phoenix2013

Interesting developments in the industry. https://www.google.com/search?sca_esv=3564cec2bd599925&rlz=1C1CHBF_enUS918US920&tbm=vid&sxsrf=AM9HkKnCNYI7kAibUJfesEu4kgVnbPKMZw:1699714656350&q=trailer+sway+control&sa=X&sqi=2&ved=2ahUKEwiBsb7CmryCAxXWVTABHQhnDDUQ8ccDegQIPBAJ&biw=1536&bih=715&dpr=1.25#fpstate=ive&vld=cid:cc16b255,vid:K-sNjpsdUk8,st:0 Basically boils down to the system recognizing that you are going too fast for the way you loaded the trailer and slow your ass down.

The owner is reading this thread, perhaps he can answer. Incidentally the other rig which part of discussion has Moryde suspension which provides different suspension reaction and is higher off the ground (Moryde requirement). I don't believe he carries the same load in the garage. There is also an issue of the the hitch locations. Copy of his email to me below. Henry, I did read the article. It is accurate. I am still nose low on my trailer. I have spoke to DRV, it is like pulling teeth, but I finally got them to tell me what hitch height is to make the trailer level. That number is 51 inches. My et hitch is at 48 inches but my truck settles 1 inch when I hook the trailer up. Some people tell me is should not settle at all. What are your thoughts about it settling? If I don’t worry about the truck settling, I can raise my hitch 4 inches. I have room to do that in the frame rails. Everyone says nose low will add hitch weight. They also say trailer must be level. If I level the trailer is my pin weight going to get lighter? Have you give any more thought to “tricking the et to make it think I have more pin weight”?

The subject of proper loading and designing trailers has been discussed ad infinitum, but new examples keep popping up. Spent considerable time with couple of gentlemen, both own DRV Full House rigs, almost identical with the exceptions of the axle suspensions, one behaves on the road the other one does not. The other subject discussed ad infinitum is the need to have sufficient pin weight in your fifth for proper tracking, handling and balance, 20% of the GVW being the "magic gate". 20% or more good, less than 20% not good. The industry has been in the "not good" territory for a long time. Greed and the need to sell enormous fifths to guys with pickups driving it. The reason I got intrigued and involved with this rig, because it's a Dr. Jekyll and Mr. Hyde. Driven with an empty garage it's a perfect Dr. Henry Jekyll, when the owner loads his RZR in the garage it turns into Edward Hyde. Anything over 60 mph and the rigs starts swaying all over the road. Normally when figuring out the pin weight of the fifth I ask for two CAT scales readings, one with truck only (front and rear axle), the other with truck and trailer (truck front and rear axle and trailer axles). In this instance I asked for three CAT scales readings, one with truck only, the other with truck and trailer but no RZR and truck and trailer with RZR. The owner delivered the other day. Here's the math No RZR (middle ticket) Truck rears 15840-10620= pin weight 5220 5220 pin + 18180 trailer axles = GVW of 23400 5220 pin is 22.3% of 23400 GVW, nice Dr. Jekyll With RZR (end ticket) Truck rears 15020-10620= pin weight 4400 4400 pin + 21560 trailer axles = GVW of 25960 4400 pin is 16.9% of 25960 GVW murderous Henry Hide Without the RZR it's a very well balanced rig, load RZR into the garage and it takes off 820 pounds off the pin weight and into ugly territory, anything under 18% can turn ugly going down hill and braking, down hill, braking and in the rain, too fast, etc. The moral of the story is that the toy haulers garages are not designed for serious loads, why? They got the axles in the wrong locations. And, longer the rigs, worse the problem. There is an industry that has gotten it right. Regardless of length, look where they placed the axles, where the load is. Regardless how many tons of horses you load, the pin weight will stay the same, or maybe increase some. It must be that the "horse sense" hasn't made it yet to the RV guys.

https://www.amazon.com/stores/page/7CC23844-DA55-4501-B30B-D7CDE25CD410?ingress=2&visitId=8f42bde8-ee6e-444f-9466-8b30d04c02c2&ref_=ast_bln He bought them on Amazon. I killed the first two Chrysler vans hauling stuff. I promised this one semi retirement and limited use and longevity for its use as a hearse on my final RVing trip.

