deep cycle battery maintenance

[Sir Traveller]

Hello everyone

What is the best way to check the water levels on deep cycle batteries ? Do I disconnect them ( whether or not they need water refill ) ? Or just shut off the electricity from the hookup ? do I use bottled water or has to be distilled water to refill  ( if necessary )  ? I am new to this so any tips will help, thanks a lot

[SWharton]

No different than your car battery..............Take caps off, check water level, fill if necessary with distilled water.

[oldjohnt]

Anytime I "seriously" check a battery I prefer them to be stabilized and at rest having been disconnected from loads and chargers several minutes,  that's because I might be taking an accurate voltage reading and at times using a hydrometer on each cell. Sure, you can simply pop the caps and look see to insure electrolyte level is above the plates in each cell, that's about all there is too it, I still advise you to turn off any loads and charger first, but the battery itself need not be removed or cables disconnected just to check levels. 

 If under a high charge a battery can be outgassing and/or bubbling/boiling a bit which isn't a good time to be looking down and messing with them and ESPECIALLY don't have any sparks nearby !!!!!!!!!!! That's explosive gas coming out the top !!!!!!!!!!!  If any one cell is much lower or is off colored (maybe gray or milky) from the rest it's suspect. I always use DISTILLED water to top off any cells. For hard to reach and hard to view wet cell batteries I invested in a Fill Pro (or whatever its called) system so I don't have to remove any caps. Use caution remember that electrolyte is acidic and can burn skin and leaves holes in your clothes..........   If you're in there with a wrench disconnecting a battery I always remove the Grounded (NEG on most all vehicles) cable FIRST and disconnect loads and chargers.............

 

 John T

 

[Kirk W]

We typical RV users usually just visually check the cell levels by removing the caps and we don't remove the battery cables but just minimize the loads. While the experts and those who do extensive dry camping usually use a hydrometer to check each cell and do several other special things, I found that for more average use the cost in acid eaten clothing and the inconvenience of doing that far offset the extra use that I got for my efforts. The most critical thing is to be sure that the plates are kept covered with electrolyte and do so by adding distilled water. You can get it at any grocery store but be sure you get distilled and not one of the other types they have for sale. I would check them monthly for a time until you determine the pattern of water adding that is needed for your use. That will be determined by your pattern of use. If you usually stay where you have electric hookups you will probably find that adding water is not needed frequently. 

[JimK]

The more I think about this, the more puzzled I am.  I have had maintenance free car batteries for the past 30 years.  The battery for my RV truck is also maintenance free and in fact it is an automotive AGM battery.  I just replaced them at 7 years.  They seemed to be working without issue but I was concerned about the age of the batteries.  I only use AGM batteries for the RV.  If people are using RV batteries that need maintenance, I wonder why.

[GlennWest]

I have sealed, maintenance free, batteries in my Teton. 4 of them. But we not boon docking either. If we were, they would leave. That a different need.

[JimK]

27 minutes ago, GlennWest said:

I have sealed, maintenance free, batteries in my Teton. 4 of them. But we not boon docking either. If we were, they would leave. That a different need.

Why would you need to replace maintenance free batteries if  you boon docked?  My AGM batteries are maintenance free and I got them to have the capacity and performance for boon docking.

[GlennWest]

Sure have added mine typical marine batteries. 

[oldjohnt]

2 hours ago, JimK said:

If people are using RV batteries that need maintenance, I wonder why.

  Jim, like the poster, I'm "using RV batteries that need maintenance" (such as but not limited to checking levels as he asked how to) but mine are Trojan Conventional Flooded Lead Acid so I (like most) like to be insured electrolyte is above the plates lest the battery fails prematurely THEY WERENT CHEAP !!!!!!!!!!! Once mine wear out I plan to go with AGM the next time for all their advantages. With  my Smart 4 stage charger and MPPT 3 stage solar charge controller and adequate solar capacity, the way I maintain my batteries at or near 70% to 100% SOC and often at float levels so as NOT to use up their limited number of "Life Cycles" I'm hoping that will be a longggggggggggg time.

FLA then AGM and perhaps in the future I may even consider Lithium, time will tell as technology improves.

  Nice sparky chattin with yall

John T

 

[JimK]

Thanks for the comments.  I still do not understand the issue.  Why do people buy batteries that need maintenance?  It seems that they are not necessarily cheaper.  Do they last longer?  Both my truck and RV batteries are maintenance free and lasted over 7 years. 

