Electric Vehicles Don’t Break The Grid, And They Can Help Boost It

[RV_]

Bruce thanks for the report from down under. I am familiar with S. Australia's big battery that was expanded in 2020. It is only to hold the grid to prevent a blackout until the regular backup power production augmentation can come online a matter of minutes. Just like our computer UPS On our computers. If anyone wants to see how to stop a blackout from taking down the grid, which can cause expensive damage when it fails, here is the story:

Tesla battery in South Australia expanded by 50 per cent, energy minister lauds benefits.

https://www.abc.net.au/news/2020-09-02/tesla-battery-expanded-as-sa-energy-minister-lauds-benefits/12622382

Here is another Australian hybrid renewable/fossil fuel success story-

Excerpt:

"How do you power your beautiful new home when it is built 20 minutes away from the closest town and your electricity provider quotes an astronomical figure to connect you? The answer, many Australians are finding, is: hybrid systems off grid. In this case, solar plus battery plus diesel backup.

Due to the rural location at Woodbury, the family was quoted over $100,000 to connect the home to grid power, and monthly power bills were estimated to be high due to the size and energy consumption of the four-bedroom family home. Springers was able to provide an off-grid system for less than the cost to connect to the grid. On top of that, there would be no ongoing power bills. It was an easy decision to make.

The two Powerwalls can store up to 27 kWh of solar energy, which would give the home two days of backup power before the auto-start diesel supplied by Kubota kicks in. The Springers in-house team of electrical engineers has designed the system capacity to ensure the property can power heavy loads such as air conditioning and hot water all year long. All selected components have comprehensive and lengthy warranty protection."

More here:

https://cleantechnica.com/2022/09/01/off-grid-big-house-no-worries/

 

Edited September 4, 2022 by RV_

[HMFunk]

 

To RV_/Derek

Earlier in this thread, you asked me this:

---  RV Replies: I don't remember saying someone was behind the power curve, although many companies are and are playing catch up transitioning to EVs. Please show where I said that.

To jog your memory, here is your answer:

In your very first post, at the very top of this thread, dated Aug 28, in the very first paragraph, you will find that exact wording that someone using your login posted therein.  Maybe it wasn't you.......

As a Subaru Forester owner like yourself, and as someone who 40 years ago engineered and built my former residence/S&B to be more than 50% heated directly by solar energy, I believe strongly in embracing practical solutions, technologies,  and innovative improvements in response to life situations.

For instance, electric trains are great, and I have used them for intra-urban travel with great satisfaction.

But I actually believe that Hydrogen as a vehicular fuel holds more promise than Canned Electricity, due to this one factor alone, which is the “Achilles Heel” of EV’s:  Energy Density.  Calculate the amount of energy in a tankful of gasoline or diesel fuel, then compare it to the energy in an EV battery bank.  Calculate the weight of the battery bank required, that would be capable of storing the energy of a tank of fuel for an ICE vehicle, that will provide the equivalent range.  Hint: the answer is a battery bank weighing thousands of pounds.

However, as I stated previously, until there exist EV's meeting the following criteria for my wife and I:

--  adequate range (850 miles in 14 hours)

--  affordability ($50,000 is way out of the question for us!)

-- contain "earth-friendly" batteries (not the “filthy batteries” currently available)

-- will not require us as full-timers to evict the folks in the adjacent site so we can use their electric pedestal to re-energize our vehicle

we will consider our criteria “UNMET” and we will not be buying an EV.

One final thought: In your first post, you cite an article postulating an Energy-themed Ponzi scheme wherein EV owners could utilize bi-directional charging (which is possible for only a portion of current EV's) to help “shave the peaks” of demand that threaten the health of electrical grids. Do you actually believe this is a practical suggestion?  The number (probably in the hundreds of thousands, if not the millions) of EV’s required to shave these peaks in an impactful manner shows the absurdity of this concept.

Now, I will conclude with a quote you use at the end of every one of your posts in these forums:

“Those who can make you believe in absurdities can make you commit atrocities.’ --  Voltaire

Travel Free!

HFUNK

2008 44' NRC on Freightliner Columbia chassis

Pre-Emissions 14L 515HP Detroit Diesel w ZFMeritor Freedomline trans

 

Edited September 17, 2022 by HMFunk
fixing punctuation leading to undesirable line break

[RV_]

😅😂

I drive an EV daily. Funny how critics don't. Please, carry on.

Safe travels!