12' long, 16" wide, over 70 lbs. bit heavy for my taste, some sort of wheels/rollers/gliders/etc. needed. Mounting will also require a design effort.

Got a call from an individual this morning, "is this technical support"? "It is". "How does this thing work, do you go directly into the D.O.T. socket and that's all you need"? "Yes". Sounded annoyed, what did I do? Called me few hours later. "I'm the guy who called you this morning, sorry for being curt, I had to take a service department to task after they screwed up my truck." What did they do"? "I wish they did less", he said. "This is my third truck I'm using for trailer pulling". He mentioned a Pete and another brand, this his latest is 2019 Cascadia. The dealership was doing the prep work on it for trailer pulling. "Did they use a Jackalopee"? "Apparently not, which surprised me because I had Jackalopees in the two previous trucks". "Aha, did they try to tap into the three lights in the bobtail brace"? "Yep, the ECM didn't like". I said, "that's pretty common since in the newer trucks the ECM monitors all those circuits and it might throw a code for short in the circuit". He said, "it did more than that they BLEW IT UP, THEY HAVE TO RE-FLASH IT"! Apparently, somebody in the dealership was working from the residual historical experience, I'd say old timer. Prior to 2005 you didn't need a Jackalopee to deal with lights for trailers. The bobtail lights in semis work the same as the trailer lights circuits. You could tap into those. Around 2005 Volvo started with LCM (Lights Control Module) and got an ECM involved in monitoring electrical circuits in the truck for shorts, opens and extra loads. No more taping allowed. Typically it just produces an error code on the display. I suspect they did something "extra stupid" to piss off an ECM into quitting.

Been a while, last month started a new "career", hydrological engineer. Sucking up water in the cellar/shop/office. Building swales, diverting springs, installing roof gutters, rerouting down spouts, etc. Building an ark was going to be the next project. Moses must have had a bitch of a job figuring housing for various species, for instance how far apart do you keep snakes and rats? Re-connected with the owner, not as much progress was made in my absence as I would like, but he said I have a pair of these, what do you think? I guess this is no longer relevant.

OK, the real story. I spent quite a bit of time with the customer. Obviously he had to purchase another Jackalopee board. The "expert?" felt bad so he offered to fix it, but he "funcked it up" again. The a-hole never read or looked again at the manuals, supplied again with the new PCB he went with his own "expertise". The customer hired another (real) expert and we fixed it. The unit was installed upside down hence the trailer is on the left. Look up at the original picture, the third wire from the bottom, LEFT/STOP, it's yellow. Look on right, truck side, third wire from top, STOP, it's yellow too. Look on the left again, the empty tab on the board, it's for AUX/BACKUP, nothing on it. Look at the wire unused and tie wrapped to the bundle, it's red and unused, why?! This is in the manual, he obviously didn't look there, but he also ignored what is clearly marked on the board telling you what color wire goes where and what is its purpose. Also in the manual you have this on page 3. I bet you he didn't see this either. I have an inkling why the moron did what he did. His trailer wiring expertise apparently stopped at wiring U-Haul trailers to cars and pickups where left/stop wire in a flat four wire plug is indeed yellow so that's how you connect utility trailers to cars. The customer said that it kind of worked for year and half, he must have rewired the RV socket to work with yellow instead of red, clever boy. The other reason I got the call, the electric over hydraulic brakes quit also, more on that in the next post, it requires a bit more more explanation and a teachable moment.

When I junked my Volvo (engine blew up and I couldn't justify $20K inframe on 20 year old truck) I took out the prototype hitch out and eventually junked it too. When I took it apart the airbags were perfectly serviceable, dusty but no rubber checking or other issues. In an ET the bags are well out of the elements and sun which is the worst for rubber.

