Radar274 Posted November 3, 2015 Report Share Posted November 3, 2015 I Got a phone call from the examining Regulation Agent for the state of Michigan saying his boss has denied our application for assembled Motor Home. You could see it coming when the agent inspected the Vehicle at our home a few weeks ago. The first response out of his mouth was "his boss wanted to see some significant changes to make it a Motor home because there is a big difference in registration costs if it is a motor home". Michigan laws are as follows: Motor home means a motor vehicle constructed or altered to provide living quarters, including permanently installed cooking and sleeping facilities, and is used for recreation, camping, or other noncommercial use. MICHIGAN VEHICLE CODE (EXCERPT) Act 300 of 1949 257.49a "Recreational vehicle" defined. Sec. 49a. "Recreational vehicle" means a new or used vehicle that has its own motive power or is towed by a motor vehicle; is primarily designed to provide temporary living quarters for recreational, camping, travel, or seasonal use; complies with all applicable federal vehicle regulations; and does not require a special highway movement permit under section 719a to be operated or towed on a street or highway. The term includes, but is not limited to, a motor home, travel trailer, park model trailer that does not require a special highway movement permit under section 719a, or pickup camper. 1. Removed Commercial Hitch 2. Removed the #2 Axle, which limits its hauling capacity. 3. Removed the Commercial trailer Air brakes. 4 Installed RV Trailer Brake controller 5. Installed RV Lighting conversion Kit. 6. Installed Microwave For Cooking. 7. Installed self contained Toilet 8. Installed Power inverter for 110 volt power. 9. There is a Webasto Heater to heat the interior without the engine running. 10 It came with a refrigerator. 11. It came with Sleeping Facilities and dinette. Registration cost would be around $400/year for Motor Home. They want to use a statute that computes by weight not value of the Vehicle making the registration $730/year. This is for Vehicles not intended for commercial use. We don't have a problem with the registration cost and don't need a new vin number for Assembled Vehicle as long as the tittle has the words RV or Motor Home or Personal use. Commercial Insurance is $3000 verses $1100 or less for Motor Home Insurance. Any suggestions? So what do your Tittles Say? Bob&Kay 2012 VNL730 I Shift D13 2.47 ratio 2018 Mobile Suites 40 kssb4 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Deezl Smoke Posted November 3, 2015 Report Share Posted November 3, 2015 Who come up with the "assembled" part? An HDT rv is not "assembled". No where in what you posted is referred to as "assembled". An assembled vehicle is like a car body on a pu chassis or a kit car etc. No one should even use the term "assembled" when applying for an rv registration. You have many dmv sites in your state. Go to another one with the truck and have it inspected at the dmv. IMO I'm a work'n on it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mark and Dale Bruss Posted November 3, 2015 Report Share Posted November 3, 2015 Check with Brad Dandles who was successful in Michigan Please click for Emails instead of PM Mark & DaleJoey - 2016 Bounder 33C Tige - 2006 40' Travel SupremeSparky III - 2021 Mustang Mach-e, off the the Road since 2019 Useful HDT Truck, Trailer, and Full-timing Info atwww.dmbruss.com Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
don&penny Posted November 3, 2015 Report Share Posted November 3, 2015 You might start by calling the Michigan Department of State Information Center and ask what the process is for disputing the designation. I'd consider taking a copy of the statute with me when I went to speak to the boss of the boss that was denying the application so that they could point to exactly which section was in question. Don Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Radar274 Posted November 3, 2015 Author Report Share Posted November 3, 2015 Who come up with the "assembled" part? An HDT rv is not "assembled". No where in what you posted is referred to as "assembled". An assembled vehicle is like a car body on a pu chassis or a kit car etc. No one should even use the term "assembled" when applying for an rv registration. You have many dmv sites in your state. Go to another one with the truck and have it