 

[folivier]

My opinion is at my age and because I don't buy a new anything I'll probably never buy an EV. 

But the main reason I'm not for the EV revolution is I don't like the politicization. If the industry and economy goes that way then that's fine. But don't try to force-feed us into it. Especially since it's not a well thought out plan with the infrastructure. (I'm talking about our government and media and not anyone in particular, so don't take my opinions as a personal attack)

[Lou Schneider]

10 hours ago, RV_ said:

😅😂

I drive an EV daily. Funny how critics don't. Please, carry on.

Safe travels!

 

So do I!  I paid $200 for it last year and it provides lots of fun tooling around the RV park.  

Edited September 18, 2022 by Lou Schneider

[Kirk W]

[RV_]

3 hours ago, Lou Schneider said:

So do I!  I paid $200 for it last year and it provides lots of fun tooling around the RV park.  

Glad you do. Although I hesitate to ask because eBikes cost a lot more - golf cart? 😜

Remember all of us driving today's EVs on the road have owned multiple or many ICE vehicles and know both.

So that makes two of us having a lot of fun with our respective EVs!

🖖

 

Edited September 18, 2022 by RV_

[RV_]

3 hours ago, Kirk W said:

Copied! Hilarious but true, the more things change, the more some people can't.

[Pat & Pete]

1 hour ago, RV_ said:

Copied! Hilarious but true, the more things change, the more some people can't.

More likely won't . Too lazy .

[RV_]

Hey I'm lazy too. Don't like going to the gas station in the heat and cold! 🥵🥶

[HMFunk]

On 9/18/2022 at 8:11 AM, folivier said:

My opinion is at my age and because I don't buy a new anything I'll probably never buy an EV. 

But the main reason I'm not for the EV revolution is I don't like the politicization. If the industry and economy goes that way then that's fine. But don't try to force-feed us into it. Especially since it's not a well thought out plan with the infrastructure. (I'm talking about our government and media and not anyone in particular, so don't take my opinions as a personal attack)

Couldn't agree more!  The free market should decide - not "the gubbment" trying to steer things the way some faceless bureaucrats, tech-worshippers or "greenie true believers" think they should go......

For me, EV's don't make sense.  Many main ingredients, such as battery technology and supporting infrastructure are just not there yet for most of us.  So until I find one that is available and sensible for my situation, I won't make that choice.

For those that find that find EV's match their needs, more power (or maybe just power for a limited time) to them.....!

[Darryl&Rita]

Hold on to your underwear! https://www.cnbc.com/2022/09/27/ev-charging-stations-on-highways-dot-approves-50-states-plans.html

[RV_]

Darryl, that is a good article thanks!

Here is a longer video on wireless charging and it is better than I realized:

And it is retrofit easily and bidirectional!

https://www.facebook.com/watch/?v=1140968530178599

 

Edited October 6, 2022 by RV_

[Darryl&Rita]

Derek, I just recently became aware of a new product to make charger installation even cheaper. If the house panel is marginally sized, it must be replaced at the home owners expense. This new item from ConnectDER can remove the need to change the entire service and panel. It does have some restrictions, of course, but is showing how industry is stepping up.

[Chalkie]

11 hours ago, Darryl&Rita said:

This new item from ConnectDER can remove the need to change the entire service and panel. It does have some restrictions, of course, but is showing how industry is stepping up.

This a very interesting device! I wonder if it is going to take an act of the divine to get some entities to approve its use. Electricity providers are in general very protective of their meters and NEC codes are very specific in how wiring has to go from the meter box to the panel. Get the utilities on board and this will speed up installations for sure.

 

[RV_]

15 hours ago, Darryl&Rita said:

Derek, I just recently became aware of a new product to make charger installation even cheaper. If the house panel is marginally sized, it must be replaced at the home owners expense. This new item from ConnectDER can remove the need to change the entire service and panel. It does have some restrictions, of course, but is showing how industry is stepping up.

I just called them and that collar is specifically for connecting a solar system to the house with less wiring/hassle. I don't plan on doing solar here yet as we are still shooting to move in spring if we can find the right location tax base state with less wildfire and drought issues. I already have a 200Amp panel and a 50 amp charging outlet for my Tesla  in our garage.

However, thanks! I can use that when I do a solar and battery setup in our next last house and save a ton.

If someone needs to upgrade their panel so they can run an electric dryer, electric range, furnace or A/C and charge with this they still would need to with your meter collar DER.