Two more individuals availed themselves of the opportunity to discuss their installations of their Jackalopee, which I "encourage" in the manual with a statement, "Questions? Call So & so at 603-XXX-XXXX. Now those phone calls are never about a weather or these folks' plans for their lottery winnings, it's more in the category of calls cops get, "there's a body in the street and you need to put a chalk line around it". The latest vic waiting for the chalk line looked like this. It was installed not by a customer, but an "expert" hired by the customer. Year and half later the electric over hydraulic brakes quit working, can you figure out why?

This started as fifth wheel work trailer pulled by a semi with air over hydraulic shoe brakes (12 of them). Front was cut off and replaced with a pintle ring to be pulled by pickup and rewired for electric over hydraulic, that's where I come in. Huge outriggers were added front and back, they pull out several feet out. The frame up front will house a massive winch. At the moment it will work twice per year, to pull out of the water (fall) and put in the water (spring) a tour boat on lake Sunapee https://sunapeecruises.com/ The ice doesn't break on that lake till mid April.

Spent couple of days upgrading this trailer.

Is it about the same as shown in the above video, or more or less?

What kind of fifth are you pulling? Make, model, length, GVW?

You need about 12 feet of frame from the back of the cab for the Smart and the turn radius for the fifth.

You guys are going to make me blush. But don't worry, I and many others have throttled my ego to minimal proportions. I do this for two reason, I enjoy this and I consider this as a bit of a social obligation. I've been mentored all my life at all stages, from basic to very sophisticated. And mentoring others was a critical part of my job as a corporate leader. I might expand this thread and have a discussion how important this is. But here's a couple of examples, my first mentor, the one holding a tire. He was my boss and chief design engineer in a company where we were designing atomic absorption spectroscopy equipment (look it up, 0 to 3,000 degrees Celsius in two seconds), just two of us he and I. We flew this thing 3 years later. The cabin was totally burnt and destroyed, we set the tasks and he said, "your job will be to rebuild the dashboard with all the instruments". With little mentoring, I delivered. Incidentally, in our daily jobs, we delivered the prototype spectroscope in 22 months, beat the competition into a pulp and Bill gave me another job. Produce the complete documentation of the product and release such to the manufacturing department, train manufacturing, write the field service and repair manual and train the service techs. You might say, it was my first "official" mentoring job. Bill and I ended in many other companies, but remained steadfast and lifelong friends. He is no longer with us. The other corporate leader who I admire immensely is Elon Musk. Elon has an office, but he does not spend much time behind the desk. There are websites that follow SpaceX projects, not only the few showcased by the media, but behind the scenes ones he works on. The mentoring that happens in his company is insane. But the thing that propels his success that is not talked much about is his total lack of fear to fail. The last Starship he launched did blow up 20 miles high, he was ecstatic about the data they got on this flight. The other flights didn't go that high, or blew up on the pad. That kind of behavior is abhorred in large corporate settings. But I can pretty much guarantee that a person that never fails, never succeeds at anything either. On my "little" project there is progress. More pictures are coming

Interesting, looks like the three market segments have settled down to the pre-pandemic, pre-"wait two years to get a new truck", days. Newer stuff 300,000 miles, warranty, $80K, 500-600,000 off warranty $50-60K, high mileage working stuff $30K. So the decisions are as follows: I got the dough, I want minimal hassles, go for the first group. Can't spend that much, nor do I want to, will have to fix few things here and there, go for the second group. Not afraid to service things or fix things, even on the road traveling, go for the third group. I went for the third group, fixed things on the road three times over ten years and 100,000 miles of RVing, spent about $30,000 doing this and normal service, which averaged $3,000 per year. Not bad in my opinion. Three times broken down on the road, I viewed it as an adventure, wife did too. As a matter of fact she "organized" one of these herself (a two weeks stay at a shop in Michigan). The two other times, we were at a campground anyway, so having the truck in the shop was no big deal. Whichever group you pick, it still beats the price of the new pickup, either by a little or by a lot. Remember, this market doesn't give a rats behind what us RVers want or can afford, it is driven by working truckers and trucking companies and how reliable the used rigs will be on the road working. Hence the newer rigs are up there close to the price of new trucks.