inspected at the dmv. IMO The DMV filled out the Application for Michigan Vehicle Title using the Make as Assembled and the Body Style as Motor Home. I Don't know why they used Assembled. Bob&Kay 2012 VNL730 I Shift D13 2.47 ratio 2018 Mobile Suites 40 kssb4 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dennis M Posted November 3, 2015 Report Share Posted November 3, 2015 That "assembled" term bothers me as well. In Illinois I just told the SoS office that it was "a Volvo truck that has been 'converted' to a motor home." My title states "Volvo Motor Hom" (apparently no room for the "e"), at least it's not a "motor ho!" From what I have seen, and my experience, you are better off to research carefully and know all the ins and outs, then go in a "tell" them what you are doing and what you want as opposed to asking what they can do. Dennis & NancyTucson, AZ in winter, on the road in summer.1999 Volvo 610 "Bud" 425 HP Volvo, Super 10 spd.2005 Mountain Aire 35 BLKS2013 smart fortwo CityFlame riding on Bud(Replaced '05 smart first loaded in '06 and '11 smart that gave it's life to save me!)Our Travel Blog Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Radar274 Posted November 3, 2015 Author Report Share Posted November 3, 2015 You might start by calling the Michigan Department of State Information Center and ask what the process is for disputing the designation. I'd consider taking a copy of the statute with me when I went to speak to the boss of the boss that was denying the application so that they could point to exactly which section was in question. Don I was able to get the phone number of the individual from the SOS of Michigan that denied the application, will give him a call tomorrow. This application would have given us a new VIN #. Am I going about this the wrong way? Bob&Kay 2012 VNL730 I Shift D13 2.47 ratio 2018 Mobile Suites 40 kssb4 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Star Dreamer Posted November 3, 2015 Report Share Posted November 3, 2015 Not sure you want a new VIN#. How will you make new data tags and stamp new #s in the various locations. Also may make it difficult to sell at later date but not sure why. You would have to keep all the old VIN# info for parts and items from the dealers. Michigan has some unusual rules. A long time ago I wanted to register a van in that state. They wanted to make it commercial or a truck, but if I put a window in the side I could register it as a station wagon and be much cheaper. Guess what, I became a station wagon owner that looked like a van! 2005 Freightliner Century S/T, Singled, Air ride ET Jr. hitch 2019 46'+ Dune Sport Man Cave custom 5th wheel toy hauler Owner of the 1978 Custom Van "Star Dreamer" which might be seen at a local car show near you! Check out http://www.hhrvresource.com/ for much more info on HDT's. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brad & Jacolyn Posted November 3, 2015 Report Share Posted November 3, 2015 Bob this is Brad. When I had my Volvo registered in MI about 7 years ago the state was using the Federal Motorhome guidelines. You should be able to find out if they still are. I had the paperwork from bringing the truck in from Canada and a deposition (maybe not the correct term. I typed up what I did and had it notarized) telling the changes I made and pictures and receipts. I went into the office in Benton Harbor, MI and gave them my handful of papers. They talked to people and made copies of everything told me how much to write the check for and I was out of there in 30 minutes with the job done (On the first try). I have since moved to TX and they just transferred the title to TX. Mine says Volvo MH on it. BILLB has done it lately and he had some problems but completed the mission so maybe he will chime in. Good luck and keep after them. It can be done. Brad Brad and Jacolyn Tucker the Wonder dog and Brynn the Norfolk Terrier 2009 Smart "Joy" 2004 VNL630 "Vonda the Volvo" 2008 Hitch Hiker 35 CK Champagne Edition VED12 465 HP, Freedomline, 3.73 ratio, WB 218" Fulltiming and loving it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steve from SoCal Posted November 3, 2015 Report Share Posted November 3, 2015 You do NOT want a new VIN, you want your VIN converted to a motorhome/RV status. Your vehicle has been ALTERED not constructed, the wording IS everything to bureaucrats. Steve 2005 Peterbilt 387-112 Baby Cat 9 speed U-shift 1996/2016 remod Teton Royal Atlanta 1996 Kentucky 48 single drop stacker garage project Pulls like a train, sounds like a plane....faster than a Cheetah sniffin cocaine. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Radar274 Posted November 3, 2015 Author Report Share Posted November 3, 2015 Thanks' Brad, I went to the SOS with all the papers that was suggested on the forum. The Clerk even commented how organized we were having the state of Mi. statutes and a notarized deposition. We had pictures, invoices and the Vehicle equipment inspection form BillB used. The Clerk talked to her supervisor and then filled out the Application for Michigan title adding the DW. She listed the make as Assembled and Motor Home as the body style. The total cost including a 60 day temp plate was $113. I agree with Deezl and Dennis Assembled shouldn't have been used(My Big Mistake). I Have spoken with the Mi. SOS Agent today and he is sending the old title work back with a suggestion on how to proceed. This would register the truck as privately owned truck, used to tow a trailer for recreational proposes. Mi. Statute 257.801 paragraph (j) (j) For each truck, weighing 8,000 pounds or less, and not used to tow a vehicle, for each privately owned truck used to tow a trailer for recreational purposes only and not involved in a profit making venture, and for each vehicle designed and used to tow a mobile home or a trailer coach, except as provided in subdivision ( , $38.00 or an amount computed according to the following schedule of empty weights, whichever is greater: Empty weight/100 pounds 15,001 pounds and over $4.39 Our weight is about 16,000 lbs. so our registration using this method would be around $700. CDL Exemptions for the State of Michigan Active duty Military Police and Firefighters Farmers Individuals: Operating motor homes or other vehicles used exclusively to transport personal possessions or family members, for non-business purposes. Not sure what the insurance company will say about all this... keeping my fingers crossed. Thanks for all your thoughts will keep you informed. Bob&Kay 2012 VNL730 I Shift D13 2.47 ratio 2018 Mobile Suites 40 kssb4 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Radar274 Posted November 3, 2015 Author Report Share Posted November 3, 2015 Thanks Steve my mistake!! Don't apply for new VIN!!!!! Bob&Kay 2012 VNL730 I Shift D13 2.47 ratio 2018 Mobile Suites 40 kssb4 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
johnnyspeed Posted November 3, 2015 Report Share Posted November 3, 2015 If you still have trouble PM me your phone # and a good time to call and i'll try to help, I am in Michigan also and did mine with no issues. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Radar274 Posted November 4, 2015 Author Report Share Posted November 4, 2015 If you still have trouble PM me your phone # and a good time to call and i'll try to help, I am in Michigan also and did mine with no issues. Thanks Johnny Bob&Kay 2012 VNL730 I Shift D13 2.47 ratio 2018 Mobile Suites 40 kssb4 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Deezl Smoke Posted November 4, 2015 Report Share Posted November 4, 2015 I Got a phone call from the examining Regulation Agent for the state of Michigan saying his boss has denied our application for assembled Motor Home. You could see it coming when the agent inspected the Vehicle at our home a few weeks ago. The first response out of his mouth was "his boss wanted to see some significant changes to make it a Motor home because there is a big difference in registration costs if it is a motor home". Michigan laws are as follows: Motor home means a motor vehicle constructed or altered to provide living quarters, including permanently installed cooking and sleeping facilities, and is used for recreation, camping, or other noncommercial use. MICHIGAN VEHICLE CODE (EXCERPT) Act 300 of 1949 257.49a "Recreational vehicle" defined. Sec. 49a. "Recreational vehicle" means a new or used vehicle that has its own motive power or is towed by a motor vehicle; is primarily designed to provide temporary living quarters for recreational, camping, travel, or seasonal use; complies with all applicable federal vehicle regulations; and does not require a special highway movement permit under section 719a to be operated or towed on a street or highway. The term includes, but is not limited to, a motor home, travel trailer, park model trailer that does not require a special highway movement permit under section 719a, or pickup camper. 