[Pat & Pete]

1 hour ago, JimK said:

Thanks for the comments.  I still do not understand the issue.  Why do people buy batteries that need maintenance?  It seems that they are not necessarily cheaper.  Do they last longer?  Both my truck and RV batteries are maintenance free and lasted over 7 years. 

Maybe some folks just have to have something to do .

[SWharton]

Many people don't have deep pockets.

[Pat & Pete]

1 hour ago, SWharton said:

Many people don't have deep pockets.

My pockets are way deeper than I need , but the only thing in them is either nothing or maybe a spare pooh bag . 

[GlennWest]

5 hours ago, JimK said:

Thanks for the comments.  I still do not understand the issue.  Why do people buy batteries that need maintenance?  It seems that they are not necessarily cheaper.  Do they last longer?  Both my truck and RV batteries are maintenance free and lasted over 7 years. 

True deep cycle batteries, like the Trogen T 105 have a lot more use in them and are not real costly. Lot more amp hours than sealed batteries. If one is boondocking this is needed. More amp hours the better. 

[oldjohnt]

21 minutes ago, GlennWest said:

True deep cycle batteries, like the Trogen T 105 have a lot more use in them and are not real costly. Lot more amp hours than sealed batteries. If one is boondocking this is needed. More amp hours the better. 

Glenn, You raise a valid point. AGM Deep Cycle batteries are HIGH DOLLAR. Here's a link to Lifeline who make a good AGM "Deep Cycle" battery that many serious RV boondockers use. To get 420 Amp Hours of energy storage capacity it would take four of the GPL 31T's at a cost of it looks like at least $1356. In comparison, four Trojan T-105 Deep Cycle Flooded Lead Acid yields a tad more 450 Amp Hours, BUT their cost is more like around $500.

NOTE one has to compare Apples to Apples and Amp Hours to Amp Hours as that "Energy Storage Capacity" is what serious boondockers require, NOT found in an automotive "Starting" Battery, sealed or otherwise...................

NOTE Cheaper although still "sealed" batteries likely do NOT have the Amp Hour energy storage capacity of the expensive Deep Cycle AGM such as Lifeline manufactures. IE four cheaper yet still "sealed" batteries may not pack much punch for boondockers as compared to a true Deep Cycle high Amp Hour battery. AMP HOURS IS WHAT BOONDOCKERS REQUIRE  I would venture to say a much cheaper (then a Deep Cycle Lifeline AGM) still "sealed" automotive "Starting" Battery would be relatively low Amp Hours unsuitable for long term serious boondocking BUT THATS ONLYYYYYYYYYYY A GUESS NO WARRANTY !!!!!!!!!!!

For many a savings of $856 (420 AH of Lifeline AGM versus 450 AH of Trojan T-105 FLA) is quite significant and may well be the reason they choose them over an AGM Deep Cycle???? I cant say !!!!   I boondock a lot and have probably seen at least as many or more RV Boondockers using FLA versus AGM. BUT sure there are a ton of AGM and now even Lithium RV boondockers out there, AND EVEN SOME TESLA BATTERY BANKS !!!! With the Fill Pro system I use topping off is sooooooooooo easy so there's actually little ordinary maintenance required versus a "sealed" or an expensive Deep Cycle AGM which is or course still less. 

As I always say TO EACH THEIR OWN its their RV and their money be it FLA or AGM or Lithium 

Fun chattin with yall

https://www.impactbattery.com/brands/lifeline/?utm_source=bing&utm_medium=cpc&utm_campaign=Brand%2520%253E%2520Lifeline*&utm_term=lifeline%2520agm&utm_content=Lifeline%2520AGM%2520Battery

John T

[Larry Burkett]

So if you were wanting to replace your  2- 12 volt deep cycle batteries, would  you go with 2 - 12 volt Trojan Gollf Cart Batteries? 

[DesertMiner]

....you could replace the two 12 volt with four 6 volt just a thought.

[Larry Burkett]

My battery box is not big enough to hold 4 batteries.

