HDT advice

[lappir]

16 hours ago, Truck said:

Ok all, I'm taking advice and going to go to the HDT rally.  I'm going to visit my folks in OKC and my father and I are going to drive up to KS.  We will probably only be able to attend Mon-Wed but hope ya'll can educate me enough to venture out and make my own purchase.  Maybe you can convince my dad this isn't a bad idea...he thinks I'm nuts...but he thinks that about any car I have purchased for restoration....So I look forward to spending some time with my dad and learning from all of you that will be there.

Cheers,

Truck

Don't think you will regret your decision. It's not a bad drive from OKC. I'll be heading to Norman at some point while at the Kansas State Fairgrounds and then to Hays, Kansas before going back to Iowa. Will be sad I probably won't be bringing my motorcycle, but may get some good rides in the Jeep with the Freedom panels out. 

 

Rod

[CHIEFWAHO]

22 hours ago, Truck said:

Ok all, I'm taking advice and going to go to the HDT rally.  I'm going to visit my folks in OKC and my father and I are going to drive up to KS.  We will probably only be able to attend Mon-Wed but hope ya'll can educate me enough to venture out and make my own purchase.  Maybe you can convince my dad this isn't a bad idea...he thinks I'm nuts...but he thinks that about any car I have purchased for restoration....So I look forward to spending some time with my dad and learning from all of you that will be there.

Cheers,

Truck

Sound like a good move!

[maveric]

As has been stated earlier, there are many options. Here is my experience...

I started with a 99 Dodge 2500 diesel. Used it for years pulling my 30' goose triple axle with 2 vehicles on it. Also used it to haul hay and wood pellets to heat my house. I found that I was almost always over loading it. The truck was always hooked to the trailer, and in the 10 years I owned it, I put 3 transmissions in it. Average mpg with the trailer was 7, and with 3 people, it was crowded.

I picked up a 99 Fld120 condo, single screw for 10k. The guy I bought it from had built a welding bed for it (flatbed with tool boxes and misc attachments). 12.7 Detroit with 1.1M miles on the clock. No paperwork, but since it was a retired Fed-Ex truck, I assume it had an overhaul sometime before I bought it. I have owned it almost 10 years and have replaced a turbo, transmission, ac compressor (2), lower coolant pipe, and tires. I had to reinstall the 5th hitch, and have used it to haul multiple trailers. Goose ball is mounted below and behind the 5th, since weight on the goose is more limited. 5th is a slide, so I can adjust it for different trailers. Still use it to haul my goose with 2 rigs. Built a removable dovetail so I can haul a single rig on the deck (without trailer). Have since purchased a 48' drop deck for the bigger things I haul (can fit 3 crawlers on it), and built a toy hauler out of a 53' dry van. Average MPG over the 10 years... 8.5. 

I am in Colorado. When I bought the truck, the scale weight ticket showed it weighed under 16k, so I was able to register it as a Recreation Truck. I put a 12v fridge in it, as well as ran shore power inside the sleeper, but other than that, it is stock. My toyhauler is registered the same as any other factory built toyhauler, so I fall under recreational vehicle all around. No scales, not ports, no commercial roadside inspections). I do have private stickers on it, but really don't know if they make a difference. All of the trailers and truck have normal license plates that renew annually. IF I get stopped, that should be the first clue that they are not commercial (if they run the plate). 

In my opinion, purchasing the HDT was one of the better decisions I have made for hauling things. Working on a HDT is similar to, if not easier than working on a new pickup. Everything is just bigger. 

[maveric]

[Truck]

This is extremely relevant. Thank you.  This very similar to what i will be doing except with Jeep Scramblers.  I doubt i could find one for 10k these days but would love to.  Even thought of the idea of having a bed long enough for 1 jeep if it is just me and use the truck as a camper.