1. Removed Commercial Hitch 2. Removed the #2 Axle, which limits its hauling capacity. 3. Removed the Commercial trailer Air brakes. 4 Installed RV Trailer Brake controller 5. Installed RV Lighting conversion Kit. 6. Installed Microwave For Cooking. 7. Installed self contained Toilet 8. Installed Power inverter for 110 volt power. 9. There is a Webasto Heater to heat the interior without the engine running. 10 It came with a refrigerator. 11. It came with Sleeping Facilities and dinette. Registration cost would be around $400/year for Motor Home. They want to use a statute that computes by weight not value of the Vehicle making the registration $730/year. This is for Vehicles not intended for commercial use. We don't have a problem with the registration cost and don't need a new vin number for Assembled Vehicle as long as the tittle has the words RV or Motor Home or Personal use. Commercial Insurance is $3000 verses $1100 or less for Motor Home Insurance. Any suggestions? So what do your Tittles Say? Definitely do NOT have the VIN# changed. It is not assembled. Do not allow them to put anything in the "brand" section of the title unless you fully understand what brand they are putting there. MI may have to do that, I do not know, but that section of the title is for damaged and and reconstructed type of things when involved in an accident or disaster. One thing I did not see in your description of your modifications, is a fresh water supply. Many states do not require it, but some may demand that an "rv" have fresh water facility. Does MI? If so, I have seen pictures of a very small sink in a cabinet with a hand pump and 2 containers in the cabinet below the sink. One for fresh and one for the drain water. Kind of like the porta-pottie workings. Another one I saw on youtube was a sink in a drawer of one of the truck's cabinets and rv approved hosing going to a fresh and grey tanks below the sleeper. I'm a work'n on it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Radar274 Posted December 18, 2015 Author Report Share Posted December 18, 2015 Finally we have a Victory! Lucy is now registered as a Motorhome in the state of Michigan. Went to the DMV @1pm and finished @2:30pm., Moral of the story is smile...smile and don't take NO for an answer! It took 4 phone calls to the State DMV, but got the job done. The lesson learned is all you need to ask for is a corrected Title for (Body Style) from Tractor to MTR Home. Obviously you need all the documentation proving the vehicle complies with the description of a motor home for your state, but what really helped the most was the Pictures of the Modifications. The DMV Clerk was on my side once she saw what had been done to comply. Thanks for all the Help PS Never ever let them talk you into an Assembled vehicle application with a new Vin#. MY BIG Mistake!!!! Bob&Kay 2012 VNL730 I Shift D13 2.47 ratio 2018 Mobile Suites 40 kssb4 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NoDirectionHome Posted December 18, 2015 Report Share Posted December 18, 2015 Way to stay on it and get it done right. Enjoy the journey -Steve "There are No Experts, Do the Math!" 2014 Freightliner Cascadia DD16 600hp 1850ft-lb 18spd 3.31 260"wb SpaceCraft S-470 SKP #131740 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HERO Maker Posted December 18, 2015 Report Share Posted December 18, 2015 Great info to pass on to others. Rocky & Sheri Rhoades '01 Volvo 770 2016 DRV Mobile Suites, HoustonHERO Makers Ministry Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jim & Wilma Posted December 18, 2015 Report Share Posted December 18, 2015 Persistence and knowledge paid off. Congrats Radar! Jim & Wilma 2006 Travel Supreme 36RLQSO 2009 Volvo VNL730, D13, I-shift, ET, Herrin Hauler bed, "Ruby" 2017 Smart Class of 2017 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brad & Jacolyn Posted December 18, 2015 Report Share Posted December 18, 2015 Congrats on your victory. Now go enjoy the ride. Brad Brad and Jacolyn Tucker the Wonder dog and Brynn the Norfolk Terrier 2009 Smart "Joy" 2004 VNL630 "Vonda the Volvo" 2008 Hitch Hiker 35 CK Champagne Edition VED12 465 HP, Freedomline, 3.73 ratio, WB 218" Fulltiming and loving it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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