Moisture/Condensation in all cupboards

[skp51443]

Compare the R value (insulation ability) of your Reflectrix to the R value of your RV wall and see just how much additional insulation it will provide. Unless your walls are really poorly insulated it isn't going to be much of an improvement.

 

Adding anything to the walls that doesn't have an air tight seal is going to see water condensing behind it so unless you get the walls completely covered and the covering down with an air tight seal it will likely make things worse.

 

Reducing the moisture in your RV will reduce the moisture in your cabinets and that will reduce the condensation.

 

Allowing more air circulation in the cabinets will warm them up, again reducing the condensation. Blocking the doors open a bit and securing the knobs together with a rubber-band or velcro would keep the cat out.

 

 

The real solution is to reduce the moisture level in your RV and warm the cupboard space until the condensation stops.

 

If you really want to try adding insulation you need to add real insulation, not Reflectrix. Look for one-inch foil covered foam boards and aluminum foil (not silver cloth) sealing tape that will form an air tight seal without the need to glue the foam board down permanently. Thicker and higher R value board will do more than thinner, lower R value stuff.

[lappir]

A couple low voltage computer fans in the right spots may help too. Haven't tried it though. I did put what I think you are calling "Reflect X" in the cupboards of my Weekend Warrior when I was staying North until after the first of the year. Never had a condensation issue with that rig, but it wasn't as tight as my current trailer. I also put the shrink plastic on all the windows and of course had the pillows for the roof vents. Got a lot of cold from the shower dome, couldn't figure a way to add insulation or another layer to that. The trailer felt 10 degrees warmer with just covering the windows. Of course they were single pane with drain holes at the bottoms. No condensation after covering them. Good luck. Let us know if anything works.

Rod

[rdickinson]

Bear with me on this,

 

Would you mind telling which RV park you are at?

 

What is the closest Home Depot or Lowes?

 

Do you have a propane furnace?

 

Does your hot water heater run on propane and 110?

 

Judging by an earlier post you said the interior of the RV was 33 f warming up to the 40's, is that right?

 

I'm not trying to be nosy.

 

R

 

[Yarome]

I would like some factual input (not guesses or thoughts) if that will settle the temp issue in the cupboards.

 

Unfortunately, that is something that no one can tell you. There are too many unique factors. Some folks have suggested that you might not want to do that at all because it is more likely to cause even more severe problems than you are now facing. I tend to agree with them. Maintaining a higher temperature inside of your cabinets a few degrees might, marginally, reduce the condensation a smidge, but it's not likely to eliminate it to any meaningful degree. Water dripping down your walls is water dripping down your walls, right. It 'is' likely to end up creating conditions conducive for mold growth and dry rot.

 

I have never actually seen nor heard of anyone insulating the inside of their cabinets as a means to combat condensation. That doesn't mean you can't try it though. It's your rig.

 

You mentioned that your cabinets are the only place with an issue. If you are having issues in an enclosure due to high humidity, cold temperatures and poor air ventilation/circulation, it's happening elsewhere. That I 'can' promise you. In the space where your water pump is located, behind your power distribution panel, under your shower basin, around the enclosure of your fridge, behind your oven, etc etc. There are any number of places where the same conditions probably exist, but are not as noticeable.

 

You've been given any number of great suggestions by some folks that have decades of experience RV'ing in all sorts of climates. What you do is up to you, but there is no 'magic bullet'. The only things that will reduce condensation are:

 

1. Reduce humidity.

2. Improve ventilation/circulation

3. Raise temperatures.

 

Just doing one might help, but it won't solve your problem.

[Yarome]

 

No, you need the coils in the AC to be as cold as possible to pull the moisture out and the air to be in contact with them as long as possible which is why you want to use the low fan setting.

 

X2

[Kirk W]

I would like some factual input (not guesses or thoughts) if that will settle the temp issue in the cupboards.

What can we do to convince you? Many of us have dealt with the problem that you have and successfully. Read posts #51, 52, & 53. The problem is humidity and much of it comes from the activities of living in a very confined space. Your issue is not unique to where you are or to your RV.

[rdickinson]

I'm washing my hands of this, I PM'd her with an offer to help as have some others were intending to do the same. She hasn't been on for nearly 24 hrs.

 

I blew one leg on my inverter and wasn't able to use the 2 roof mount heat pumps for 24 hrs so switched to cubes and gas furnace, still no condensation.

 

I suspect her trailer is like a meat locker, cold.

 

This has been beaten to death with no results but a lot of resistance to folks a lot more savvy than me.

 

Time to move on.

