Vaccine approved first shots within 24 hours

[bigjim]

13 minutes ago, GlennWest said:

I have never taken a flu shot. Something interesting happened to me last October. I got very sick. Couldn't work sick. Went to urgent care and checked me for flu. Don't have flu but all the systems. So he treated it aggressively and I got better. Drawn blood and  took x-rays. Sent me a letter and a text that they retested my blood and found Corvis virus. I called them up and said there wasn't any virus that early. He told me they are finding their was. 

Interesting and that would not surprise me that it was around much longer than we currently know.  Maybe some folks had not bought or sold stocks yet.

[Barbaraok]

38 minutes ago, GlennWest said:

I have never taken a flu shot. Something interesting happened to me last October. I got very sick. Couldn't work sick. Went to urgent care and checked me for flu. Don't have flu but all the systems. So he treated it aggressively and I got better. Drawn blood and  took x-rays. Sent me a letter and a text that they retested my blood and found Corvis virus. I called them up and said there wasn't any virus that early. He told me they are finding their was. 

Yes, this is happening a lot, especially on the West Coast.   We know think my aunt, who passed away very quickly in Everett, WA  the first part of January, might have had COVID based upon how quickly she became ill and developed pneumonia and died.  She had emphysema (very high risk) and was 90.  She was cremated, so no way to check, but given what we have been hearing, I would not be surprised if it was here much, much earlier than we thought.   The virus, in the wild, had been identified a few years ago as one that could jump to humans, like the SARS virus.  

[Barbaraok]

35 minutes ago, bigjim said:

defintion-  my deceased ex-wifes surviving spouse.  AKA my kids step father.

Ah yes, family definitions can take a diagram to keep straight. 😁

[bigjim]

somewhat related.  I wonder if there will be less flu and common colds this winter due to mask wearing. Not meant to hijack just to comment.  I was pretty happy to have mine on the other day just to keep my face warmer in the wind.

[GlennWest]

Only time I wear one is if store demands it. I hate them. Fogs my glasses up.

[Kirk W]

1 minute ago, bigjim said:

I wonder if there will be less flu and common colds this winter due to mask wearing.

I recently read a story here in the Dallas area that indicated that has been the initial indications. Also the number of kids not in a classroom has the same effect since children are the primary spreaders of colds and flu. 

 

[Barbaraok]

Yes, the incidence of flu is way down this season.  Follows what Australia and New Zealand say last summer (their winter).  Turns out that the same things you do to prevent Covid 19 transmission works to stop flu transmission.   So more people got flu vaccinations this year, and are wearing masks, washing hands, as Kirk noted, lots of kids are in virtual classrooms and they are a major transmission point for flu each winter.  Maybe people will keep their masks on hands for flu outbreaks in the coming years - there is a reason you see pictures of  so many in Asian countries wearing masks during their flu seasons.  

Glenn, to reduce fogging make sure that the glasses sit on top of the mask (holding it down), breathe through your nose (greatly reduces amount of vapor in the exhaled air) and use a lens wipe on the glasses ahead of time.  

Edited December 15, 2020 by Barbaraok

[2gypsies]

For the skeptics out there.....

Pfizer's vaccine consisted of 44,000 participants.  170 got the virus and 162 of them were in the placebo group.

Moderna's vaccine consisted of 30,000 participants.  95 got the virus and 90 of them were in the placebo group.

The vaccine cannot give you the virus because it doesn't contain the virus.  It works differently than other vaccines.

A recap.... 74,000 total received the vaccine.  265 got the virus.  13 of the 265 received the actual vaccine but they couldn't have gotten the virus from the vaccine because the vaccine doesn't contain the virus.

The cases were from being in the outside community.  As you can see from the numbers above, even with those that received the actual vaccine the vaccine is not 100% if you mingle with the public.  Chances are even slimmer of getting the virus from the general public if the general public all receives the vaccine.