However, there is an interesting gadget that plugs into the 30 amp electric dryer outlet that will charge your car out of one side and run the dryer out of the other. The dryer gets priority because it won't run all night and it auto switches back to charging your EV when the dryer is done. So it is still the original 30 amp load and no panel upgrade necessary. Our electric company just cut power while we upgraded our panel, Since the transformer serving our house could handle it there was no charge from them for upping our service to 200 amps from 100. But it still cost a hair over $2k to swap panels and run the heavy 50 amp copper wire across the garage to the outlet. I charge my EV about as often as we fill the gas tank on the Forester maybe twice a month. When we have two they won't be charging at the same time. The are not like a smart watch or phone that needs to be charged every night.

It is called the Neo Charge and here is their website. Brilliant:

https://www.getneocharge.com/smart-splitter?_kx=25jhrr-jBMc8AxvZSrx8pTYYGueMZYi9xMOSs2l7e7I%3D.UCdkT2

 

 

Edited October 6, 2022 by RV_

[RV_]

3 hours ago, Chalkie said:

This a very interesting device! I wonder if it is going to take an act of the divine to get some entities to approve its use. Electricity providers are in general very protective of their meters and NEC codes are very specific in how wiring has to go from the meter box to the panel. Get the utilities on board and this will speed up installations for sure.

 

Already approved in Denver and in the approval process here in the springs for solar panel to house grid connection.. But it is only for wiring in solar. Same wiring/panel upgrades with solar or without to charge EVs unless you use NeoCharge.

[Darryl&Rita]

3 minutes ago, RV_ said:

I just called them and that collar is specifically for connecting a solar system to the house with less wiring/hassle.

Must be an NEC thing, they're advertising them in Canada as EV compliant.

[RV_]

46 minutes ago, Darryl&Rita said:

Must be an NEC thing, they're advertising them in Canada as EV compliant.

Darryl, I called because that saves time and talked to them Denver and they gave me the number for Jackson here in the Springs. But the number in your link can get you a number to see if it is available locally. Then ask them this question. Is it solely to connect a solar system to a house with less hassle, or can it be used without solar to charge an EV? They then said no it is only to ease connecting your solar system to your house/grid.

IN other words since EVs are taking over market share worldwide faster then even I expected now, any company that can mention EV charging will get more interest, accurate or not.

With 100Amp service an electric range, electric dryer, central A/C, then plugging in a 50 Amp EV could brown out your house! So without upgrades you have to manage power like an RV where turning on a coffeemaker with the A/C running and your spouse using a blow dryer could trip the breaker and shut down power. Or upgrade the service to 100 Amps and upgrade the panel and grounds like I did.

If one is looking for a safe and cheaper way to charge an EV at home the NeoCharge might be the ticket.

As well, up here in Colorado, having 50 Amp EV charging and upgrades already done is a big selling point.

As well the 220 NEMA 14-50R like I have can also connect to an RV, welder etc. I thought to put the outlet at the front so if we get another RV I can put an additional weatherproof outlet on the other side of the garage wall next to the existing 50 amp outlet and install a pigtail wired to that outlet with the male plug on the other end of a 3 foot piece of 50 amp cable that can be plugged in and unplugged as needed so I can close the garage door and avoid another long heavy copper cable run. Then I can unplug my Tesla charger from the inside outlet, and plug in the outside outlet male plug if needed.

Edited October 6, 2022 by RV_

[RV_]

Darryl watch the NeoCharge video in the link.

[Darryl&Rita]

10 minutes ago, RV_ said:

Darryl watch the NeoCharge video in the link.

The only problem I foresee with the Smart Splitter is location. Not many houses in Canada have the laundry centre in the garage. By encouraging easy install, I see extension cords run through walls to get to the garage. Multiple NEC violations, as well as NFPA. 

[RV_]

Good thought Darryl. I am not an electrician, but can do easy stuff. I will need to check and be sure my idea of the outlet and plug in pigtail meets code. I have an electrician coming in tomorrow to relocate our entry switches in a pony wall we are removing at our front door, and relocated on the regular wall. Saturday we are having the entry area wood flooring replaced with tile by our tile guy. So I can check pricing and compliance tomorrow.

Yes our washer and dryer are on the inside of the garage wall. So it may be an issue when we get the Rivian if we stay in this house.

Thanks for prompting the questions that will apply if we move or not.👍🖖

Edited October 6, 2022 by RV_