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Help Please! New Battery Bank Install Now Lights, Pump, Water Heat, Fans Not Working Inside MH


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In the spirit of trying to give as much info as possible to hopefully have someone guide us how to resolve ..........

We have a 2003 Fleetwood Southwind and we just had to totally replace our old 2014 8 6V GC2 battery bank wired in series and parallel that had boiled quite the mess.  We have a Midnite 200 MPPT Charge Controller, a Magnum 2800 Inverter, 1000w of Solar and a remote Magnum Battery Monitor.   We now have a bank of 8 x brand new 232AH 6V GC2 Power Point Batteries wired in series and parallel to give 928ahs.   I still have yet to finalise tweak the settings on the Midnite and Remote BM but we have a problem Houston.  

We are really hoping we have reconnected all the wiring correctly, except for 3 items we have concern over.   Two Black cables (one thick one that comes from the Magnum back and another much thinner gauge one that comes from the Midnight) - we placed these on the back left hand side battery as seemed that was only how far they would reach to (hoping I can figure out how to attach photos here), and one damaged terminal connector from a small red/yellow collar cable we had to splice in a 12 gauge black replacement (this replacement might have been a gauge or two smaller than but all we could get locally).   Everything else was placed back where we believed it came from through drawings and photos, except those first 2 black cables.

TV, Res Fridge, Microwave Clock, TV, plugged in hair dryer all work on inverter mode.   Have turned the Aux and Main rocker switches above door up and down and back and forth and tried all the two types of lighting, ceiling fans, water pump, water heater, hood fan and none of them work

I've googled and Youtubed up down and sideways and can't seem to find any resolution.   There was mention of a reset button by one person on a manual breaker box (I have no idea where ours is to look???).   I have checked the panel box in the bedroom, I have checked the old converter under the fridge fuses 30A that are good, but have no idea what to do next.

Really appreciate you knowledgable electrical type guys guidance on where we go from here.   We were so looking forward to getting away this week for at least 4 nights fishing/kayaking, as haven't been out in her since returning from long trip in August 2019 because of "you know what" sadly.

Thanks so much everyone for your suggestions and guidance to get this resolved or how you resolved yours.

Helen.

PS:   Apologies I have no idea how to get my photos easily inserted here as won't accept them either dragged of URL pasted.   So I created a cut and paste in Pages doc and saved and can't fathom out how to add into my profile as an attachment.  I'll happily email anyone that wants to see, before, after battery set up etc if that would help you help me moreso.   Sheesh I'm useless in this techy world as well it seems :( 

 

Edited by FULLTIMEWANABE
added plugs working
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Here's the link to picture posting on this forum. Once you create a url, you then need to strip the [IMG] front and rear and use the Other Media button to paste the remaining url. Hope that helps. Jay

 

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Most Magnum Inverters recommend removing the POSITIVE cable first when dealing with house batteries (opposite of normal negative first convention) due to multiple ground paths.

That may have had an effect, also try resetting the inverters, see manual on how to do this.

Later...

Ray

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9 hours ago, FULLTIMEWANABE said:

 

We have a 2003 Fleetwood Southwind and we just had to totally replace our old 2014 8 6V GC2 battery bank wired in series and parallel that had boiled quite the mess.  We have a Midnite 200 MPPT Charge Controller, a Magnum 2800 Inverter, 1000w of Solar and a remote Magnum Battery Monitor.   We now have a bank of 8 x brand new 232AH 6V GC2 Power Point Batteries wired in series and parallel to give 928ahs.   I still have yet to finalise tweak the settings on the Midnite and Remote BM

We are really hoping we have reconnected all the wiring correctly, except for 3 items we have concern over.   Two Black cables (one thick one that comes from the Magnum back and another much thinner gauge one that comes from the Midnight) -   Everything else was placed back where we believed it came from through drawings and photos, except those first 2 black cables.

TV, Res Fridge, Microwave Clock, TV, plugged in hair dryer all work on inverter mode.   Have turned the Aux and Main rocker switches above door up and down and back and forth and tried all the two types of lighting, ceiling fans, water pump, water heater, hood fan and none of them work

I have checked the panel box in the bedroom, I have checked the old converter under the fridge fuses 30A that are good, but have no idea what to do next.