[JPL]

Truck    Do you still live in Va? I live in Chesapeake And there are 2 of us who use to or still do have a Volvo for a 5er. Where exactly do you live? If you plan on buying a truck and making it a RV good luck. Va is really tough trying to get it titled as a RV. Love to talk trucks so give me a call if you are still around. 757 646 1686    Pat

 

 

The Old Sailor

[Truck]

Pat, yes we are still in VA.  We live in Manassas.  Happy to talk when i get back to town from HDT rally.

Truck

Edited October 13, 2022 by Truck

[Truck]

Ok, i have been slowly shopping but a lot of life has gotten in the way.  I met a lot of you great folks at the Rally in KS.  I missed a couple of deals on big bunk sleeper trucks which would have been perfect for my 'mission profile'.  But just couldn't get travel worked out to see them.  So back to looking and paying more attention to Volvos as recommended.  So looking at 05 or older trucks what is recommended from an engine perspective in Volvos?  Some have cummins and a very few have detroits but the rest seem to have volvo engines.  What is the reliability of the volvo engines?  What is the difference in the designations and are there some better than others?  Detroit Series 60s seem to be the cheapest to work on, how expensive are rebuilt kits or parts for the volvo engines?  For the ones that do have cummins, is there a preferred cummins?  Are there any of these engines to definitely stay away from?

Truck

[Darryl&Rita]

In the model years you're looking at now, Cummins offered the N 14, then the ISX. The N 14 was bulletproof, the ISX, not so much. Detroit offered the 60 series, which is probably the "go to" engine for those who have a choice. Cheap to operate, cheap to repair, cheap to run. Volvo had the D 13, then the D 15. The D 13 is a great engine, the 15 is close. It's not in your model years, but skip the D 16. Also, avoid the MBE engine, too little support anymore. 
In order of repair costs, Detroit cheapest, N 14, DD 13. Best fuel mileage, again Series 60, then a tossup between the N 14, and DD 13.
Maintenance items are pretty much even, as all the top 3 engines have been around long enough to have good aftermarket support.

All the engine builders also offered "small block" engines, such as the Cummins M 10, the small Series 60, but I wouldn't waste time looking for oa truck specific with one. The smaller engines were usually ordered for the stripped fleet trucks, and worked hard. They're out there, but do you want the truck it's wrapped inside?

 

ETA: Cat made road engines until the '05 model year. 3406/C 16 will pull the stink off a dead hog, the C 15 ACERT engines were a headache, but most of the bugs should be worked out of any you would buy today. Parts/maintenance are priced to match the gold paint they're covered with. Fuel mileage tended to run to the bottom of the pack.

Edited January 27, 2023 by Darryl&Rita

[Steve from SoCal]

Quote

 

2005 an older trucks are getting harder to find and bring a high price IF they are in good shape.    Daryl was remiss in mentioning the Cat C13 the 'small block' Cat engine of that era.    In Volvos of that era a Volvo D13 would be my choice.    There were a handful of Cat powered Volvo's but they are really rare and the C15 is a good engine just not great economy.   The ISX of that era had a lot of problems most would have been sorted out by this time but, they can have some issues.    The N14 was a good engine and the Detroit powered Volvo's are like Cat's very rare.   

 

International trucks are generally cheaper than the rest, a Cummins or Cat powered International could be a good buy?     The Freightliner aero trucks along with Peterbilt and Kenworth are the best buys, the one thing about Volvo's are the cabs are steel and at that age corrosion may be an issue?      In that era if you are looking for a 2 pedal autoshift Volvo and the others with Freedom Line transmissions are the best shifting.

The trucks to avoid are the early emission trucks.

[lappir]

Don't forget about the D12 Volvo 465. 

That's what I have in my 2001. I watched it turn over 900000 miles a few summers ago. Not sure if I'll be able to put it over the Million mile mark. I don't drive it but a couple times a year. 

