Vaccine approved first shots within 24 hours

[Barbaraok]

9 minutes ago, JimK said:

If the conclusions were so clear and the need is so high, why do you suppose 5 experts on the panel would not approve the Pfizer vaccine even for emergency use?

There were questions on whether it should be approved for teenagers and why pregnant women weren't included.  A few wanted more testing.  Very seldom is there 100% agreement on these things, often a few will want more tests, more info, etc.   Sometimes taking extra time won't results in tens of thousands dying, which isn't the case here.    But don't take it if you are so concerned, just don't expect sympathy if you refuse and then get the virus.

[Jaydrvr]

1 hour ago, Randyretired said:

The drug companies certainly were spectacular.   For weeks ahead of the approval the press even stated that approval is virtually approved and gave percentages of how well the vaccines were working.  Obviously the drug companies did a fabulous job of assembling the data.  Enough so that the UK approved it a week before the US.  While a week wouldn't  seem like much over a million more people contracted covid during that time and hundreds died.    Did the UK know something the FDA didn't? Since each came to the same conclusion are we saying the UK didn't do due diligence?  After the committee voted for approval there was another delay until management signed off.  These timeframes are short but it is hard for many to understand a week more to come to the same conclusion.

The difference in timing between the UK and the US is that the UK was in the loop from the beginning. They didn't rush it or shortcut anything. They just kept up to date with the data as it came in, so they were prepared to make a quick determination. The US FDA started a couple weeks ago with a blank sheet of paper, so of course it took some time to go through all the data and check it. Given the massive size and inherent inertia of the FDA, I think they did reasonably well. Jay

[Barbaraok]

1 hour ago, Randyretired said:

 These timeframes are short but it is hard for many to understand a week more to come to the same conclusion.

Different protocols, different steps to reach conclusions.  

[JimK]

I wonder if the 5 panel members who refused to support the emergency release of the Pfizer vaccine will personally delay immunization.  I suspect that is the case because, based on their expertise in the field, they weighed the risks of additional deaths versus the need for more studies.  At this point I doubt it makes much difference.  Surveys have shown a lot of concern about Covid vaccines.  There is a concerted effort to counter that and that effort will not be based on facts or education.  The strategy is to harness the power of group psych (aka herd mentality) to create a sense of popular support, support from popular/respected individuals and even a feeling of competition in being able to get the vaccine before others.  With such a strategy, there is little reason to consider the science and in fact that would be counterproductive.   Randyretired already exemplifies the desired group opinion and the feeling that we need to act promptly so other countries do not get ahead of us.  Watching the manipulation of human behavior is going to be more interesting than any science involved with the vaccine release.

[hemsteadc]

I'm glad to see the  forum has the 'Expand' feature on quoting entire gigantic posts.

[Randyretired]

58 minutes ago, JimK said:

I wonder if the 5 panel members who refused to support the emergency release of the Pfizer vaccine will personally delay immunization.  I suspect that is the case because, based on their expertise in the field, they weighed the risks of additional deaths versus the need for more studies.  At this point I doubt it makes much difference.  Surveys have shown a lot of concern about Covid vaccines.  There is a concerted effort to counter that and that effort will not be based on facts or education.  The strategy is to harness the power of group psych (aka herd mentality) to create a sense of popular support, support from popular/respected individuals and even a feeling of competition in being able to get the vaccine before others.  With such a strategy, there is little reason to consider the science and in fact that would be counterproductive.   Randyretired already exemplifies the desired group opinion and the feeling that we need to act promptly so other countries do not get ahead of us.

You completely misunderstand my thoughts on this.  I don't care about getting ahead of these other countries as I pointed out more than a million people here in the US contracted covid during that week and hundreds have DIED.   It took the US twice as long as the UK to reach the same conclusion from the time the study data was released. IT seems logical with the magnitude of this pandemic to ask why and what can be learned.  Is there a better way?  When families are losing loved ones it is hard to accept.  It was posted that the UK was in the loop from the start and therefore had a head start.  That makes sense to me and would seem to give the personnel a chance to explore and study this without holding up any outcome.  Good or bad.  In fact it would seem to give them more time to dissect the data.  The race here is to save lives and get our economy going.

[Kirk W]

50 minutes ago, Randyretired said:

t took the US twice as long as the UK to reach the same conclusion from the time the study data was released.

That could mean that the FDA was more cautious than the Medicines and Healthcare products Regulatory Agency (MHRA) of the United Kingdom. The fact is that no government agency ever seems to be able to satisfy everyone today. Just as some are now criticizing the FDA for going too slowly, others are questioning their approval of the vaccine. Then throw in the current political fighting in the country and the job that they were given is impossible but they did their very best and most of us are in agreement with their action.