 

As I read your post, you lose me. Was it just batteries you replaced or did you add solar also? I imagine your 2800 watt invertor was added sometime since 2003 since you reference the old convertor under the fridge. Are you using a voltmeter to help your troubleshooting?

(two types of lighting, ceiling fans, water pump, water heater, hood fan and none of them work) seems that these some of these items may be run from the second convertor. Not being fully aware of what really has been done, my guess your your opportunity is the 2800 watt invertor area. Are you saying the BIG black cables from the back of the 2800 invertor may not wired correctly? Do you have more 2 BIG cables on the invertor.

BE CAREFUL WENT WORKING AROUND BATTERIES AS MAKING THE WRONG CONNECTOIN  CAN CAUSE AN EXPLOSION OR FIRE.

Clay

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Thanks Ray and Clay for responding.  Will reset the inverter as you suggested - everything was dead as a dodo when we discovered the mess on Spring start up (hubby had checked them and added water etc throughout winter every couple months prior, so we weren't able to do Magnums advice on remove positive first as we would have done in normal circumstances.   When I work out how to post  photos you'll see what was involved.  Thanks Jay on how to which I'll try get sorted later.   

Clay sorry didn't mean to lose you just trying give info on the RV in question age and type in case someone else with same rig could point us where to look on something.   The whole solar system and battery bank was installed in 2014 and apart from a boiling issue at front end and continual clean ups lasted until recently.  This past month we removed all batteries and cleaned up majorly (gotta love baking soda!) including scrubbing all connections 3 times over etc.    All we've done is replace the 8 GC2 batteries (hopefully we've reconnected correctly in series and parallel - did a drawing and took lots of photos of what was visible under the acid mess prior to hopefully help us.   I just mentioned the big black cable (there's a red POS one too) leading out from the back of the Magnum inverter we didn't have info on where that was connected prior so connected that to the first negative battery in the 8 bank, as well another much thinner cable coming from the midnight area.   Just mentioned in case we'd screwed up there somehow.

In a nutshell, whether on Shore Power, Generator or just batteries only things working are Microwave clock, plugs with hair dryer tested OK, TV, and Residential Fridge = all come on (haven't checked AC's yet!).   Just the lights, ceiling fans, water pump, water heater, hood fan (I think you call this 12V system???) aren't.   Bear with me I'm not electrically minded so doing my best.

When we bought this 2003 RV new there were 2 batteries under the steps and a small box type converter tightly hard to access under the fridge (still there but not sure how it affects things today???).   Irrespective we thought we'd just check the fuses in case last night but they seem good.

I do have a multimeter that I am new too LOL!   Checked batteries voltage as singles and then each set in series as we went.   Also learnt to use it to double check fuses last night = all read zeros so = good. 

 We are wondering if there is a breaker reset button or something that might be hidden somewhere we haven't found????    I'm wondering if we need to take the main panel off in the bedroom and delve into the tight fit behind and see if we can find anything in there that needs resetting.   I recall years ago when we had problems with our AC's and no RV dealership could work it out, someone told me behind that main breaker panel in the bedroom there's a small switch we needed to move and we did that and the A/C's worked.   There's no way on earth we'd have found it without someone guiding us back then and in Miami heat at the time we were eternally grateful to them.    We are hoping someone might be able to guide us and we will do whatever we can as advised to resolve this, so THANK YOU one and all.

Helen.

PS:   Over the past 18 years, we shake our heads at how inaccessible and all over the place so much of this electrical stuff is ie; original converter under the fridge can't access properly bolted to floor, that other area behind the panel in the bedroom so tight and have to hold panel whilst trying to do.   Fuse locations here there and everywhere. 

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2 hours ago, FULLTIMEWANABE said:

Just the lights, ceiling fans, water pump, water heater, hood fan (I think you call this 12V system???) aren't.  

That is correct. All of those items are 12V-dc(direct current) items so it would seem that you have no 12V. I would suspect that is either cables not yet connected, or connected wrong. 

2 hours ago, FULLTIMEWANABE said:

Also learnt to use it to double check fuses last night = all read zeros so = good. 

