Broncohauler Posted June 20, 2015 Report Share Posted June 20, 2015 The city of Santa Barbara California Told my company about five years ago to not come back with 53 foot trailers and sleeper trucks. That we were over length and they would write us up. To be honest you're crazy if you try to take anything bigger than a 28 foot trailer in that small town anyway. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Big5er Posted June 20, 2015 Report Share Posted June 20, 2015 Perhaps Phil or somebody more familiar can correct me. I don't the states that allow double or triple trailers could be within max length if the tractor truck was included in the length. Bob, no need to correct you, you are absolutely right. Here is Texas state law, which mirrors the Federal code for the Interstate system which is what several states do. A few state with more winding roads that others have some tighter limits for areas off the interstate. The following maximum dimensions may be operated on Texas’ highways without a permit: Width – 8’6” Height – 14’ Length (includes any front/rear overhang): Vehicle Type Length Limit Single motor vehicle 45 feet Truck-tractor Unlimited Semitrailer, of two-vehicle combination 59 feet Two- or Three-Vehicle combination other than truck-tractor & semitrailer 65 feet (This is where your RV fits) Each trailer or semitrailer of a twin-trailer combination 28.5 feet Traditional boat/auto transporter combination 65 feet Commercial truck & stinger-steered semitrailer transporting autos/boats 75 feet Front overhang 3 feet Rear overhang 4 feet If you prefer pictures, go here to download a .pdf file from Tx DPS that is illustrated. Also, just remember once you convert your "truck tractor" to a "private truck" or a "motorhome", it isn't a "truck tractor" anymore. MY PEOPLE SKILLS ARE JUST FINE.~It's my tolerance to idiots that needs work.~ 2005 Volvo 780 VED12 465hp / Freedomline transmission singled mid position / Bed by Larry Herrin2018 customed Mobile Suites 40KSSB3 2014 smart Fortwo Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dollytrolley Posted June 20, 2015 Report Share Posted June 20, 2015 The city of Santa Barbara California Told my company about five years ago to not come back with 53 foot trailers and sleeper trucks. That we were over length and they would write us up. To be honest you're crazy if you try to take anything bigger than a 28 foot trailer in that small town anyway. Right on Bronc.... When we retired I had hoped to keep our rig small and light enough to get by with a light tow rig but...........Dolly-the-paint-horse gained about 30 pounds and then tipped the scales at 950 pounds....... Yes I know including a horse in your RV travels is a sure way to get the rig up in the upper weight ratings......... Each year the "rig" gained a ton or more and you know what......a ton here and a ton there and someday you find yourself pretty heavy...... A lot of folks on the forum wring their hands and compare endless trucks and features of the whole universe of HDT's ....... I grew up around too many trucks as a kid so they are still just ......Trucks to me at the end of the day. We bought a older Short-nose Century Freightshaker that seems to have a fair shape running gear and less than ideal cosmetics that will be improved. What I did NOT want to do was get too far into the TRUCKING game .....I just needed a RV tow rig that could STOP-n-GO in a reasonable manner and handle the "horse-induced-loads" that the DW's RV lifestyle has....... In our final configuration we are at 64 feet overall and that is plenty for retirement and like Bronc a 28 ft trailer is plenty to tow in a small town our 30 ft toy-Dolly-hauler is about the most that I like to deal with these days. We are somewhat amazed how happy we are with a 30 ft trailer but we tend to RV in warm climes where we our outside a lot and that likely helps a lot. A few moons ago I ran a outfit and we had TWO large leased cranes that were NINE ft wide and WAY TOO long...... one had THREE steer axles and FOUR drive axles........The other crane was BIGGER..........What a PAIN-in-the-kister....... One monster had a 800 hp Mann and the BIG-boy had a 850 Mann so on the freeway they did fair but when you got off the freeway Kate-bar-the-door it was NO fun at all......... Maybe I was abused in my younger days.......but now that I am retired 64 feet of truck and trailer is more than plenty.........maybe Jeff will win the Lotto and will me his Argosy and then my rig will be even shorter....... Drive on............(ya size does matter......) 97 Freightshaker Century Cummins M11-370 / 1350 /10 spd / 3:08 /tandem/ 20ft Garage/ 30 ft Curtis Dune toybox with a removable horse-haul-module to transport Dolly-The-Painthorse to horse camps and trail heads all over the Western U S Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
buzz64 Posted June 21, 2015 Report Share Posted June 21, 2015 Big5er I do not understand the classification of combination for us. If it stated commercial tractor truck I could see us not qualifying. it just states truck tractor, Does that change with registered as an RV? I'm sure this could be argued in court that it is still a tractor but I don't want to spend time there doing that. If these are not tractors, is it possible to obtain an over length permit? If no permit is obtained, about how much would the citation cost you? