Guns/storage/Canada

[ralelo]

Any tips for gun storage spots near Blaine, etc? Thanks!

[Optimistic Paranoid]

I assume you mean Blaine, WA.  Are you going up to Alaska, or are you intending a trip in Canada to their National Parks, etc.?

You can take an ordinary rifle or shotgun to Canada just by filling out the right paperwork and paying a small fee.  'Protection from Wild Animals' is an acceptable reason to put on the forms, at least in the west.  They'd probably not accept that in the Atlantic Maritime provinces.

As far as getting a handgun to and from Alaska, they can be shipped.  See:

http://www.wolfhawkshipping.com/shipping-guns-to-or-from-alaska

[Big5er]

Good info to have. I'm gonna hang on to that link.....Thanks John

[Optimistic Paranoid]

I actually learned about this place by watching a YouTube video by a guy who shipped his guns this way.  If you want to watch the video yourself, here it is:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aBHq413a654

[jcussen]

I use Bellingham Pawn, right off the freeway. Pawn charges for a week are about $4. Paperwork, I have a CHL, take about 5 min.

[Big5er]

If I am correct, to get a gun back at a pawn shop it's a transfer,. just like a sale...and you have to be a resident of that state. 

[jcussen]

2 hours ago, Big5er said:

If I am correct, to get a gun back at a pawn shop it's a transfer,. just like a sale...and you have to be a resident of that state. 

Been doing it for 3 yrs, ever since Wa. state passed no gun work in gun shops for non residents. Will be doing it again in two weeks on my yearly trip to BC. Guy at pawn shop told me last year he gets pawns from people all over the country doing the same thing.

Edit: I am from Texas and do not have the knowledge of many of the forum members, I am just passing on what I have been doing for many years, first at  gun shops and now at a pawn shop. Just my personal experience, everyone should do what they are comfortable with.

[Yarome]

1 hour ago, Big5er said:

If I am correct, to get a gun back at a pawn shop it's a transfer,. just like a sale...and you have to be a resident of that state. 

Some do. I don't know if it's right to say "most", but that's been my experience when inquiring. I've heard people say they've used pawn shops with no transfers or additional fees, but I've never found one... or looked hard enough(?) Even without a loan they want to use your firearm as collateral for the storage fee. Then they "may" try and hit you up for a transfer fee (after the fact) on top of the storage fee saying that they can't turn a firearm over to an individual without meeting state requirements.

I've had pretty good luck at gun shops, as many regularly offer storage, or you can always put it in for a cleaning and just take awhile to pick it up. Most places are gonna take a few days to a week or two to get around to cleaning it, anyway. Most near U.S./Canada border crossings are familiar with the need and more than happy to oblige for a fee.

A bank safe deposit box is also an option. Most banks will have a "no firearms" clause in the rental agreement, but what you put in your own box is your own business... and it isn't illegal to violate a banks rules. The worst that can happen is for them to cancel your rental agreement and ask you to retrieve your property.

If you're comfortable with that sort of thing... I know folks that do that regularly without issue.

I've even heard of folks using public transportation lockers. 

My problem has sometimes been that some gun shops will only store factory loaded and boxed ammo. I also carry more than will fit in a safe deposit box or transpo locker from time to time.

The least hassle way I've found is simply to rent a storage closet. Some places will even prorate the monthly fee or simply charge you a per/day fee if you won't be gone long and explain you only need to store a couple of medium sized boxes between moves (they don't necessarily need to know you mean from point "a'" to point "b" and back) for "X" number of days. I've often been assigned very large units (undoubtedly, unrented units they had an abundance of vacancies in that particular sized unit) when I only asked for a closet. The negotiated fee was the same... and my fee might possibly have ended up in someones pocket... but in some cases "don't ask, don't tell" is agreeable for both parties. 😉

That being said... you DO still want to have a signed rental agreement.

[Optimistic Paranoid]

Here's what ATF has to say on the subject of retrieving pawned guns:

https://www.atf.gov/firearms/qa/whom-may-pawnbroker-return-pawned-firearm

[Twotoes]

I have a simple solution. I don't go to Canada or Mexico either.

[Kirk W]

I just leave my firearms with our son when traveling over either border. We don't go places that I'd not feel safe when unarmed anyway. 