Did you remove the fuses and check with the ohm scale and read 0 ohms through the fuse? If you check across the fuse when in place by measuring voltage, a good fuse will read OV and an open (blown) one will read 12V, assuming that there is voltage applied to that fuse. You can check for voltage to the fuse by measuring from each side of the fuse to ground, which should then read the source voltage, in this case 12V.

2 hours ago, FULLTIMEWANABE said:

We are wondering if there is a breaker reset button or something that might be hidden somewhere we haven't found????    I'm wondering if we need to take the main panel off in the bedroom and delve into the tight fit behind and see if we can find anything in there that needs resetting.

The circuit breakers are only in the 120V-ac(alternating current) circuits and so would only affect the 12V site if there were a circuit breaker that supplies power to the converter (which may still be connected) and/or to the inverter-charger. To check a circuit breaker is to open it fully, then close it again. 

3 hours ago, FULLTIMEWANABE said:

Fuse locations here there and everywhere. 

As annoying as that is, since you seem to have no 12V power I would be very surprised if the problem was one of those hidden fuses. If you had 12V power before your battery work, then I would look very closely at the work that you have done and suspect something is connected wrong. 

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Thanks Kirk as always!    No we removed fuses and checked them to read 0000 on the multimeter.

I've been trying to source a basic uncomplicated diagram on line for a Solar to Battery bank, charge controller, inverter set up and with shunt (think I have one) and an in line fuse and some other goodies screwed on so I could maybe just trace back to ensure all connections to batteries are in the right place.   Series and parallels aside we have 8 connections to the battery bank, I know 2 big ones come from the inverter POS Red (secured to battery bank right hand side POS) & a black one secured to left hand side battery NEG.   Then I have the BTS from the magnum on first battery POS.   That's 3 of the 8 LOL, the others I am just about to go out again now before it gets dark to trace.   Just wish I had a diagram to check against but can't find an easy read basic one.       

We don't know what we had before (last time I used any of the 12V was August 2019 due to stay in place orders here, as when we opened up everything end April all was dead and corroded after all being checked and topped up battery wise, and appearing fine 2 months prior.

Time to head out again before it gets dark and try to start tracing all the cables and wires underneath and try find any more fuses/breakers we might have missed testing.   Will look into posting photos later on tonight when it's dark and can't do anything outside, in the hopes that might help you awesome folks guide me best.

Appreciate you all. 

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  Just a quick thought on your 12vdc not working. In the original 12vdc panel there should have been a 30 or 40 amp power supply fuse.

 

 In your year and make it would have been in the same compartment as the original converter.  Was the original converter above the fridge. I am try to think back in that time.

 

  But pictures will help greatly.

 

  Vern in a T-shirt 

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Posted (edited)

Thanks so much Wrknrvr yes we squeezed into that bolted to floor about 8inch high space it's crammed into coupled with dryer type extractor concertina piping and saw 2 x 30a fuses which we tested and were good yesterday.   Thank you very much, we are open to any and all suggestions.

Latest update from being out there just in case it's pertinent.   We went behind the panel in the bedroom (where you'd address slide issues, AC1, AC2 or Off) and there is a box marked IIRC Relay Delay or Transfer Relay Delay.   Also for whatever it might be worth, the intellec tank measure LEDs are working.  

We also thought we'd start the engine and check the external coach headlights, indicators, running lights, brakes, fogs and all good and voila, while engine was running some of the lights we had turned on inside came on.   While ignition was running all lights worked inside, water pump, hood fan, etc etc.   However, within seconds of the ignition being turned off they all died again.   I checked battery condition and it is reading 12.3V on the multimeter.

OK, so I'm now in for the night and about to read Jay's link on how to attach photos/files here.   Hope to have something for you all soon.

I also traced and labelled all the cables from source to battery connect, even going through 300A fuse or other hardware/items, understeps to getting underneath to Engine, and so on.    Will write more in detail on that later. 

Again sincere thanks for your patience and help guys you've no idea how appreciated it is.  Hubby said well if we leave the engine running all night we can go camping now.   LOL.      

