Brian C

The other idea I rather liked was something like the rectangular shape of your first (above) mock-up. The differences would be I would install a pivot point at the bottom of each of the four legs. Then a winch can lower it down to the deck. I have seen it done with snow machines and it was brilliant. It would not not be too dissimilar to this. 

https://www.dock-factory.com/product-page/boat-lifts 

3 hours ago, phoenix2013 said:

Brian, this is quite an ambitious project and I see two very positive things, you research things and ask questions and you are not afraid to expose your thinking to others who may know more (or less). This forum is a perfect place to expose one's ideas to "scrutiny", I do it all the time. Yes folks here have "opinions", but more importantly folks here have experience, having actually done things rather than "theorizing" about getting things done.

One number I would like you focus on 13' 6", typical height of a semi roof. Good to have it embedded in your brain while reading bridge height markers, that's 162 inches. Just like you I had an idea at one time. 

 

Thank you Phoenix2013, it should be pretty swell once we are complete. 

My though for the motorcycle rack is more along these lines.

The rails do do not need to super tall, as the rack only need go half the height of the rack of course. 

Thank you for your help. That all makes great sense. Well explained. Thank you. 

On the ReGen. I have a D13 and it took Four full forced ReGens to get the computer happy after I replaced the nox sensors and cleaned the filter last month. I am no expert but I am given to understand that this is not entirely uncommon. 

Good of luck with the rest of the issues. 

3 hours ago, noteven said:

So my design criteria for a CanAm capable rig would be a max 65ft overall combination length, including up to 40ft tow vehicle (480”).

(Etc...)

Once the rig sketches out dimensions wise then you go to calculating weight distribution

rickeieio - please check my math I’m partially incapacitated due to ridingitis.

dont tell my therapist 

(I cut a bit out of the middle to save space. I’m sure folks can look above if they wish to reread your thoughts. Cheers)

I hope you had a great ride!  Thanks for the info. Yes, I am tracking all of that. I had done my maths on lengths and I am comfortable with where I will sit length wise. Now I am to the point of determining balances and weights. As I mentioned I have listed as many of the weights as I now have, and I can gather the rest in due course. 

Alaska Law, “the overall length of a combination of vehicles, consisting of a truck and one cargo-carrying vehicle or a truck tractor and one or two cargo- carrying vehicles, may not exceed 75 feet;” -17 AAC 25.012.d3  (Edit: I should add, for those who may not like the wording, that is just how we do it in AK. The law calls side by sides, three wheelers, and four wheelers, 6x6 and all other off highway vehicles with more than two tires “snow machines” and we all get snow machine registrations  go figure.)

I have been told (above) that there is not reciprocity on length laws from state to state. I was not aware of that, and will certainly research to confirm, but for now I will operate as considering it fact. 

The length of my vehicle and trailer as sketched out is well within that limit. I can hang off a nice bicycle rack on the back of the trailer should I care to. Thank you all for the concern on my length and cost. 

Has anyone any more thoughts on the topic which we were kindly initially discussing?

by the way noteven. I was meaning to ask, fancy a trip to Idaho? I’ve got a pad of paper waiting. LOL 😂. 

Take care, and God Bless. 

4 hours ago, Jack Mayer said:

It is going to be challenging to get a motorcycle on next to a Jeep. How are you going to get it into place? What mechanism will hold it safely? Where will you find the "room"?

On the "rack" above the Jeep hood, what are you going to use to elevate it? It is not at all simple to do safely. It has to be braced very securely...

 You want to add a lift mechanism and motorcycle racks to that, lengthen it significantly, and get it delivered to you for around 6K by your statement. That is simply not realistic. You could not build a simple deck of any quality for that.

You can "crowdsource" a design for a Jeep deck. That will get you an outline you can build. But even if you do much of the work yourself you will be spending  over 10K to complete the project. At least in my opinion, and we do this every day....

Thank you Jack, that is a lot to digest. 