The biggest issue with this motor (and maybe other Volvo motors) is the wiring harness from the valve covers to the ECU. All of them leak oil down the harness and when that oil gets to the ECU it's big money to repair.  It's a bit to replace early, but it's what I should have done before it got to that point. I did not and had to pay. 

There are a few electrical gremlins with these trucks and they can be expensive to find too. If you like working under the truck you can do a lot of the checks yourself. I do not and did not so once again $$$. 

I'm glad I have my truck, but am not sure what I'll do when it's no longer cost effective to repair. 

 

Rod 

[Truck]

Thanks folks this is the kind of info I needed to know.  I don't mind doing work but can't afford the time for a project in short term.  Need a running truck for my VA to CO trips then I can take time to make better after we are permanently in CO. 

Truck

[Rotorhead]

53 minutes ago, Truck said:

Thanks folks this is the kind of info I needed to know.  I don't mind doing work but can't afford the time for a project in short term.  Need a running truck for my VA to CO trips then I can take time to make better after we are permanently in CO. 

Truck

I hope you find the right truck for your needs. I looked for quite a few months. I found mine out in Hays, KS. It is a 2010 Volvo 780 with a Cummins ISX 15 CM871. I am in VA as well. I flew out, looked at it and then closed the deal. It has been a pretty good truck so far. It was in need of some TLC to get it back to where it should be. It still needs a few things, but I have to save up for projects. It only left me hanging one time when it blew a heater hose. I have since driven it out to Dallas and back to VA with no issues. 

I have done three oil samples so far and they have all been in the normal category. I just did all the tests available in Cummins Insite and they all passed. It has the EGR and DPF. (no DEF). I unplugged the EGR for a while and I got between 10.9 and 11.9 MPG bobtail. Of course, I have to plug it back in to do a REGEN once in a while. I have done quite a bit of the catch-up maintenance myself. I had Cummins Service Center do an overhead set. Ouch, it was about $1,700. The said there was a bad rocker. Anyway, it has been a great adventure and it is well worth the cost to me. We are heading down to LA in March most likely. Pretty soon I will be starting to get it set up for a camper. 

Chuck

[Randyretired]

Finding a truck that has been taken care of was my thoughts when looking. Some are trashed at 400,000 miles. I also wanted an air locker. Took a while but I bought this 2001 around 17 years ago.  It has an ISX and been pretty good. I am in CO

[ddm502001]

Just to give an idea of what will feel like, take a drive in one, use mirrors and get comfortable where keep truck centered in lane.  I have been driving HDT since the 1970s so comes easy enough and still catch myself white line crawling in some models of cabs.  Freightliner will give overall better visual to road surface and in traffic, I have driven DD60 series and Cummins ISX, prefer the DD as seems more responsive.  EGR on ISX were common failure points to place engine into Defect Derate electronically.  DD had problems with earlier EGR Coolers failures.  Cat prior to '05 was 6NZ prefix S/N and NO EGR, BXS and MXS Prefix engines did have IVA (Intake Valve Actuation) which was Cats version of EGR and a mess.  Cat escaped truck market in '07.  Need to add, the DD and CAT engines are really expensive to overhaul, In chassis is NOT a recommended version.  Cummins seems to manage in chassis OH better but can lead to removal of block for some machining requirements.

Single axle with locker is as good or better than a tandem with open diffs.  

ONE other Consideration, Check on VA requirements as to License if do NOT pull a RV Trailer.  Under MO Statute I cannot pull ANY other trailer than a RV, not even a flatbed with recreational toys on it.  Uncertain in CO.  My truck will have to be registered TRUCK with a Weight Tag for me to use for anything except RV Towing. MAY be able to make the entire Truck into RV Designation, but the towing of autos and Jeeps or Household goods on a Goose may violate that.  Good Luck.

 

Dave

Edit,

Double check license requirements, again, in MO unless is absolutely RV will require CDL with Air Brake endorsement to drive a class 7 or 8 and class A towing any trailer except RV.

Edited January 29, 2023 by ddm502001