Edited by FULLTIMEWANABE
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Posted (edited)

OK hoping I've got these photo URLs right!    Here's a very minor view of what we faced a week or so ago to clean up:  

JhSoyVvl.jpg

 

Here's after huge clean up and 3 times baking soda scrubbing of all cables wires etc 8 x 232ah 6V GC2 batteries installed in series and parallel:   

[tRYo3UVl.jpg

 

OK this seems to be working but some I've tried to upload are just spinning forever.  I'll try to upload 3 close ups of now we are all connected starting left to right.

ENgR2OQl.jpg 

JpszPGPl.jpg 

Sorry about the labels on this right hand side of bank, this was for hubby and I tracking where from and to and the original photo I took prior wouldn't upload, so just retook.

mx77KyRl.jpg

Edited by FULLTIMEWANABE
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OK so in a nutshell here is what and how we have connected everything up on the battery replacement going from left to right front and back. 1F 1R, 2F 2R, 3F 3R 4F 4R.

1st Left Front Battery = BTS (grey telephone lead from Magnum) connected to the POS Front Bat 1.    Magnum Black Main thick lead goes to Rear Bat 1 Negative as does a thinner cable from the Midnight Controller.

2nd Front & Rear Batteries, there is a wire that comes from the small Magnum Energy with green light that then splits into 2 (see above photos), with one going into a black fuse box (3A purple inside).   The prior to box split one is secured on the Rear Bat 2 NEG, and the split piece past the box goes to Front Bat 2 POS

This piece we had to replace as it was toast.

SP01NkMl.jpg 

We spliced in this as can be seen (black cable) in the photos above all connected now.   Been told we should have maybe gone to an 8 gauge as it seems a little thinner than original?   If this is by any means the culprit of our no 12V on shore, gen or battery bank power then absolutely we'll replace it from Amazon, but locally this one was the highest we could source. Cue0z87l.jpg 

   

3rd Front & Rear Batteries = just the parallel and series connectors.

4th Front & Rear (end of bank Right side) = The POS thick cable from the Magnum Inverter goes first into a 300A side mounted Connector and then on to the 4th Front POS, as does another cable from the Grey Triple switcher On/Off besides the Midnite Controller and another thick cable is also on this POS that leads under the steps (where the original pair of OEM batteries were until pre solar in 2014) into a Truck Star 150A waterproof reset, and then out and under the chassis up to the front Engine area Battery Coach inlet.

Thanks a mill for your patience and help folks.   This is certainly a labour of love we're finding, and not feeling much love so far from our ole gal.  Hubby keeps saying when we resolve the issue we'll kick ourselves the untold hours gone into it.

 

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I would find your original 12vdc fuse panel. What you say is not working is powered by that group of fuses. There should be a power feed wire on that board that you can see the wire size and color.

 

  Then go to the battery compartment. I would say that wire maybe hanging down somewhere, not hooked up. Yep found that on a job a few years back.

  Or that positive wire is on a negative post.

 

  Just my thinking.  Vern in a T-shirt 

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20 hours ago, FULLTIMEWANABE said:

This piece we had to replace as it was toast.

SP01NkMl.jpg 

 

You say this device is Toast, In what way? One of the pictures shows the red wired device wired in the circuit with the new black jumper. The black device appears to be a fuse ( or a relay minus a third wire), is it good? Looking at the size wire that is spliced into indicates that may be part of a relay coil circuit. Some switch (may be close to the door) would have to be turned ON to close a relay contact.  I say this believing that when you had the engine on everything worked. (While ignition was running all lights worked inside, water pump, hood fan, etc etc.   However, within seconds of the ignition being turned off they all died again.) If the ignition switch is in ACC position, do the DC lights work? Find the fuse panel that protect the inside lights, water pump, & etc, and you should have good clue to farther your troubleshooting,

Clay

 

 

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Thanks again Vern, alas I'm not sure we are getting anywhere very fast on this.  Still only lights and generator working when engine running, soon as switched off nothing except the 120/110 system.

Jv6u7uHl.jpg 

So this is our panel and the 12volt section is to the right with Red and Yellow wires.   I couldn't get a decent photo of the back as so dark and even tried balancing flashlights.   So these yellow and red wires appear to all go into a black concertina protector tube behind and then appears to go IDK where.   When we come out to the battery bank & next door bay, there is only one red wire of same gauge coming in (no yellow) and that has been connected on to the last right battery of the bank POS.