To answer your questions, perhaps out of order:

I can buy an all metal car hauler flat bed twin axle style trailer without the axles and without the  tongue for $3k. I’ve already sourced it from a well known and reputable trailer builder.  Ultimately then it comes to mounting it to the truck. ~$500.00. It really is not that big of a feat. 

The lift I am not trying to do right away, but I have my ideas. I have a great deal of experience in the expedition travel or vehicle based world travel arena. In this world we have seen motorcycle racks for over a dozen years. It is actually fairly straight forward. Your rack required significant engineering because of the width I should assume. I have never seen how it is raised or lowered and that may make a difference as well. I have seen people putting two spare tires the size of two HDT tires with heavy off-road tread side by side, and then a 450lbs motorcycle beyond that. It can all be made to be lifted on rails by a simple warm winch. Pins to lock it in place once up. Again, it is fairly straightforward. 

I am not at all trying to crowdsource anything, though I know someone who did it fairly successfully with a massive expedition truck. I am simply attempyto crowdsource the calculations. I respect the experience of those here. I would be remiss not to utilize the experience I already have. I realize that a 30,000lbs truck going down the highways and down bouncy 4x4 trails is not the same as a 25,000lbs truck just built for highway use, but I believe the similarities exist in substantial enough areas as to continue to use both your wisdom and mine. 

My thought for the eventual deck is either a slide system that goes vertical or a hinges system that flows from BOC towards the rear of the truck. 

Edit: Jack I forgot to answer your question of placement.  Sorry about that.  Right now I do not have the Jeep, we only had an RZR. The RZR is ~60” wide. That gives me 21” on either side of the machine with which to utilize as motorcycle parking.  I will park the bikes first and strap them down. Then I can park the RZR and strap it down.  When the Jeep comes along it will be fully 13.8” wider, and will require some rethinking of the configurations.  Either way, with largest, by far, bike that is only 20” wide (not including the handlebars) I should easily be able to park the bike at the outer edge of the deck and have room to park the RZR.

I hope this has answered some some of your questions. 

God Bless,

Brian

4 hours ago, phoenix2013 said:

I was going to offer some thought, maybe on weight and balance, asking where the motorcycle was going to be placed, point out the handling issues with long overhangs, etc., etc.

Thank you for your intent. I would appreciate your thoughts. 

One of my concerns is, in fact, having an over hang that is too long or too short. Too long, obviously, as I am sure you will point out, will unload the front axle and provide very scary and unsafe conditions. By too short I mean that it would limit my turning angle significantly, and while I want it as far back as needed to be safe, I’d rather not go al the way back when it is not needed. I hope that makes sense. 

The motorcycle, I plan to park the Jeep either to one side allowing access for bikes up the other side, or preferably the Jeep in the canter with the bikes on either side. Lastly I have considered putting a shelf above the hood of the Jeep, to hold the bikes. Not unlike the rack RVHLifestyles recently built to hold a pair of spider trikes. I should mention one bike is an adult dirt bike, and three children’s bikes. 

Anyhow, thank you for your time. 

Brian

20 hours ago, rickeieio said:

Brian, settle down please.  All you'll need to know pertaining to length laws is available in the Heavy Haulers Resource Guide, compiled by Mark Bruss.  It's all well documented, and has many links to state and federal laws.  Please do some reading before accusing those who've offered advice of just "thinking" they know the laws.  This not the 1st, or even the 100th, time this subject has been beaten to death.  And you are not the first person to come barging in thinking they know all about HDTs.

Do some homework, then come back and we'll try to help.

Thank you Rick, I am aware of it and I have read through it multiple times.  

I am simply trying to gain information on how to calculate the weight and balances. I know I will need to get the weights I just don’t know how to plug them in to insure my truck is safe. 

I appreciate any any advice offered in kindness. 

Regards,

4 hours ago, Sehc said:

Ah. The same as me. "Here is my other-state title. Please give me this-state registration" - "Ok. Here new title , registration. Give me check." 

HAHAHAHA!  So true. But just so funny the way you wrote it. Sorry. Just got a real kick out of it. Awesome. 

Thank you everyone. 

I cant believe I failed to say that it is in fact a tandem truck. Apologies. 

