rving4us Posted September 30, 2015 Report Share Posted September 30, 2015 I would like to ask those that pull trailers your thought on this. I have 7000 lb axles (2) Mor/yde RE suspension, disc brakes, on my fifth wheel. After going full time and adding a washer and dryer we are at 13,600 lbs on the 2 axles, actual axle weight. total gross is 16,800 for G 114 H rated 17.5 tires. wet bolt greasable shackles My question is would you feel comfortable that close to the max of 14,000 lbs? I thought about swapping to 2-8000 lb, but sure hate to spend the money if what I have would be ok. I'll edit this since Big Greg mentioned cost for IS suspension. I have done that, to swap out axles to 8000 is $950.00 to go to Mor/ryde IS suspension is a whopping $3500.00 Your opinions are appreciated. Cary 2014 Ram,4x4,dually,CC Cummins 2011 Carriage Cameo 37KS3 full body paint, Most options except Generator SKP# 123923 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Big Greg Posted September 30, 2015 Report Share Posted September 30, 2015 I would first want to know the individual weights on each tire to ensure one axle side or wheel and tire isn't overloaded. It does sound like you are close without much safety margin, especially as you bounce on our rough roads. If you do upgrade to 8K axles you might want to compare the cost to MOR/ryde IS suspension. I do think you are wise to be concerned about this as suspension problems are so common. Greg Greg & Judy Bahnmiller Class of 2007 2014 F350 2007 HitchHiker Champagne Both sold 2/19, settled in Foley, AL after 12 years on the road http://bahnmilleradventure.blogspot.com/ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MrSeas Posted September 30, 2015 Report Share Posted September 30, 2015 Deleted Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
D&J Posted September 30, 2015 Report Share Posted September 30, 2015 The place that aligns my axles says that Dexter axles from 7K to 8K are the same but the springs are heavier on the 8K, your disk brakes should be 8K already. Your may want to call Mor-Ryde to make sure the RE is also 8K, it not you may be able to replace the rubber springs. If you don't have Dexter axles then you may have to change them. Denny Denny & Jami SKP#90175 Most Timing with Mac our Scottie, RIP Jasper our Westie 2013 F350 SC DRW 6.2 V8 4.30 Gears 2003 HH Premier 35FKTG Home Base Nebraska Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chad Heiser Posted September 30, 2015 Report Share Posted September 30, 2015 Is the 13600 lbs truly just on your axles or is that the total weight of your trailer? If it is the total weight of your trailer, then I think you are OK. If it is the actual axle weight, then I would also want to know individual wheel weight to make sure no one side of any axle is over weight. I would consider the upgrade as a nice cushion if you are truly at 13600 lbs on the axles. My trailer has 7000 lb axles also. My total trailer weight is 16300 lbs (when loaded for a long trip) with about 3000 lbs of pin weight (for a total of 13300 lbs on my axles). I am riding close to my axle max weights. I did upgrade to 17.5" wheels and commercial grade tires for a little cushion on the tires, but I have not upgraded the axles at this point. I did upgrade to greaseable shackles/wet bolt kit with heavier hardware also. I am not full time, so my coach isn't on the road as much as some others and I also weigh less on many shorter trips. 2000 Kenworth T2000 w/ Cummins N14 and autoshift 2017 DRV Mobile Suite 40KSSB4 with factory mods, dealer mods and personal mods - now in the RV graveyard 2022 DRV Full House MX450 with customized floor plan 2018 Polaris RZR Turbo S (fits in the garage) 2016 Smart Car (fits in the garage or gets flat towed behind the DRV when the RZR is in the garage)My First Solar Install ThreadMy Second Solar Install Thread & Photos and Documents Related to the buildMy MX450's solar, battery and inverter system - my biggest system yet! chadheiser.com West Coast HDT Rally Website Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OU812 Posted October 1, 2015 Report Share Posted October 1, 2015 CE Increasing the axels capacity ...... check with the axel manufactory...Dexter ...Mor/yde... ect. to see what the difference in axel are...brakes bearings spindle size springs. and .ect. The thought that would concern me with what you are trying to do is ..... the frame, structure that you are attaching them to. I seen people do this, and several times after a few miles on the road... the frame at the axels lay, at the axels. A lack of frame and cross members. So I would be doing is checking the trailer frame.. or maybe the tires are a little closer on one side then the other, only by a inch. or so, they ware funny, too. Look down the frame from the back to front, if you can. The manufactory of the trailer may have some input also. Another dead give away to find a over loader trailer, or one that has been over loaded, is look at the body sides. If the frame is bent or over stressed, the body will not look like it dose when it was new. It will have some curves or ripples, where it shouldn't have them. Over loading trailers (GVW) is common, tire are the one of the first to go. If you only go short trips.... you will might get away with the weight for a while. When over frame stress shows up.... more likely it is to late...and will cost bundle to fix. do your research... good luck OU812 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fulltimer51 Posted October 1, 2015 Report Share Posted October 1, 2015 I can say after just "up grading" my 7k springs to 8k springs and adding shocks that even with greasable shackles etc, spring eyes(ends) wear out fast (2yr). 