[Bill Joyce]

When we were going away for trips in winter from our Western Washington house, we were told to set the thermostat to 50 or higher. This was to stop condensation and mold from forming. We had no problems. I did the same with our RV when stored next to the house, and also had no problems. Bottom line, you need to spend more money and keep it warmer or you will spend more money fixing the issues caused by it being so cold.

[rdickinson]

My rig was stored for 3 months over Fall and Winter in Bellingham a few years ago, no heat. Didn't get any mould or sweating. It is the added moisture from the body perspiring and breathing plus the animals adding their bit.

 

Reduce the humidity.

[GVJeeper]

I just want to clarify that I'm not the one with cats climbing in cupboards. I have cats but they couldn't care less about the cupboards.

[Ray,IN]

 

That would be ideal, but it's hardly practical to empty everything into your living spaces while your rigs in use. Not to mention that 'any' non moving air is going to cause condensation. Ie., You can take your leather jacket out of the closet and lay it on the table, but when you pick it up there will be condensation on the underside of your jacket as well as the table.

I was responding to his post #4, where he said he was not going to empty the cabinets. Noone had suggested that, until he mentioned the doing so.

[Kirk W]

 

his post #4, where he said he was not going to empty the cabinets

GVJeeper is a "she."

[GVJeeper]

GVJeeper is a "she."

Thanks Kirk!!

[GVJeeper]

As luck would have it, I found a $300 dehumidifier in the wood/craft shop here (I'm in a private RV park) and borrowed it. I puts out a lot of cold air so it's in the bedroom during the day (when I'm not there) and goes out in the living area at night. It's already in the 40's here so cold air is NOT something I want or need. I've been running it night a day for about 3 days. I've got it down to 45% as long as I don't run my heater (propane) so I'm using my radiator heater. Still having issues in the corner seams of the cupboards so I've emptied them half way. Those corner seams are some kind of plastic strip and really sweat. Guess this will have to do for now - hoping for the best.

 

Thanks for all of your input.

[chirakawa]

As luck would have it, I found a $300 dehumidifier in the wood/craft shop here (I'm in a private RV park) and borrowed it. I puts out a lot of cold air so it's in the bedroom during the day (when I'm not there) and goes out in the living area at night. It's already in the 40's here so cold air is NOT something I want or need. I've been running it night a day for about 3 days. I've got it down to 45% as long as I don't run my heater (propane) so I'm using my radiator heater. Still having issues in the corner seams of the cupboards so I've emptied them half way. Those corner seams are some kind of plastic strip and really sweat. Guess this will have to do for now - hoping for the best.

 

Thanks for all of your input.

 

What type of propane heater do you have? A built in propane furnace should not add any moisture at all. Only the open burning of propane will add moisture to your indoor environment.

 

The humidifier does not add "cold" air to your space unless you're exhausting it to the outside. That's not possible.

 

Good luck to you on this problem.

[budeneighe]

We are at Carrie Blake city park in Sequim. We also have a place at Evergreen in Chimacum. We spent last winter (oct - May) in Carrie Blake so I understand your problem. The trick is to "manage" your humidity and where it "collects". If you ever camped in a canvas tent you remember to never touch the inside surface of the tent with your finger because that will become a rain spot. Same in cabinets. This is a particularly big problem where soft goods or tightly packed boxes are concerned.

 

All soft goods in my cabinets with outside walls are in plastic "shoeboxes", sized for the cabinets so there is always a slight gap between the walls and whatever materials are in that cabinet. Yes, soft good are a particular problem because they absorb the condensation as it occurs and you don't notice it but it builds in the cabinets and will make it much worse.

 

I have worked on RVs and the colder corner strips are because there is usually no insulation in the corners of these areas. Corners are also the hardest places to have any natural air movement. Same is true behind day/night shades that are kept closed. Mildew will form on the glass, even if double paned.

 

Another consideration is that moisture is already in those outside walls and is reducing the R factor of the inside surfaces to where it is much easier to wick the heat away from them through the outside wall. This can happen from slow water leaks or even air leaks into the walls from outside or inside air. These plastic corner strips are one such place that can allow moisture to penetrate the wall and get inside.

