Which inverter? Magnum vs. Victron

[lockmup68]

I know many use the Magnum MSH3012 inverter/charger, but what about the 3000w Victron? I've always heard Victron was super expensive, but it appears cost was is on par with the Magnums now. Thoughts? I did some searching, but my google-fu is failing me.

Victron Multiplus 3000 12v

[Chad Heiser]

I assume you are talking about putting it in your trailer remodel?  If so, they are both excellent inverters.  I don't have personal experience with the Victron's but the research I have done on them show them to be excellent products.  I really like their GUI interface remote.  If I were starting from scratch and building a system, I would probably go Victron just because of the GUI remote.  If you plan to install a full suite of products (Inverter/Charger, battery monitor, remote, solar controller, etc) both companies can do integrated systems, but for me the Victron GUI remote is the tipping point to push me in that direction.  This is coming from someone who has installed multiple Magnum products in mine and other RV's and currently has the full Magnum suite in my new DRV 5er.

[lockmup68]

Thanks. Yes, eventually, full deal. everything but solar at the moment. Solar later on in the year. 

 

[Chad Heiser]

37 minutes ago, lockmup68 said:

Thanks. Yes, eventually, full deal. everything but solar at the moment. Solar later on in the year. 

 

Technomadia has some good videos on the victron products they have installed, including the GUI interface remote.  They were beta users who gave feedback to help develop the remote interface.

[fly2low]

I have no experience with Magnum.  This past year, I had a solar system installed, and used that as an excuse to switch out my Xantrex system for a Victron full system.  So far, so good.  Have had no problems, so no experience with their support.. 

[lockmup68]

On 3/13/2017 at 11:20 PM, Chad Heiser said:

Technomadia has some good videos on the victron products they have installed, including the GUI interface remote.  They were beta users who gave feedback to help develop the remote interface.

 

Just watched the videos and the GUI remote is pretty cool. I like how you can see the input/loads from each source and draw (shore, batteries, solar, genset). and how much each is contributing. Does the Magnum give you the same info

[Chad Heiser]

The Magnum ME-ARC remote has a lot of information, but it has a simple two line display.  It has lots of menus you can go through to get pretty much any information you would ever want, but it is nowhere near as cool as the Victron GUI display.

[Yarome]

I don't want to get too deep into it, but either one is going to be a win. Performance, reliability, system integration, customer service... you won't be disappointed.

The main differencences.. IMO, are cost, transformer core tech and programability.

Pros on the Magnum: Transformer core is more robust. More in what I consider the "workhorse" category. Programability is "fair" in flexibility to meet most folks needs and is "user friendly" for those that may not be as tech/power savy.

Pros on the Victron: Transformer core tech is more efficient, more module integration friendly, easier remote navigation and finer level of control over settings (although, might be a bit intimidating for the majority of end users.)

Personally, I run a magnum. While the bump in efficiency is attractive.. and I "would" like a bit more control over my power settings, durability is more "key" to me. The remote and ability to integrate additional modules played no part in my decision making process, but may have more sway for others.

Edited March 15, 2017 by Yarome
Typo - edited to reflect current pricing structure

[Yarome]

2 hours ago, Chad Heiser said:

The Magnum ME-ARC remote has a lot of information, but it has a simple two line display.  It has lots of menus you can go through to get pretty much any information you would ever want, but it is nowhere near as cool as the Victron GUI display.

X2. Once your system is up and running.. how much are you really going to use that fancy GUI remote? I barely look at mine... OR my Tristar panel since most everything I need to know "system wide" comes off my Trimetric. I sure wish I had a fancy GUI display for THAT! 

[lockmup68]

Thanks for the feedback. Actually, cost is why I started looking at the Victron. It is a bunch cheaper than the Magnum now.

Best price on Magnum I can find is: Jet.com Magnum MSH3012M $1845 w/ free shipping. Everyone else is $2239. 

Victron is Victron Multiplus 3000 $1428 w/ free shipping. Lots of options to buy around this price. 

ME-ARC control is $239 everywhere

Victron Color Control GX is $517, but the blue Control GX (single backlit led) with same functionality (I think?), just not full color support, is $271

So, just basic costs: 

Magnum 3012 plus ME-ARC panel = $2,084

Vicrton Multiplus 3000 plus Color Control GX panel = $1,945

So price being pretty much the same, which do you recommend? 

If I am reading everything correctly, the Victron has better efficiency, but the Magnum is more reliable? 

Now for even more dumb questions: What is missing from my list:

1. inverter and remote panel, 2. battery monitor kit with shunt, 3. catastrophe fuse (400a?)

[Yarome]

1 hour ago, lockmup68 said:

ME-ARC control is $239 everywhere

So price being pretty much the same, which do you recommend? 

If I am reading everything correctly, the Victron has better efficiency, but the Magnum is more reliable? 

Unless you need the auto gen start/stop feature.. a standard ME-RC-50 would do you. They run around $175-185. Small difference though overall.

That's a really tough question.   Price being equal.. I'm like any other techie.. I do love my toys. The GUI, programability and efficiency is really attractive. Being more modular friendly and dual AC outputs... not something I would ever take advantage of. But at some point I have to ask myself, "do I really need it?". Be it right or wrong I tend to hold the belief that with every bell and whistle comes another point of potention failure/conflict. I guess I also look at $500 for a REMOTE. That's steep for something I don't really use.