Bandbuds truck was the culmination of my truck converting career (until now). Finishing it in the subzero February weather caused serious reflection and a need to solve a problem, actually half a problem. Wife was vacationing in the rig in Florida while I was "converting" in February New Hampshire. Upon driving to Florida I was contemplating a solution to "present" to wife. She liked the idea. By April we delivered on the idea. Incidentally, the truck welcomed me when I arrived. Said to me, "Glad you made it down, incidentally I wasn't going back to friggin' cold New Hampshire no matter what".

Since I am sharing this design process, I want to point out few "philosophical" aspects of engineering where ideal meets reality. Rule # 1, "listen to the fabricator". Like the welder working on this truck. He's got decades of experience and can spot fupas, like, "you know this bed ain't coming off the truck unless we slide it back about an inch before we start lifting it". The bed will have to come off to finish welding, painting, mount accessories, etc. The deck assembly had to be modified slightly to allow for rear movement clearance. I also wanted to make sure we didn't trap the ET inside the bed, pretty common on many bed designs which I cursed when I had to remove ETs to work on them, or upgrade them. What you see in the above picture is the solution to both issues. The ET gets an oversize rear plate which when removed exposes the ET mounting rails for sliding it out. It also exposes the bed stiffeners for unbolting and for watching the bed clearance while lifting. Rule # 2, "give the fabricator everything he needs to proceed and not scratch his head". Below is what he got to start. Not only did he get the assembly drawing but also individual drawings how to fabricate the pieces, like the -05s cut left and right with their compound angles. Rule #3, "design ideal but stay flexible". I haven't seen truck yet that did not have "surprises". This one in particular has "issues" both in horizontal and vertical plane, hence the note on page 2 of the assembly drawing. I don't care if the bed is off kilter, you'll never see it on something this big, but I have to have my 12 inches to properly mount the slide drawer. The next challenge will be the side skins extending from the rear to the tires. These will be curved in front to give the tire well that "fender" look and will incorporate the door to cover the slide tray. I already told the fabricator, "don't you dare to cut that expensive 3/16 steel plate to my drawings until you do this. Make them out of cardboard before you torch the steel. Isn't this fun.

Latest progress on the back of the truck.

Bit of a sequential thought process. Next challenge, sealing the top, designing mid travel stops, incorporating this, designing the outside skins with door and tire fender. We are having fun now.

Jeep working up an eight foot ramp Could be close over the ET ET can be easily modified to temporarily dump its air bags which lowers the head by 3 inches. Once the Jeep climbs up the incline it will easily clear the front of the ET.

Put my "new Jeep" to work. My original calculations said that if I sloped the deck 7 degrees starting 60 inches forward off the ET kingpin latching circle, the Jeep differential should clear by about two inches. Hmm, a few AttaBoys should becoming my way. Next task to design the ramps and see what happens with 8 footers instead of 10 footers (my original plan). Ain't engineering a blast!!

All good thoughts. I'll have to see if 8 foot ramps will work, needed his Jeep first. Not a thing of beauty but the overall length, wheelbase, tire size, location and differential height are dead on. Want to see the break-over clearance situation.

That's just more "areas of opportunity" with no hitch. We had so much space under there with this truck that we decided we have to mount something under there. I've done three trucks with under frame stuff, water tanks, ramps storage and pull out drawer similar to this one. This one has given me conniptions, bathroom trip didn't help. I think I got it nailed this morning, I'll post the solution. The challenges were: the doors, drawer clearances, drawer stops, wheel rails, rails mounting and few other things.