Jump to content

Why hydrogen fuel could succeed where natural gas failed


RV_

Recommended Posts

Back at the turn of the century I was excited about the Honda and Toyota hydrogen vehicles being tested and shown in Southern California. They died down and Tesla with its EVs took my whole attention from 2003 on.

 

Now that expensive alternate fuel vehicles are coming closer to parity with the highest oil prices of recent times, Toyota is making a big push with its Mirai Hydrogen fuel cell vehicle which they claim will get 320 miles per fill up. I now agree that the lack of infrastructure will be a big roadblock to acceptance. Just imagine if the world had used EVs for the past hundred years exclusively and gasoline ICE vehicles came along today. They would never get traction even though the pollution would be an unknown. Why? Because unlike EVs there are no already existing home gasoline pumps and stores like we have electricity.

 

However, the oil interests may see this as a possible sidetrack to sell their natural gas to be turned into hydrogen. That alone might engender some initial support.

 

This Motley Fool article shows the ignorance of the writers of investments articles but it is better than most. He goes from mentioning that making hydrogen is simple using water and electrolysis. He says that :

 

"Hydrogen can also be a cleaner fuel source than any other in the world today, even though most current hydrogen is made from natural gas. In the U.K., ITM Powerhas demonstrated hydrogen fueling stations powered by wind and solar energy, making its hydrogen extremely clean.

 

Natural gas is cleaner than burning oil, but it's still a fossil fuel, and electric cars are charged with coal and natural gas, which still account for a vast majority of electricity in the U.S. Hydrogen might be the cleanest fuel option available."

 

I don't think he realized the contradiction in claiming natural gas and coal making the electricity for EVs but that hydrogen can be made by clean solar powered electrolysis plants and I don't doubt that. Then they want to go and make the hydrogen not made from coal and natural gas to be made into electricity.

 

Think of it this way: Water and solar electricity > hydrogen - hydrogen then compressed using more solar electricity > liquid hydrogen.

 

Then you have the issue of building a whole new infrastructure for fuel stations.

 

Instead how about this: Water and solar electricity > hydrogen, then hydrogen makes electricity for the cars and everything else.

 

It would still take a few decades to transition and once it starts the rest will come with R&D for trucks and buses too. Much easier to do the interstate truck routes only than to provide hydrogen fueling at every place we now have gas stations. But for the folks who want to maintain control over our energy and charge us, it is too easy for us to make and compress our own hydrogen for each house or block and use fuel cells for power as needed for vehicles and homes. Ballard energy had one the size of a 6X8 enclosed utility trailer and the gas can be compressed to usable pressures in a regular propane tank as used for mobile homes all over the south. I spoke to an engineer with Ballard back in 2000 - 2003 and he said the hydrogen home system was working but dropped for no good reason above his pay grade. We had Mike Stritzki's Hopewell project in New Jersey ten years ago that produced its own hydrogen and solar and storage on the property and the house was off the grid. http://hopewellproject.org/pages/project.html

 

If you still doubt that it can be made safely and stored watch Mike show you in this 2006 9 minute video. He also covers why it is being resisted by the energy barons, once built, it is free, no money to gouge, no markets commodities to manipulate. It is coming.

 

Here is the article by Motley Fool published at Business Insider I quoted above: http://www.businessinsider.com/why-hydrogen-fuel-could-succeed-where-natural-gas-failed-2016-10

 

Here is Toyota's Mirai page:

https://ssl.toyota.com/mirai/fcv.html?&srchid=sem%7c%7cMirai%7cSegment_Mirai_Hydrogen%7cHydrogen_General%7c%7c&gclid=CNH6hrPA3c8CFaqhMgod524MUQ&gclsrc=ds

 

Lots of investment opportunities coming up as brown hydrogen made with fossil fuels might tempt some of the oil interests briefly. But we all see where it will and must go. Free, cheap, non polluting renewable energy for everyone. It is possible and probable now.

RV/Derek
http://www.rvroadie.com Email on the bottom of my website page.
Retired AF 1971-1998


When you see a worthy man, endeavor to emulate him. When you see an unworthy man, look inside yourself. - Confucius

 

“Those who can make you believe absurdities, can make you commit atrocities.” ... Voltaire

Link to comment
Share on other sites

BTW,

We have seen solar running calculators forever for free once purchased. Currently we are making our devices in every field more efficient. So efficient as to have been inconceivable even ten years ago.

 

Ten years ago we would not believe a full blown Windows computer, the size of today's tablets, being so efficient it can run with 1080p HD graphics and a touch screen for ten hours on a charge, streaming movies better than in theaters resolutions on demand? Running off a rechargeable built in battery?

 

Who would have thought we would have 65" "view screens" like the bridge of the Starship Enterprise fictional viewer for real in our homes? My 65" 4k 2015 obsolete viewer is only an inch thick and 60 pounds light. Or flip and smart "Communicators" first flip like the ones on Star Trek, then morphing into phones and then tablets which were using the same limited processors and OS' as phones and today tablets that are slimmer and lighter that run the same OS in full and all the programs in a thin ultralight tablet as my Windows 10 desktop.

 

To me, the biggest thing being economized now that is going through R&D for lowering initial costs is magnetic refrigeration. GE is ongoing and now making them.

 

For the engineers:

 

The key is not making bigger batteries or electric motors. It is making more efficient batteries, devices, and motors - and changing our thinking.

 

Funny how the initial resistance to EVs was a perception of them as slow and limited in range. No one expected a Porsche eater at 75% of the cheapest 911 price. No one expects the Model 3 to succeed either or even be produced.

 

I find it funny that the resistance isn't so much against EVs anymore, It seems to be against Musk for daring to challenge their notions of how the world works. The same folks who boo Telsa cheer every other possible competitor making an EV.

 

Or making a hydrogen fuel cell vehicle.

RV/Derek
http://www.rvroadie.com Email on the bottom of my website page.
Retired AF 1971-1998


When you see a worthy man, endeavor to emulate him. When you see an unworthy man, look inside yourself. - Confucius

 

“Those who can make you believe absurdities, can make you commit atrocities.” ... Voltaire

Link to comment
Share on other sites

So how do we overcome the fueling station problem with hydrogen? For those of us with a house on our own lot, electricity and water, we can fuel our own cars:

 

That has been done. Now refine and mass produce. Voila, hydrogen without fossil fuels to produce it.

 

Granted it won't work for the city folks at first. But solar and wind can already generate the electricity for their hydrogen and EV transportation use.

RV/Derek
http://www.rvroadie.com Email on the bottom of my website page.
Retired AF 1971-1998


When you see a worthy man, endeavor to emulate him. When you see an unworthy man, look inside yourself. - Confucius

 

“Those who can make you believe absurdities, can make you commit atrocities.” ... Voltaire

Link to comment
Share on other sites

The truth about solar?

RV/Derek
http://www.rvroadie.com Email on the bottom of my website page.
Retired AF 1971-1998


When you see a worthy man, endeavor to emulate him. When you see an unworthy man, look inside yourself. - Confucius

 

“Those who can make you believe absurdities, can make you commit atrocities.” ... Voltaire

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Archived

This topic is now archived and is closed to further replies.

×
×
  • Create New...