Then there's the Magnum. I know it. It's a KISS (Keep it simple s*****) unit (IMHO). It's a dependable workhorse. I have more experience with their C.S., components and, all in all, has more than enough programability to fill my needs. I wouldn't necessarily say that it is more "reliable".. but a more "durable" transformer, then yes. 

If you use a decent EMS and surge protection then damage to the Victron transformer shouldn't be an issue.

There IS that efficiency factor which draws me back to the Victron...

Now that you made me think about it. I guess I would still choose the Magnum. Being a full-time boondocker.. something simple that I know and trust trumps a small margin of efficiency loss, the minute tweaking I could do and the coolness factor.

That's simply based on my own situation, personal feelings and experience. If I had plans to expand my system then I would go with a Victron.

[Yarome]

2 hours ago, lockmup68 said:

What is missing from my list:

1. inverter and remote panel, 2. battery monitor kit with shunt, 3. catastrophe fuse (400a?)

Shut-off/disconnects, bus bar and neutral post (for convenience). 400a fuse is perfect.

[Chad Heiser]

Look at ImarineUSA.com for Magnum components.  They have about the best prices around for Magnum stuff (cheaper than you listed above.

You can't really go wrong with either manufacturer.  I am a die hard Magnum guy.  I've installed a bunch of Magnum components and have the full suite in my current (and past) 5er.  They are very robust and easy to install.  I have no real world experience with the Victron, just internet research.  I don't know anyone with Victron equipment to get personal experience from (other than Technomadia and their videos on their installs).

If you go Magnum and plan to add solar (as you mentioned) you need the ME-ARC remote to have integrated control of the PT-100 solar controller.

As far as components, here is my list.

Main and sub power panels, Inverter, inverter catastrophe fuse and holder, battery monitor with shunt, auto gen start module (if you have a built in generator), integrated remote control, solar controller, isolation switch between inverter and battery bank. isolation switch between solar array and solar controller, re-settable breaker between solar controller and battery bank, positive and negative bus bars for all 12 volt trailer connections (so everything doesn't have to be connected directly to the batteries), solar panels, mounting system for solar panels, roof combiner box for solar panels, appropriate sized cabling for everything.

I have a detailed wiring diagram from my last 5th wheel power system I can provide if you would like to see it.  I haven't had time to draw up a wiring diagram for my current system in my new 5th wheel yet, but I will.

If you want to message me, I'll give you my number.  I am happy to talk details of any of my systems or the systems I have installed.  I will be giving presentations on inverter and solar systems at the WCR this year as well.

 

On edit, here is a link to my wiring diagram from my last 5th wheel.

Edited March 15, 2017 by Chad Heiser

[Yarome]

20 minutes ago, Chad Heiser said:

If you go Magnum and plan to add solar (as you mentioned) you need the ME-ARC remote to have integrated control of the PT-100 solar controller.

True... but I think you're probably the only one that uses at PT-100 that I know of. That thing is a freaking monster. 

Edited March 15, 2017 by Yarome

[Chad Heiser]

 

3 minutes ago, Yarome said:

True... but I think you're probably the only one that uses at PT-100 that I know of. That thing is a freaking monster capable of supporting 6 full size 1000w rigs at once. 

I just installed another one in a buddies rig and have a third one sitting in my shop waiting to go on another buddies rig (oh and there is another forum member that I know who has one waiting to be installed in his new to him rig as well).  If you go with all Magnum equipment, why not use the Magnum solar controller too?  They are monster controllers, but you will never outgrow them in an RV like you can with some other controllers and I love integration.

Edited March 15, 2017 by Chad Heiser

[lockmup68]

Thanks for the diagram, that was very helpful. It's all the little things that are forgotten and you need to budget for. 

[Chad Heiser]

2 hours ago, lockmup68 said:

Thanks for the diagram, that was very helpful. It's all the little things that are forgotten and you need to budget for. 

I'm happy to help any way I can.

[ewacowboy]

I had the Magnum 2812 in our old coach and had another one installed by the factory on our new coach.  My original 2812 and accessories are for sale here:

We're really happy with ours....all you need is batteries and cables!

[asitool]

My experience is that Magnum customer service has become terse and unhelpful... relying on distributors for first line tech support. Victron has been much more helpful for me. I have an MSH 4024 and a Victron Quattrom 24/5000 and can tell you the Victron is in a class of it's own. I was a die hard Magnum guy... not anymore...

[Chad Heiser]

5 hours ago, asitool said:

My experience is that Magnum customer service has become terse and unhelpful... relying on distributors for first line tech support. Victron has been much more helpful for me. I have an MSH 4024 and a Victron Quattrom 24/5000 and can tell you the Victron is in a class of it's own. I was a die hard Magnum guy... not anymore...

I have always had good luck with Magnum tech support, including quick turn around times the one time I sent something to them to update the software.  I think Victron makes some excellent products, but I have no personal experience with them.  If/when I go to a new system I am currently leaning toward a complete Victron suite of products though.  This is mainly so I can have that GUI remote.  Of course I just bought a new trailer this year and put a full Magnum suite of products in it, so that Victron set up will probably have to wait a while.

[lockmup68]

I think I'm going to go the Vicron route in spring. Still haven't pulled the trigger on everything. 

[Ronbo]

A Vicron and digital remote will cost less than the Magnum 

[Ronbo]

A Vicron and digital remote will cost less than the Magnum 

[Jack Mayer]

Victron makes very good stuff. Like most systems, you will gain the most from it if you go all Victron, since the stuff tends to work best together.

[dewilso]

Love my Victron Multiplus 2000, and especially the Bluetooth battery monitor.