A extraordinary percentage of efficacy in the 90's which these are, is unheard of for other vaccines.  It's an awesome percentage.  These vaccines are proven to be safe and you definitely don't have to "wait and see".  They've been tested.  That's why trials are done before they're approved.  I hope everyone does their part in controlling this virus.  

(By the way, we both worked at Upjohn Pharmaceutical who was bought out by Pfizer.  We've been in that Kalamazoo building that is in the news.  We've worked on many studies over the years.  Makes us proud to have even the smallest remote connection.)

https://www.statnews.com/2020/11/18/pfizer-biontech-covid19-vaccine-fda-data/

 

[Kirk W]

14 minutes ago, 2gypsies said:

They've been tested.  That's why trials are done before they're approved. 

Nonetheless, we all have that option if it will make them feel better, more confident, or safer. 

Edited December 15, 2020 by Kirk W

[Barbaraok]

And of those few that got the virus even after being immunized, NONE DIED nor had to be intubated.  No vaccine is 100% effective, but all tend to provide some help in that they destroy a lot of the virus thus lessening the impact of the disease.   

[Big Rick]

2 hours ago, bigjim said:

You don't know what your are missing.😄

Getting to miss a good dose of Mercury! They safe it is “ safe” but many countries have banned it.

[Big Rick]

2 hours ago, bigjim said:

Goes to show what luck coupled with skill can do.  Even in a firefight I will be happy with luck.  C'mon Big5ver you would have risked a bullet how about a vaccination. 

Yeah, we have risked a bullet, but we knew what we were facing! Seems no one wants to address that people who have reactions to some drugs should not take the vaccine.

[bigjim]

I have high blood pressure, chronic ideopathic cardio-myopathy, atrial fibulation, and glaucoma and am a stroke rislk, all controlled by ta-da medications, all with possible side effects.  Yet based on it all being in control, they renewed my drivers license until 2029 yesterday. I might be a bigger threat to you than the vaccine.  It is all a matter of perspective.  Part of my perspective is I don't care what you do but the other part is even though I don't even know you, I do care about you.  You will do what you will and I will have spouted off my 2 cents worth to give you a different perspective to consider.

[Randyretired]

It seems the decision to take the vaccine is a personal choice and there are some who can not take it.  My DW may be one of them.

[sandsys]

On 12/14/2020 at 4:47 AM, Jinx & Wayne said:

If you think something does not deserve comment, don't comment.  If you think it has been hased to death, don't bother to read it.

So "don't comment" and "don't...read it" are not telling me what to do?  I guess I do read that differently than you do. I'm not offended by it but I can see others feeling that way who might not say so.

Linda

[JimK]

I had a flu shot about 20 years ago.  I got really, really sick with all the symptoms of a really bad case of flu.  About 10 years ago I got talked into trying it again.  Within a few minutes of getting the shot my throat started to close up.  I sat at the clinic for about an hour and the tightness passed.  That was my last flu shot.

A few months ago, my family doc pushed hard.  She wanted me to have a pneumonia and a flu shot.  I agreed to have the pneumonia shot.  Immediately after she started in again on recommending the flu shot.  I was about to agree when the reaction to the pneumonia shot started.  I got what felt like electric shocks up and down my spine into the back of my legs.  I came close to ending up on floor with the shocks, pain, and associated spasms.  She told me it was too quick to be an allergic reaction.  I must of sat in the chair wrong.  Wrong. Wrong.  I never felt anything in my life like that.  Fortunately it passed, leaving me in bed sick for close to a week with flu like symptoms and minor spasms.

At least millions of people will be ahead of me before I need to consider whether to take the Covid vaccine and which variety to try.

[2gypsies]

Ingredients in Covid vaccine:

https://covidvaccine.mo.gov/facts/

[Jinx & Wayne]

5 hours ago, bigjim said:

Linda is pretty sharp but I think she read this one wrong.  At the same time I had to think about it a minute.