4k springs ride an inch or two higher, but rougher. More stuff gets moved around. I would not have done the upgrade had it not been that extended warranty paid for it. Im saving my money for the Moryde IS. George2011 F350 6.7PSD CC 4X4 DRW Lariate2015 Mobile Suites 41 RSSB4 5th Wheel Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ron Posted October 1, 2015 Report Share Posted October 1, 2015 Our 23" TT with dual Dexter D35 (3,500' axles) and 15" wheels gave me continuous problems with tires and two bent axles. I weighed the rig regularly and was never over or even very close to the GVWR specified for the trailer (7,820#). I concluded that there was just no margin in the design and a combination of 15" ST tires and marginally specified axles was not going to work. I replaced the axles with Dexter D52's (5,200#) but kept the same suspension (drop-in replacement). This allowed me to go to 16" wheels and from 10" to 12" brakes. Altogether a much better system that eliminated all those problems. I now have over 52K miles on this set-up and not a single axle or tire problem. Like Fulltimer51 the ride inside the trailer became a little rougher but in my case, with the same suspension, I suspect it is due to significantly higher un-sprung weight of the heavier axles, wheels, and those very heavy Michelin XPS Rib tires. If I were you I'd try running your current set-up. Then if you experience problems implement an upgrade. ----ron Ron Engelsman http://www.mytripjournal.com/our_odyssey Full-Timing since mid 2007 23' Komfort TT 2004 Chevy Avalanche 4x4 8.1L Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alie&Jim's Carrilite Posted October 1, 2015 Report Share Posted October 1, 2015 The poster has a Carriage Cameo that has Dexter 7k axles as standard equipment. The disc brakes and 17.5 tires were probably factory options. His Cameo is a heavy unit, 17500 or so gross weight. As long as his tires are ok, he should be fine. Alie & Jim + 8 paws 2017 DRV Memphis BART- 1998 Volvo 610 Lil'ole 6cyl Cummins Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rving4us Posted October 1, 2015 Author Report Share Posted October 1, 2015 Thanks to every one for your reply's. I think I'm going to run with what I have. The Carriage Cameo has a well built frame and like Jim said with my factory disc brakes and Goodyear 17.5 H rated tires rate at 4800 lbs each I should be ok. April 2016 it will be time to replace my tires which I will. I'm a little less weight than Jim said at 16.800 so I'll take a wait and see attitude. Thanks again , you guy's are the best. Cary 2014 Ram,4x4,dually,CC Cummins 2011 Carriage Cameo 37KS3 full body paint, Most options except Generator SKP# 123923 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
D&J Posted October 1, 2015 Report Share Posted October 1, 2015 CE with your trailer loaded ready for the road look at all four springs and see it they still have a arch, it they do your fine. I replace mine when they started to flatten out, I stayed with 7 K springs, we have 12600 on the axles. Denny Denny & Jami SKP#90175 Most Timing with Mac our Scottie, RIP Jasper our Westie 2013 F350 SC DRW 6.2 V8 4.30 Gears 2003 HH Premier 35FKTG Home Base Nebraska Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
reed and elaine Posted October 2, 2015 Report Share Posted October 2, 2015 Need to know what weight the frame is designed to hold, not just axle/tire standards. Reed and Elaine Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gjhunter01 Posted October 2, 2015 Report Share Posted October 2, 2015 There is a safety margin built in to all engineered designs. When you run close to the design limits, just do more frequent inspections including the tires, springs, and frame welds. My Cameo has the sealed bottom which is hard to inspect the frame, but every 1k miles I make it a habit to crawl under the trailer with a flashlite and do a visual check. Greg Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TireHobby Posted October 2, 2015 Report Share Posted October 2, 2015 When the manufacturer of your trailer built it they had to set it’s GAWR (s) and display their selected values on the trailer’s certification label. Only the manufacturer or a certified vehicle modifier is allowed to change GAWR. Therefore, replacement axles of a higher load capacity than the OE axles will still have the GAWR rating on the certification label and only require tires/rims that qualify for the original equipment axles GAWR. 38' fiver - Dodge Dually AKA: FastEagle USN Retired - DOD Retired - SSA Retired Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
D&J Posted October 4, 2015 Report Share Posted October 4, 2015 When the manufacturer of your trailer built it they had to set it’s GAWR (s) and display their selected values on the trailer’s certification label. Only the manufacturer or a certified vehicle modifier is allowed to change GAWR. Therefore, replacement axles of a higher load capacity than the OE axles will still have the GAWR rating on the certification label and only require tires/rims that qualify for the original equipment axles GAWR. He wasn't going for a increase just a safety factor. Denny Denny & Jami SKP#90175 Most Timing with Mac our Scottie, RIP Jasper our Westie 2013 F350 SC DRW 6.2 V8 4.30 Gears 2003 HH Premier 35FKTG Home Base Nebraska Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TireHobby Posted October 5, 2015 Report Share Posted October 5, 2015 He wasn't going for a increase just a safety factor. Denny That’s sort of why I didn’t post it as a quote. Its just useful info. Lots of people don’t know that when a replacement axle is used and it has more load capacity than the original, its rated value (GAWR) is still the same as the value depicted on the trailer’s certification label set by the vehicle manufacturer. 38' fiver - Dodge Dually AKA: FastEagle USN Retired - DOD Retired - SSA Retired Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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