[Onthego]

We fulltime traveled for nearly 7 years never needed or wanted to carry a gun. Just sayin'. We traveled all around the USA, some western Canada (2012) and the Baja Peninsula of Mexico (2015). Moved into sticks& bricks 5/2018.

Jeff   😊    

[Big5er]

17 minutes ago, Onthego said:

We fulltime traveled for nearly 7 years never needed or wanted to carry a gun. Just sayin'. We traveled all around the USA, some western Canada (2012) and the Baja Peninsula of Mexico (2015). Moved into sticks& bricks 5/2018.

Jeff   😊    

I've carried on duty and off for the last 33 years. I doubt I will change anytime soon.
While I respect your choice, I personally believe it's like car insurance and a fire extinguisher. I'd rather have it and not need it than need it and not have it. I've known a lot of people that say "I've never needed my gun...until today". 

[Optimistic Paranoid]

1 hour ago, Onthego said:

We fulltime traveled for nearly 7 years never needed or wanted to carry a gun. Just sayin'. We traveled all around the USA, some western Canada (2012) and the Baja Peninsula of Mexico (2015). Moved into sticks& bricks 5/2018.

Jeff   😊    

Congratulations!  You've successfully gotten through life - so far, at least - relying entirely on dumb luck.  You never happened to be in the wrong place at the wrong time.  Some of us prefer NOT to rely on dumb luck.

[jcussen]

Agree, lost my faith in the  ".goodness of mankind" a long time ago. Like the old Boy Scout motto used to say: "Be  Prepared"

[sandsys]

Once I realized I could not shoot a human being I decided any gun I owned would be more likely to be used against me. Why would I want to arm an intruder? Yes, that has actually happened. Nick Russell came home to find a guy in his RV holding Nick's gun. Fortunately Nick is a quick thinker so he came out of that encounter alive but, no, that's not a risk I am willing to take.

Linda Sand

[jcussen]

My wife is the ultimate "empathy for all life" type. She would rather take a cockroach out of the house and put it outside than step on it. Asked her one time, if she saw someone trying to badly hurt one of the kids, and she had a gun in her hand, what would she do?  Did pay for her CHL and range time so she would not miss her target.

[sandsys]

1 hour ago, jcussen said:

Asked her one time, if she saw someone trying to badly hurt one of the kids, and she had a gun in her hand, what would she do? 

Our daughter has her own gun; she doesn't need me to protect her.

Linda

[Yarome]

States that require a background check, or otherwise, for the transfer of firearms may supercede ATF regulations (?) It may also be to satisfy some states laws that prohibit the transfer of firearms (by anyone... FFL or private citizen) to someone that is not legally able to posses one. In the case of a pawn shop... even if you walked in with a firearm... you're still a "stranger" to them. They may perform a background check or such to ensure they are not breaking the law by transferring a firearm to someone who is prohibited from possession (?) I'm sure gun shops... and especially pawn shops... are scrutinized quite closely.

Dunno exactly, but I'm sure if there is a "valid" way to extract a transfer fee from someone on the back end of the deal... there are businesses that will, and do, take advantage of it.

Not that all do. Some businesses are very upstanding, understand the needs of their customers (ie., travelling to Canada/Mexico and need temporary storage), are satisifed with not nickel and diming their customers and understand that good business practices promote more business.

**Don't think it's necessary to turn every thread that mentions a firearm into a "should you"/"shouldn't you"/"we don't"/"I do" thread. It's obvious how the OP feels about the subject. He does... and just wanted to know where to shtick it while crossing. 🙂 

[Kirk W]

8 hours ago, sandsys said:

Once I realized I could not shoot a human being I decided any gun I owned would be more likely to be used against me.

I commend you for understanding the issue! I have owned guns all of my life and I enjoy shooting sports even today but I think that far too many people think a gun makes them safe without understanding that you must be willing to take a human life for the gun to be effective. I also do not believe that most gun owners spend enough time and ammunition on a range to be that good if they should ever be called upon to use their gun on another person. You need to speak with a person who has taken a life at point-blank range to understand what it really means.

[Alie&Jim's Carrilite]

And this topic has gone from where or how can I store my firearms for traveling into Canada to the usual mess......

When we travel into Canada, we'll rent a locker somewhere.  Between the actual firearms, ammo for them, cleaning supplies, targets, etc, it would be simpler.  I would hate to have to explain why I have all these cleaning supplies and targets and no firearms.... all because we forgot we had a tomato in the fridge!

[chiefneon]

Howdy!