I think she was making a humorous comment about my execrable lack of clarity.  I should have said that the exercise of free will allows you to either decline or to opt, to comment or read.

[GR "Scott" Cundiff]

Here's an informative, interesting article on how the vaccine was developed so quickly:

How They Made a Vaccine So Fast (lifehacker.com)

For those who don't want to read, some of the main points are:

1. Viruses like SARS and MERS are in the same family as this one - so much research was already done
2. Considerable work had already been done in developing this type of vaccine (nothing of the virus, itself, is in it)
3. The government cut a lot of red tape - for instance the FDA promises new drug reviews within 10 months of their submission - in this case they reviewed it in 3 weeks.
4. The pandemic got worse - normally, people in the trials are given either the drug or the placebo and then there's a longer wait to see who gets sick and who doesn't.  The more people getting the virus, the quicker researchers can tell how effective (or not) the vaccine is.
5. The government guaranteed payment enabling companies to actually start making the vaccine before it was approved.  Normally, they don't do that because of the financial risk.

Edited December 15, 2020 by GR "Scott" Cundiff

[Barbaraok]

3 hours ago, Big Rick said:

Yeah, we have risked a bullet, but we knew what we were facing! Seems no one wants to address that people who have reactions to some drugs should not take the vaccine.

If the drugs one is allergic to contains the same solvent (non reactive organic molecule, often a glycol) then one should discuss with their physician.  It isn’t that they shouldn’t get the vaccine, but rather the risk assessment needs to be made, maybe a different vaccine chosen, or given in a hospital setting where reactions can be handled and mitigate with appropriate fluids, antihistamines, etc.

Edited December 15, 2020 by Barbaraok

[Barbaraok]

JimK, Any one look at the carriers in those vaccines to see what was common?  You describe something similar to the onset of a cytokines storm which has killed a lot of health care workers who died from at the beginning of the pandemic.  The immune systems over react and dump huge amounts of histamines and flood body with fluid.  There are several techniques for managing the deliverance of the vaccine for highly allergic people. 

[Big Rick]

1 hour ago, Barbaraok said:

JimK, Any one look at the carriers in those vaccines to see what was common?  You describe something similar to the onset of a cytokines storm which has killed a lot of health care workers who died from at the beginning of the pandemic.  The immune systems over react and dump huge amounts of histamines and flood body with fluid.  There are several techniques for managing the deliverance of the vaccine for highly allergic people. 

The testing excluded reactive subjects. Maybe the makers know more than you do.

[JimK]

1 hour ago, Barbaraok said:

JimK, Any one look at the carriers in those vaccines to see what was common?  .....

After my allergic reaction to the flu shot I went to see an allergist.  He had no clue.

The family doc gave me a hot pad to put on my back when the spasms and twitching started with the pneumonia shot.  I doubt she really believed it was a reaction to the vaccine.  I know for sure I have never had anything like that before.   I have had pulled and injured back muscles several times in the past.  They were completely different.

I was not at all happy to read that the Brits issued a warning on the Pfizer vaccine warning after a couple of cases of severe reactions.  The officials in the US did not want to hear any of it.  Obviously there is a big rush issue and no one wants to hear any cautions or need for additional studies or monitoring.

Over the years I have had many dealings with the FDA regarding medical devices.  I have no faith in their process.  It is highly bureaucratic and, much worse, highly politicized and has been for many decades.   The FDA does a very, very unreliable poor job especially for common food supplements and home remedies.  Here is a great example.  True SNAKE OIL,  excuse me alligator oil:

https://caimon.com/pages/why-caimon-oil

[bigjim]

Really confused about the link to caimon oil

 

 

 

[Kirk W]

2 minutes ago, bigjim said:

Really confused about the link to caimon oil

Me too. The FDA has nothing to do with cosmetics and that is what it is listed as. I did an FDA drug search and caimon oil isn't there.