On the length, I have yet to see nor had anyone show me where there is a length limit on an HDT towing. The only thing even remotely applicable is that the truck can be any length you like and the trailer can not exceed 53’ in most states. So I am none too worried about that. Thanks for your concern though folks. 

I don’t disagree with the pen and paper idea, but my brain simply does not work that way. I think I grasp the explanations, and I understood the lever & fulcrum concepts. But I fail to grasp how I might determine the center of the weight on the Jeep to know how that works in, and I seem to be at a total loss for how I’d know the weight of the bed. I guess I would have to speak with the bed builder and get his thoughts.  

A big thing right now that is eating at me is “will I need to relocate the axles or not, and if so how far, and what will that do to my turning radius?”  

If I felt comfortable at least with that i fo I could take it to the frame folks and get them going on the stretch, hitch removals and new hitch mount, and possible axle relocation. 

I wish I could just find a one stop shop similar to RVH but for about a third the price. I recon the folks I have worked out can do it for significantly less than even that, but for such I have to do the math and tell them what to do, and it is on me if I screw up. Sadly all of the folks around here who could do it won’t because it is not for a commercial application. How weird is that, right? Sigh. 

Below are the measurements I believe you are asking for, at least what I have now. If I am missing something let me know. 

Wheel base to center of tandems 230”

BOC to second axle 5’6” (66”)

BOC to third axle 9’9” (117”)

Average, or BOC to midpoint between tandems  7’7.5” (91.5”)

BOC to end of frame rails (including slope) 12’3” (147”) Hope that makes sense.

Please let me know if I appear to have made any blatantly obvious errors. LOL  

Thanks again,

Brian

On 6/10/2019 at 12:24 PM, Phil D said:

-- even going as far as revoking the titles of trucks already titled as motor homes.

Now that South Dakota once again allows HDTs to be titled as motor home conversions, the two states are pretty much equal.  That being the case, it makes no sense for a Texas resident to register in South Dakota, or vice versa.

Revoking titles, that is harsh. 

Now it seems the OP was having a hard time showing or convincing Texas that the truck met the standards. 

SD requires only an affidavit from you stating that you did the conversion and they will send the title out. Once titled it is easy to then transfer that title to your state and get plated. My state is spectacular about converted trucks, but I would have to bring it all the way back before they would ok it. Well that is great when I can’t drive it without a plate. So SD was, for me, a clear choice. 

Hello all. 

BLUF (Bottom Line Up Front) I need the mathematical formula to be sure the bed build and the toys on the bed/hitch/fifth wheel pin weight do not unload the front axle too much.  (Thus requiring me to move the tandem axles, which I am ok with, but don’t want to  unnecessarily.)

I recently purchased a Volvo truck and I need to stretch the frame about eight to nine feet to put a vehicle and some motorcycles lengthwise on the truck, and still pull our 5er  

Truck is a 2013 volvo VNL64T730 D13 ishift  with a 230” wheelbase. We plan to put a 14’ two door Jeep, under ~4000lbs, ~1000lbs of motorcycles, 3k pin weight and a 400lbs hitch, not including the extra frame and the bed itself. 

I have no idea at all how to figure this out, and I really do not want to make the truck unsafe. The nearest Volvo dealer will stretch the frame and mount the hitch, and a local trailer and flatbed company is going to build the bed and install it  

I am planning to dovetail the end of that matters at all  

Thank you much!

Brian

Chad can you put me on the email list for the photos?  I am still a bit disappointed that we were called away at the last moment. 

Thank you 

On 6/8/2019 at 6:00 PM, Randyretired said:

Brian, yes that blue low roof Volvo is ours.  As I wrote the ramps we use for our RZR are 8' and climb 4'.  The RZR climbs this 6" per foot rise without a problem.  Depending on the length of your RZR I would guess that will be pretty  close to what might work for you.  Good luck and please post pics.

Thank you Randy,  hopefully I can get it worked out soon and start a build. 