We are traveling in Alaska now. I wanted to take my hand gun to Alaska this trip and do so by using the method of shipping it to and from the lower 48 to Alaska and back. I was told that the rules had changed regarding this by a firearms dealer in Montana.the handgun would have to be sent back to Texas where I was a resident. I ended up leaving it with a gunsmith in Helena Montana and will pick up on return.

” Happy Trails “

Chiefneon

[jcussen]

7 hours ago, chiefneon said:

Howdy!

We are traveling in Alaska now. I wanted to take my hand gun to Alaska this trip and do so by using the method of shipping it to and from the lower 48 to Alaska and back. I was told that the rules had changed regarding this by a firearms dealer in Montana.the handgun would have to be sent back to Texas where I was a resident. I ended up leaving it with a gunsmith in Helena Montana and will pick up on return.

” Happy Trails “

Chiefneon

Good to know. Last year the pawnshop I used said he could send my firearms to a shop in another border state to pick up when I returned from Canada. Guess I will have to return the same way I came.

[Optimistic Paranoid]

10 hours ago, chiefneon said:

Howdy!

We are traveling in Alaska now. I wanted to take my hand gun to Alaska this trip and do so by using the method of shipping it to and from the lower 48 to Alaska and back. I was told that the rules had changed regarding this by a firearms dealer in Montana.the handgun would have to be sent back to Texas where I was a resident. I ended up leaving it with a gunsmith in Helena Montana and will pick up on return.

” Happy Trails “

Chiefneon

I'm having a certain amount of trouble believing this.  Oh, I don't doubt that you were told this by an FFL in MT. But if it's not legal for the guy in AK to ship the guns anywhere but back to your state of residence, how can it be legal for the guy in MT to ship it to AK in the first place?

I would have called the guy in AK to get his take on it, and maybe also call the nearest ATF office to inquire as well.  Just cause the guy in MT has an FFL, that's no proof he knows what he's talking about.

[Yarome]

18 hours ago, chiefneon said:

...the handgun would have to be sent back to Texas where I was a resident. 

Hogwash. 

His information is incorrect.

It get's tricky because, on one hand, there is what the law allows. On the other hand, you have to deal with a shippers rules and regulations and those of the FFL you're using.

According to the ATF it is lawful for a person to ship a handgun to himself in another state (providing the gun is legal for you to possess within that state). FFL involvement is not required and without the necessity to declare the contents of the package or perform any background check. That's what the ATF and federal laws have to say about it.

That being said... shippers have their own rules and regulations. Some will only ship from FFL to FFL. Others require overnight shipping simply because those packages are better tracked, stay in the system for a shorter period of time and is a means to deter employee theft. It's not a legal requirement. That being said... not all employees are aware of their own companies policies so you will often be given the choice of 2nd day or even ground shipping even though the shipper may "require" (by policy) that they ship overnight.

Having said THAT. If you choose a shipping method outside of their company policies and it is lost or stolen... you "may" not be able to file a claim.

Many avoid this whole mess entirely, including some FFL's, by self insuring and following ATF laws over shippers policies. IOW, ship via ground and don't declare the contents. Of course, there is some risk in that, but many do so without issue on a regular basis.

When shipping to or from Alaska from FFL to FFL you are doing so under the ATF guidelines of shipping a handgun to yourself in another state in care of another person (the FFL). The law is satisfied. FFL to FFL is simply to meet the shippers requirements... not any legal requirment.

That's not, of course, to say that an FFL may have their own self applied rules and regulations. Like not releasing a handgun to an out of state resident or requiring a background check. That does NOT mean that it is illegal not to do so, and many FFL's may mistake AFT guidelines to deter inter-state trafficking of firearms as "law", however, they are mistaken.

I think it's probably an effort in futility to try and "educate" an FFL that belives otherwise. The best recourse is to find another FFL... or... self insure, don't declare, ship private address to private address (as the law allows) and assume the risk. That risk being delays in shipping, having it returned to the shipping address or filing claims under your own insurance if it's lost or stolen.

To be completely "legal" taking that route, the package should be addressed to the gun owner, in C/O the addressee, and the package may not be opened by anyone other than the gun owner.

All that said, this is my personal understanding and experience and shouldn't be considered as any legal advice. When in doubt.. consult a competent attorney or simply follow all rules and regulations of your shipper and FFL... no matter how rediculous they might me. 😉