We had someone come by today who's a commercial/building electrician, and asked him to check the small splice hubby did to make sure there was nothing wrong with that connector (the one above grey wire that comes in and is split into 2 (one to negative back and the one after the black mini fuse box that hubby spliced goes to the front battery positive in that 12V grouping and in Photo 3 and 4 above.  He felt the original red wire and said feels like a 10gauge, so we put on the black/yellow extension which is 12gauge but he said it was good connection to battery from that mini fuse.

Thanks again Vern but still at a loss here.

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14 minutes ago, ms60ocb said:

You say this device is Toast, In what way? One of the pictures shows the red wired device wired in the circuit with the new black jumper. The black device appears to be a fuse ( or a relay minus a third wire), is it good? Looking at the size wire that is spliced into indicates that may be part of a relay coil circuit. Some switch (may be close to the door) would have to be turned ON to close a relay contact.  I say this believing that when you had the engine on everything worked. (While ignition was running all lights worked inside, water pump, hood fan, etc etc.   However, within seconds of the ignition being turned off they all died again.) If the ignition switch is in ACC position, do the DC lights work? Find the fuse panel that protect the inside lights, water pump, & etc, and you should have good clue to farther your troubleshooting,

Clay

 

 

Thanks Clay so much for trying to help.  The ring piece that connects to the battery just fell off totally during cleaning due to corrosion eating it.   Yes that Black device is a purple 3 fuse and we have tested it seeming good a commercial electrician friend also tested the fuse to the add on hubby did connecting to the battery today and said it was good but he couldn't understand why the wires were split (he hasn't a clue on RV electrics he said but that was his comment).   We have no idea what these two split wires do that show in photo 3 and 4 above.   They are coming from behind the grey wire and this leads back to that mini magnum energy box in the next door bay to the left  Connected to this mini magnum energy box is also the NETWORK cable from the inverter.   The only switches we are aware of are the 3 on that Grey box to right of the Midnite as seen in photo 9 above, that we use to switch off the Midnite and I think? the inverter.

OK bear with this gal with no tech name recognition for the most part.  So I turn the ignition once and nothing, second turn we wait for the beeping assume this is the ACC position you reference above?    At this second turn NO LIGHTS but for what it's worth I can hear a faint slight "thud" almost from outside???  we wait for the beeping to stop always before we then turn ignition to start engine.   Once engine starts it takes about 30 seconds before we see the lights come on inside the rig (both styles light up when engine running).

The fuse panel I show in photo above in response to Vern.   We are just totally at a loss and my hair is thinning more day by day LOL.

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10 hours ago, FULLTIMEWANABE said:

this is our panel and the 12volt section is to the right with Red and Yellow wires.

I suspect that the 3 red wires that connect into a common terminal block are the 12V supply and the 2 yellow on the other block may be ground connections. Have you measured the voltage between those 2 blocks? Also check between each block and ground. If you don't have any voltage there, start the engine to get things 12V working and then measure between the two again and also from each one to chassis ground.

You could also remove all power (both 120V and 12V) and then use your ohm scale to trace back to see where they go. I would first measure from the block with the yellow wires to ground to determine if that is what they are. If it is, the reading should be 0 Ω from the block to chassis ground. If it is much more than that, probably not. 

It is possible that the 3 read wires each come from a different 12V source, 1 from the batteries, 1 from the chassis 12V system, and the other from your converter. 

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   The previous post I did was supposed to be sent yesterday.

 

 

   But now with the 12vdc panel picture we can test things.  Do you have a meter. If not you need one to continue.

  My next suggestion is to pull a fuse from the fuse block. Then test for continuity from the fuse base on the side by the red wires. I am 99 percent sure the red wires are supposed to be 12vdc supply. Do not do that without pulling the fuse.  To do this you need the meter set for a ohm reading or continuity.

when you are testing voltage do not have the meter for continuity.

  Now you can test for 12vdc.      Set the meter to dc voltage.    Touch one lead to the case of the 12vdc panel. Then the other to the red wires.if there is no power on the red, then try the yellow wire.