On 6/12/2019 at 1:17 PM, Darryl&Rita said:

 

There was a bar called The Library near my first university, and they would always play this as the last song. What a crack up to run into it again. 

Randy I believe I have seen yours, blue Kenworth/Peterbilt style truck with a low roof?

 Thank you for the idea of the photo. I never thought of that. 

Hero, I did do that, thank you though  

Thank you everyone!

I really appreciate your help. 

Brian

7 hours ago, Wrknrvr said:

You can see a side view in the avatar. I would think about setting your razor to the side. Then the bikes to the other side. Then have full area under the ramp for storage.

The center upright is what I hook the jeep to to pull it up. 

 Just a thought,.   Vern

Thank you much Vern. Did you hire the work out, or build it yourself? It looks very nice. My plan for now is to put my motorcycle under the RZR and then put my boys’ bikes on either side and currently one will sit inside the RZR or next to my bike depending on Space. 

I will not be building mine. I have no experience fabricating and this seems a bad thing to learn on. I do not know what to tell potential fabricators though. What structural considerations were there?  

That ramp of yours certainly appears to make a huge drom box for you. 

4 hours ago, Randyretired said:

We have a RZR 800 that we load across the bed.  Our bed is 48" off the ground and I use an 8' ramp.  At that angle the RZR drives up the ramp without a problem.  

Thank you Randy. Ours is a four seat, so it will not fit sideways on the bed. 

I had not considered the oil and fuel concerns with an angle. Any idea where I might find information to tell me how much is too much, and what is needed if I exceed that?  Thank you. 

7 hours ago, Big5er said:

When you are already a Texas resident, why would you want to register your truck in another state? Many states frown (heavily) on their residents registering their vehicles in another state. 
Other than using an LLC the only reason I can see to register your vehicle out of your state of residence, if you house it in the state where you reside, is to skirt the laws of your state and/or screw your state out of their road taxes for the roads you drive on.

Hardly. 

South Dakota has a very straightforward conversion process, it is easy, and does not require you to be a resident. Most states will accept an RV title from another state no questions asked. Therefore they are much easier to deal with than trying to go through a state that is inexperienced with the process. Furthermore if you are traveling full time, as I am, SD is, once again, very easy to work with for full timers. Mail can be established, etc. 

Pretty cool of them IMHO. 

I know now our politicians, of late, are encouraging us to think ill of one another, but try to think positively and I am sure you can think of other valuable reasons this might work for folks. 

Ok, this is the type of concept I want to shoot for. 

I figure platforms in the top to rest the front wheels,  and a winch point for less than desirable weather conditions.

Thank you all. 

Thank you all. I do appreciate it. 

South Dakota folks! 

Go with them! Everything done by mail from Idaho, being an Alaska Resident was a complete none issue. They happily took my money and processed the paperwork. Sent the plates to me by mail, and the title to the main SD office who will process it and send me a title in a few more weeks. They don’t care where you live, if your money is green they are good to go. 

Had to fill out a form stating it had a beds, power, heater, and refrigerator. Have that notarized and done and done!

Grateful. 

 BLUF: I want to build ramps up the cab of the HDT. (No not touching the cab.)

Now I am sure this has been beaten to death somewhere but I don’t even know what to type in the search to find it. Shoot I can’t even get a decent title!  (Please feel free to direct me to someone’s build link! Thank you)

I picked up my HDT and I am going to stretch the frame a touch. Then put a bed on it. I would like to haul an RZR4 and some dirt bikes ON the HDT. 

Goal is to fabricate Ramp up the back of the cab. 

The RZR will be parked lengthwise on the truck and I’d like to have it on as severe an angle as I am able to tuck it in tight and save space.  I also want to park the bikes under and next to the RZR.  I will then tow a 5er.

I would include a photo that I do have, but this site won’t let me use the size photos I have and I cannot seem to reduce it any more than it is.

Thank you all.

Brian

Well alright. We shall see you all there as well. Looking forward optimistically.

We we are down from Alaska, and looking forward to enjoying some of the experiences the lower 48 has to offer. 

Ian, we’ve got you covered brother!