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Oops, I was WRONG......


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A while back, someone asked which trucks would do better off road, or at least off pavement.  I responded that KW's have larger air lines to the suspension, allowing them to react faster and thus retain traction.   Well, ours does not.  Without actually measuring, it appears the T-680 has the same size lines as the Volvo.  I had based my assumption on a truck I was poking around in a welding shop yard one time.  It had huge air lines running from bag to bag.

So, I was wrong, and hope I didn't lead anyone astray.

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Boy oh boy....sure glad I was never wrong.....

Not having a spare KW laying around here at Last Chance Peak Geezer Kamp .....I looked around for something to test your air bag concept.......

Dollymama's 1987 Hints 250 Fourtrax has two big fat round air bag looking tires at each end of the back axle.....so......I inflated them to the high limit of 3psi and blasted off to the edge of DEATH VALLEY.....in a one hour ride I ONLY saw one rattlesnake and two coyotes but the air bags worked well....not sure what size air line to use to hook them together.....

No.....I have not dipped into the cheep rum.... yet.....

Please advise on air line size and routing ....

 

Drive on..... rattlesnake has the right of way..... Always....

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howdy Dolly 

rick - KW AG400 40K and AG460 46K tandem suspensions have 4 air springs per axle and “good sized” air lines. Single trunnions between the axles on 54” axle spacing and the low sway bars connected to the axles with big flat spring steel looking bars. Torque arms in a V attached to the top of the differentials.

KW “AG380” 38K has a half circle spring affair and 2 air springs per axle. I’m not sure what the air lines look like. This suspension was developed as a “Paccar” component used by Pete and KW. It is light and has a comfortable ride. We never saw it in our market due to KW limiting the max GCW. 

AG460 (and 400) are 4 link designs that stop axle wrap and frame lifting when starting a load or putting driveline angles to the point where a truck will rumble and shake from stem to stern when your 2050lbs-ft engine is in 18 speed gear #3 hauling 60 or 80 tons up a grade at 5mph... *

* if your RV rig weighs this much suggest a weight loss program 🤣

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 The "best" suspension design for mobility off highway is the walking beam design. Single spring per side, whether it be leaf, elastomer or air, and both axles tied together via beam on a single pivot, is not only superior off road, but also uneven terrain in a delivery lot or paved camp ground with dips and bumps. Does'nt ride very well, but will get one further into trouble.

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  • 4 weeks later...
1 hour ago, Pete Kildow said:

The old Ag100 8 bag would follow the ground with a load. Also most added the big air line kit to most of those also. Even coming out of a field,  hauling grain. That Ag100 would come out where others could not.

 

Yes they do. 

What AG100 does not do well is get used in a convert a tractor to a straight truck (which is not approved by Kenworth) especially in a high c of g application.

 

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On 4/4/2021 at 11:03 AM, Deezl Smoke said:

 The "best" suspension design for mobility off highway is the walking beam design. Single spring per side, whether it be leaf, elastomer or air, and both axles tied together via beam on a single pivot, is not only superior off road, but also uneven terrain in a delivery lot or paved camp ground with dips and bumps. Does'nt ride very well, but will get one further into trouble.

Yes. See "Chalmers suspensions" 

See "Raydan suspensions" 

See "Hendrickson Haulmaxx"

An interesting one is Kenworth "Big Six" 

And KW 100,000lbs walking beam tandem - no springs, just a trunnion and walking beam - the tires are the suspension. These are for fully growed trucks...

I've rented 2 different flatbeds - one pintle hitch and one goose neck - both had long spread walking beams - like 72" or more axle spread - with no springs. They rode fine and were super stable with the loads - a 14 x 32ft x 12ft prefab barn and a 160hp 4x4 farm tractor - fluid - etc

Anyways tires are part 1 of suspension - inflate them correctly for the load. 

Edited by noteven
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3 hours ago, noteven said:

Yes they do. 

What AG100 does not do well is get used in a convert a tractor to a straight truck (which is not approved by Kenworth) especially in a high c of g application.

 

Ran a tri-axle dump truck grossing 74,000 lbs with a Ag100. I will say it was fun dumping. But ran that truck 7 months never even got close to laying it over. And standing a 16ft dump bed up on soft ground. Well it sure makes for a fun week. But it would in no way be my choice for a dump truck.

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22 hours ago, noteven said:

Yes. See "Chalmers suspensions" 

See "Raydan suspensions" 

See "Hendrickson Haulmaxx"

An interesting one is Kenworth "Big Six" 

And KW 100,000lbs walking beam tandem - no springs, just a trunnion and walking beam - the tires are the suspension. These are for fully growed trucks...

I've rented 2 different flatbeds - one pintle hitch and one goose neck - both had long spread walking beams - like 72" or more axle spread - with no springs. They rode fine and were super stable with the loads - a 14 x 32ft x 12ft prefab barn and a 160hp 4x4 farm tractor - fluid - etc

Anyways tires are part 1 of suspension - inflate them correctly for the load. 

 Yep. The longer the spread, the better the ride. Have you looked much at the M9xx series military 6x6 rear suspension systems? I'd be curious what your thoughts are. It's not a physical walking beam, but the characteristics are similar.

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17 minutes ago, Deezl Smoke said:

 Yep. The longer the spread, the better the ride. Have you looked much at the M9xx series military 6x6 rear suspension systems? I'd be curious what your thoughts are. It's not a physical walking beam, but the characteristics are similar.

The springs form an "upside down" walking beam - torque arms to locate the axles - it would have lots of articulation I bet, and ground clearance.

Mack "camelback" suspension is kind of like that.  Proprietary Mack axles are top loaders. 

My back is getting sore just remembering these not air ride suspensions 🤣

 

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On 4/30/2021 at 6:32 AM, noteven said:

The springs form an "upside down" walking beam - torque arms to locate the axles - it would have lots of articulation I bet, and ground clearance.

Mack "camelback" suspension is kind of like that.  Proprietary Mack axles are top loaders. 

My back is getting sore just remembering these not air ride suspensions 🤣

 

 

 Normally I would say "those sure were the days...." (hinting of how great they were). Glad those days are gone. Experienced them, but glad they are gone and behind us.

 

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16 hours ago, rickeieio said:

I had an uncle who grew up farming with horses and mules, and the earliest tractors.  In his later years, he would say, "The good old days, is now."

100% true, I have heard people talk about the good old days. I lived though some of those good old days. And will take now over, no ac, and old tractors and a John Deere 40 Combine. Those were good old days. The last day I had to work on that combine was for sure a good old day.

 

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