 

  I would bet there is no 12vdc power to that panel.

 

 

  Vern in a T-shirt 

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  I did post previous statements before reading Kirk’s post.

  If your lights work with engine running and not with engine off.  There has to be a wire not hooked up. Or it is on a ground post.  

  If one had a tone generator that wire could be traced to the other end.

  Vern 

Edited by Wrknrvr
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   Now thinking back in time if you had batteries under the steps . There could be a insulated post that those wires go to and then have another wire go to the batteries.

 

  Think,    Vern

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  There has to be a fuse from the batteries to the 12vdc panel.

 

  That clunk you hear sorta outside when the switch is turned on. Locate that noise. It is a relay. Probably in a metal box on the firewall under the hood. Usually on the area near the steering column.

  There maybe a fuse in there that is blown.

  If you take the cover off that box. Post a picture of it. Try to remember what you May have in that box. If there is a box.

 

just thinking,    Vern

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11 hours ago, FULLTIMEWANABE said:

 

Jv6u7uHl.jpg 

So this is our panel and the 12volt section is to the right with Red and Yellow wires. 

 

Your picture is enough to generate more questions. In the bottom half there are 4 devices. Two have white labels and two with white print  What are these devices?

Do you know what devices each fuse serves? Do you measure 12 volts at any of the fuses, both when the engine running  and not running?

WRKNRVR has you and the right path. It will should be a simple fix but location, location.

Clay

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As I re-read this thread I started, I'm sure many reading it will think what a silly woman, and maybe, just maybe there'll be a small handful of others that think "well give her, her due she doesn't give up". Well the latter after today is about what I was going to do but look what happened.

Clay and Vern, I don't know how to thank you enough for your patience with this gal who doesn't know much difference between an apple and an orange never mind all the electrical side of things but.............

Where's that "happy dance" icon?    We have 12VDC power inside and drum roll .......... the generator now works again on the upfront rocker switch.

As a last kick of the cat on my part, and with untold support also from Chad Heiser, who without a shadow of doubt we would have gone to professionally for a resolution "if" we were able to get over the border and close to Santa Rosa (anyone not prepared to endure self troubleshooting like we did we so recommend him highly for design and solar/battery install/repair), I went out this morning and instead of going from left to right I decided to start from right to left of the battery bank.   So I looked at every cable one at a time holding it and tracing it back (for the 4th or 5th time!).   On cable 3 I discovered it was trapped kinda and buried down the back of the bank of batteries.   I managed to free it and voila!   At the end was another metal battery connector (lug?).   All excited I went into hubby and told him our 8 connections were now going to be 9 and where did it go?   We spent the next hour going over and over my pre-dismantle photos and videos and also it wasn't showing on my drawing sketch I'd done.   Eventually we discovered it showing on the first left rear battery negative terminal.   Between rain we managed to connect it and there you have it.

I can't thank awesome folks like you Clay, Vern (and Jay on the photo link!), enough for being so gawd darn patient with someone who talks about measuring tapes as 3 inches and 2 digits (I never know whether to say 1/8th or 1/16th), and a screw driver has stars or flat ends = I never had any experience with anything mechanical or electrical until after we were RVing for a handful of years and got tired of dealerships and others not resolving things we had wrong under warranty or even doing our winterising we paid them to do properly as we had leaks every spring the first 3 years till we then started doing it ourselves including washer/dryer & ice maker = in frustration came here and you guys told me how to resolve things they didn't and they'd had our RV for weeks at a time).   Anyway THANK YOU one and all.   

Now to await the arrival of the 85W-90 GL5 oil from Amazon (daughter ordered it as not into that either!), so I can put the mechanics hat on and check our Front Wet Hubs and apparently differential at the back also.   Just learned from Ed Grey that a differential looks like a Banjo or Pumpkin and I just gotta pull the plug and check fluid not milky/yellow, and if is will get it professionally drained, if not we'll top up.  LOL.

At least you can tell I'm still smiling, still willing to learn and Adam Sandler's got nothing on me.     Hope each and everyone on Escapees has a truly wonderful summer and your travels create special memories.

Edited by FULLTIMEWANABE
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