[jcussen]

If you wait for a sale, you can get O'Reilly's 8d 225 amp/hr agm batteries [made in US by Deka/East Penn] for $400, so 450 amp hours for $800 AND get free installation at your local store. Have see Lifelines 8d 255 amp/hr for $520 but must go to the warehouse to pick them up. Nice thing about AGM batteries is the ability to put them almost anywhere they will fit and not worry about venting, refilling, and corrosive gases. I cheaped out an couple of years ago and installed 6 8d wet cells in a compartment, A year later had to clean up and treat all the steel in that compartment. AGM's are install and forget.  They will also charge much quicker than a wet cell. Wet cells are fine if you are on a tight budget, but I would get AGM's if you can afford them.

[Yarome]

You have to remember that most folks don't know the difference between starters, hybrid deep cycle and true deep cycle batteries. All of which come in maintenance free/AGM formats. Ie., AGM starter batteries. AGM is the medium... not the "type".

To answer JimK's question... true deep cycle (typically in use in RV's and especially among serious boondockers [as opposed to occassional dry camping]) do come in AGM/maintenance free, however, you can get the same storage capacity in a "maintenance" battery for $85-$125 a pop (depending on battery class) for a 6v battery vs. $300 a whack for AGM's.

*Using 6v 220ah batteries as an example as the most commonly used. However, they come in all sizes and capacities.

Even for "maintenance" batteries there really isn't much at all to it. Especially if you install a watering system. Squeeze the bulb a few times every 60-90 days and you're good to go. AGM's are, typically, only worth the price tag for hard core boondockers (many living off solar), those that don't have easy access to their battery banks, just don't wanna mess with maintenance (ie., physical limitations), OR... are installing their battery bank "in-house" where off-gassing would be an issue.

After all... for a 440ah battery bank you're talking the difference between $400-$500 vs. $1200... for the same capacity. AGM's do have some additional advantages, however, unless you "drive" your battery bank to it's peak performance most folks would'nt reap any practical benefit over the maintenance type.

[Yarome]

I should also probably add that it is, typically, the... prominentely marked... "RV/Marine Deep Cycle" batteries that are sold by battery stores and installed by dealers in many new RV's. Those are "hybrid" deep cycles and not the type referenced in my previous post. All-together different animals. 😉

 

[jcussen]

.Last year bought O'Reilly 8d 225 amp/hr batteries for $400 each. Good article on whether to change or not.  https://roadslesstraveled.us/wet-cell-vs-agm-batteries-rv-installation-wiring-tips/

[JimK]

jcussen, thanks for posting that link.  I thought it was pretty thorough.

It seems the big issue is cost.  The Trojan 105 seems to be a quality battery that should last as long as a quality AGM battery and at well less than half the cost of an AGM.

 I did take a look at the difference in capacity and found them to be the same.  I guess that is no surprise since the basic chemistry is the same.  Two Trojan 105 batteries would weigh 130 pounds and have a capacity of 225 AH, hence 1.7 AH per pound.  My two Lifeline batteries weigh 180 pounds with a capacity of 300 AH, hence also 1.7 AH per pound. 

[Yarome]

42 minutes ago, jcussen said:

Good article on whether to change or not.  https://roadslesstraveled.us/wet-cell-vs-agm-batteries-rv-installation-wiring-tips/

Not too bad, but there are a few points I would disagree with, a couple falsities, some of the problems they encountered (and conclusions they drew from that) were of their own making... and I would never recommend soldering battery connectors.

You can take it as one persons experience, but not what I would consider "the norm" for those that use traditional wet cell batteries. Costco/Sam's club, Trojans or otherwise.

As a guide to what type of battery to use? I would take it in the light that they were at a point where they were not happy with what they had, spent a lot of money on the "promise" of something better they are very hopeful of... and was reflected in their write-up. 😉

 

[Yarome]

7 minutes ago, JimK said:

It seems the big issue is cost.  The Trojan 105 seems to be a quality battery that should last as long as a quality AGM battery and at well less than half the cost of an AGM.

Pretty much! AGM's do have some additional advantages over traditional wet cells, but as mentioned, most folks wouldn't notice a difference under their typical usage.  Why pay more than twice the price just because you have to keep an eye on water levels? It's really not any more different/difficult that checking your vehicles fuild levels that are likely checked "much" more frequently than a battery banks.

Don't make "good sense"... unless you need the advantages or don't mind paying more for convenience.

As far as maintenance issues outlined in that article... most was of their own making and not "typical". I would imagine there were some charging/discharging practices as well that may have played a part, but as it wasn't mentioned I won't comment.