 

• Whatever you can do to improve natural convectional air movement even a little bit in the cabinets will help. Don't let things in these cabinets touch these outside walls. One other thing to look at would be to redistribute the things in these problem cabinets to allow better air movement over the outside wall surfaces. This might be a small inconvenience to what you are used to but it can help in the short term without having to empty them until you go south.
• Again, cracking a roof vent nearest to the area producing humidity, will help. When showering, open the one nearest the shower, before you get in. An inch or two at most is enough. Leave it this way for 15-30 minutes after you finish. Remember the towels will still have the moisture in them
• Always run the stove exhaust fan (I know, I know.. it is an abominable noise) whenever a burner or the oven is on and leave it going until well after it has been shut off.
• Yes, the warmer air at the ceiling can be allowed to ooze out through slightly cracked roof vents. Maybe 1/2" or less is enough once you get this problem levelled out.
• Do not start gluing things to your walls until you have tested them to see if they actually will make enough of a difference. if you glue something to the outside cabinet wall, it can still collect moisture behind it and you cannot remove it to check or correct this condition.
• Put the contents of these cabinets in plastic trays or boxes to keep them from becoming packed against the walls. The whole contents do not have to be in such trays but the stuff against these problem walls, do.
• The dehumidifier will help but as previously stated, air circulation, however small, is necessary for its effectiveness to include those problem spaces.

Good luck with this and do keep an eye on it. If it becomes mold or other organic problem, then it will be far harder to deal with that than with the condensation.

[GVJeeper]

Budd - great information!!! Yesterday I removed everything from those cupboards and rearranged them so nothing is touching the walls. I left the doors open last night and there was no condensation on those plastic corner strips this morning...they seem to be the only place with moisture. My other cupboard that don't have those plastic strips has never collected moisture. Is there something I can do to cover or remove them? Am wondering if that would only eliminate the "collection" point but not eliminate the mold-potential problem - would love your opinion.

 

I run the fan in the bathroom, don't run the stove fan but will start to, no gluing yet so will nix that idea, am keeping an eye out on windows, move my mattress away from wall when I get up in the morning, will keep running dehumidifier in room switching between bedroom and living area. Gawd I sure hope that helps!!

[budeneighe]

Hard plastics are going to conduct heat better than wood or wood composites but it may be possible that colder air is coming into the cabinets by leaking around those strips. Either way, what you have done is a good step forward so watch it for awhile and see what happens. We have some colder weather coming up Monday night so that may reveal how effective your measures are.

[GVJeeper]

it may be possible that colder air is coming into the cabinets by leaking around those strips.

Do you think it would help to run a bead of caulk down those plastic strips...wide enough to cover the edges?

[budeneighe]

I would wait and see what your results are from this work so far. It might be useful at some point to close up the rv and turn on the exhaust fans (stove, bathroom, ceiling, etc) all at once and make some access to those corners of your cabinets. Then, do a smoke test with a match (strike it, blow it out so it is smoking) and then try holding it close to those seams and see if you see any air flow around them, especially near the top/bottom corners.

 

I would consider trying some insulating tape or even removable duct tape over a couple of the worst ones just to see if that makes any improvement before committing to permanent and messy attempts. I do know a couple of people that have used the blue insulation board that is closed cell polyethylene (I think) like they use for wetter areas and just cut and fit them against outside walls in the cabinets. A little earthquake putty will hold them in place and let them be removable for later inspection behind them for dampness or mold. Baby steps is a good way to proceed in these "no standard solution" situations.

[Kirk W]

Do you think it would help to run a bead of caulk down those plastic strips...wide enough to cover the edges?

What you want to avoid is sealing up a small area where moisture is collecting but can't be seen, as that could be the entry for a dry rot problem.

[rdickinson]

Do you have any heat at all in the trailer? Are you using a catalytic heater or something with an exposed flame?

[GVJeeper]

Do you have any heat at all in the trailer? Are you using a catalytic heater or something with an exposed flame?

Yes, I have my trailer force air heater and I have one of those small radiator looking heaters. I found a $300 dehumidifier just sitting around here in the park so have been using that and it is making a big difference. It's in the bedroom during the day and the living area at night so I don't have to deal with the noise or cold air coming from it. I'm about to get moisture down to 44% - no lower but that seems to be helping a lot with the moisture in the cupboards.

[rdickinson]

Humidity seems pretty good, Bellingham humidity at the moment is 94%. So where you are won't be far off that.

 

How is the rest of the trailer doing? Things working OK?

 

Also the truck, is it OK as well? Mechanically sound?

 

You have a long haul coming up.

[GVJeeper]

Humidity seems pretty good, Bellingham humidity at the moment is 94%. So where you are won't be far off that.

Good to hear that 44% is reasonable.

 

Everything is hunky dory. I'm about to hook up an inverter to my house batteries since the power goes out so much up here...at least I can have wifi and my laptop with the inverter...an more if I want. I'm thinking a trip to summer ground will be coming up sometime after Christmas.