this is the one that was within our price range that we felt "fit' us the best and was a nice quality. It is ordered, and while I'm sure we will have some surprises, we feel pretty good about it!

[Nomad Hiker]

I like to sit in what I think will become "my" chair and read whatever manuals are available. That keeps me in the chair long enough to know if it will be comfortable beyond it just feeling great to sit down for a minute.

 

Linda Sand

Hi Linda, this one has the theater seats, and I probably like them better than my husband does as he likes softer chair and I need firmer due to my back. I can tell in about 10 minutes if a piece of furniture is going to be a problem. The chairs were low on our list as we knew they could be sold and replaced, but I think we will be fine. Of course, they have to get our imprint in them first! Hopefully, they will be good for the long-haul!

[Yarome]

I guess I'm with Linda. I would go for the Solitude floorplan. Just noting the differences that stick out to me.

- Roomier bathroom and bedroom layouts
- Free standing dinette (aka, easily convertible space)
- "smoother" more natural transitions to different living spaces
- Countertop space

- Dishwasher prep (power and water for disherwasher/icemaker/wine cabinet/beer cooler etc)
- Slightly higher cargo capacity

Don't like..
- W/D hookup placement

The Montana likes..
- W/D hookup/storage area
- Immediate door entry wardrobe

Don't like..
- Pretty much the opposite of my likes on the Solitude.

Vinlano..
- The outside is very sleek, but the floorplan would be a 3rd choice. I would be a little concerned about a newer startup when it comes to support/warranty work, and if their business plan is going to be successful in the long term.

Of course there are a multitude of other considerations. Both suspensions are "marginal" in my book. The good thing is that a suspension system is easily changeable... you're stuck with the floorplan for "life".

[Nomad Hiker]

I guess I'm with Linda. I would go for the Solitude floorplan. Just noting the differences that stick out to me. - I'm not a desk person so that was wasted space for me. I can use kitchen table. Which I would prefer free-standing table, but we don't use anyway.

 

- Roomier bathroom and bedroom layouts - Actually up close and personal the Vilano has more bedroom space between end of bed and dresser, but a little less bath space as noted. Again because I'm short, I didn't like the above counter Bowl type sink in the bath of Solitude. Very hard for me to wash my face and brush my teeth.

- Free standing dinette (aka, easily convertible space)

- "smoother" more natural transitions to different living spaces - I did like the hall closet in the Montana with the W/D hook-up. Agree Vilano W/D not as convenient. We don't plan to have W/D at this point. We may of course change our mind and I will have to deal with it.

- Countertop space - I did sacrifice a little (not much) counter space for bigger pantry. I'm a cook and a vertically challenged one so in Montana and Solitude, I had problems reaching most cabinets without of stool.

- Dishwasher prep (power and water for disherwasher/icemaker/wine cabinet/beer cooler etc) - Had the option for D/W prep(still possible to add), but opted for cabinet space.

- Slightly higher cargo capacity

 

Don't like..

- W/D hookup placement - agree

 

The Montana likes..

- W/D hookup/storage area

- Immediate door entry wardrobe- not sure what this means. I think both closet entries were the same. There have been some changes not indicated on floor plan of Vilano - my pet peeve were the closets with the dyson that encroached on the space and that had a center divider...didn't like those at all.

 

Of course there are a multitude of other considerations. Both suspensions are "marginal" in my book. The good thing is that a suspension system is easily changeable... you're stuck with the floorplan for "life". Agree, we did go with Vilano as it seemed to fit how we live better. We did upgrade suspension and would have on all of them.

 

Thanks for taking time to respond!

Ginger AKA Nomad Hikers

[Yarome]

we did go with Vilano as it seemed to fit how we live better. We did upgrade suspension and would have on all of them.

 

That's great! Congratulations.

It just goes to show.. what might be perfectly suitable and appealing to one person might make another's life a pain in the rear.

 

It's clear you've done your homework. Hope you enjoy your new digs. Now comes the fun part.. moving in and getting your "flow" down.

[Yarome]

 

- Immediate door entry wardrobe- not sure what this means.

 

 

I just meant that the entry wardrobe/closet was immediately by the door. It's nice to drop your dirty boots or wet coat just as you step in rather than having to move them across the hallway... or grab that coat you forgot without having to step inside with muddy feet.

[Nomad Hiker]

 

I just meant that the entry wardrobe/closet was immediately by the door. It's nice to drop your dirty boots or wet coat just as you step in rather than having to move them across the hallway... or grab that coat you forgot without having to step inside with muddy feet.

Gotcha!

[Nomad Hiker]

Thanks Yarome!

[sandsys]

That's why I always say this is what would work FOR ME. We all have different preferences which is what makes this world such a wonderful place! I'm glad to hear you figured out what would work best for you.

 

Linda Sand

[Nomad Hiker]

That's why I always say this is what would work FOR ME. We all have different preferences which is what makes this world such a wonderful place! I'm glad to hear you figured out what would work best for you.

 

Linda Sand

Ain't it so girl! Ain't it so!