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Big5er Posted June 21, 2015 Report Share Posted June 21, 2015 In Texas a "tractor" (truck tractor or road tractor) is a commercial vehicle and required to register with combination or apportioned license plates and "As a prerequisite to title and registration, vehicles must meet the Federal DOT and Texas safety standards". A "truck" can be either personal or commercial. So, if it is for personal use it is a "truck". Also if it has a load bearing bed, by definition it is no longer a tractor either, which is why this is a truck and cannot be a tractor. That is the same reason that any of us with beds couldn't be "tractors" even if we wanted to.Texas is very easy about allowing you to convert your "tractor" to a "truck" or a "motorhome". But, as I said in my previous post, once you convert it (ie: for personal use) it isn't a truck tractor anymore. You can't have your cake and eat it too. If these are not tractors, is it possible to obtain an over length permit? If no permit is obtained, about how much would the citation cost you? Yes, you can get a permit...or more accurately many permits. A state permit is good for all interstate and state highways. Then you would need to check with every jurisdiction that you plan to travel through (city and county) to see if anything along your route requires a permit. We have a small city east of here that has a railroad bridge going over the main highway that is impassable to tall loads. They detour using a small, half mile long, two lane road. They use bucket trucks to raise the lights and wires and foul up traffic on that road to go around this bridge. The city requires a $200 permit for any oversized load using that 1/2 mile long road. The violation for not having a permit is for being over length and each court sets their own fine amount. That little city hits trucking companies with the max for not getting a permit. The State limits traffic fines to a $500 max except for certain offenses, and being over length is NOT one of the special cases. And that only covers ONE state. Where are you planning to go for vacation? MY PEOPLE SKILLS ARE JUST FINE.~It's my tolerance to idiots that needs work.~ 2005 Volvo 780 VED12 465hp / Freedomline transmission singled mid position / Bed by Larry Herrin2018 customed Mobile Suites 40KSSB3 2014 smart Fortwo Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
buzz64 Posted June 21, 2015 Report Share Posted June 21, 2015 Thanks for that. I plan on traveling EVERYWHERE staying at campgrounds for short stays. So it sounds like a lot of homework to get the proper permits. So goes the the price for driving awesome I guess. AGAIN, THANKS FOR THE EDUCATION. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
buzz64 Posted June 21, 2015 Report Share Posted June 21, 2015 Big5er Thanks for the lesson. Sounds like we all have really big pick up's. I am planning on full time travel everywhere so it appears to be a lot of homework planning our trips to be legal. Guess that's the price to drive awesome RV haulers. Thanks again Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Big5er Posted June 21, 2015 Report Share Posted June 21, 2015 buzz, the odds of getting stopped are fairly low. There are a LOT more commercial rigs than RV's and a very few enforcement guys. That doesn't mean that one of them won't stop you, it just means the odds are in your favor. The cost of permits to full time across the country would be astronomical. Until things change, it would likely outweigh the cost of a whole bunch of citations. I'm not telling you how to travel, or advising you to break the law, (and all of this is strictly my OPINION. It is not a subject for debate) but the length laws for RV's were written back in the stone age, when your parents and mine pulled that 25ft airstream with the family station wagon or the tent camper and the boat behind that F100. The laws, as written, never envisioned anyone pulling an RV with a converted truck tractor, nor did they envision a 40+ ft travel trailer with a weight rating upward of 20,000lbs. Those antiquated laws need to be re-visited and updated. Now for the down-side: (again more of MY opinion) IF, (big "if") that ever happens, it will be a long and slow process AND it will probably be accompanied by a re-vamping of the qualifications to drive such an RV as ours. IF we can be the same length as that OTR trucker, and haul the kind of weights we are hauling, then someone is going to want us to follow the same rules as those guys. As I said, we can't have our cake and eat it too. Travel over length, run the risk of a ticket. Get the law on length changed, and run the risk of being required to follow some very enhanced rules to do it. Damned if we do, damned if we don't. MY PEOPLE SKILLS ARE JUST FINE.~It's my tolerance to idiots that needs work.~ 2005 Volvo 780 VED12 465hp / Freedomline transmission singled mid position / Bed by Larry Herrin2018 customed Mobile Suites 40KSSB3 2014 smart Fortwo Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SuiteSuccess Posted June 21, 2015 Report Share Posted June 21, 2015 "As I said, we can't have our cake and eat it too. Travel over length, run the risk of a ticket. Get the law on length changed, and run the risk of being required to follow some very enhanced rules to do it. Damned if we do, damned if we don't." Well said, Phil. 2006 Volvo 780 "Hoss" Volvo D12, 465hp, 1650 ft/lbs tq., ultrashift Bed Build by "JW Morgan's Custom Welding" 2017 DRV 39DBRS3 2013 Smart Passion Coupe "Itty Bitty" "Don't go around saying the world owes you a living. The world owes you nothing. It was here first!" Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Randyretired Posted June 21, 2015 Report Share Posted June 21, 2015 Most states also require oversize loads to stop at the weigh and check stations. My experience is the first thing they will want to see is the state permit. So you will get the notice to bring your paperwork in. They will also check for signage and proper placement of flags and markers. Depending on the state and the LEO they may be quick to cite you if any little thing is not correct to help you remeber next time. Randy 2001 Volvo VNL 42 Cummins ISX Autoshift Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SunJuniper Posted June 21, 2015 Report Share Posted June 21, 2015 some states will deny you entry if your overlength ... Cough Cough... OREGON.... i dont know the exact details but they were over length and they were denied entry into oregon. they were headed south and had to go thru idaho instead. Fulltimer Class of 2007 1998 Volvo VNL64T610 Detroit Series 60 12.7 470HP/1650TQ Eaton 18spd 228"WB Tandem2006 40' ToyHauler 3 slides and a 14' Toybox Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Broncohauler Posted June 22, 2015 Report Share Posted June 22, 2015 "As I said, we can't have our cake and eat it too. Travel over length, run the risk of a ticket. Get the law on length changed, and run the risk of being required to follow some very enhanced rules to do it. Damned if we do, damned if we don't." X2 well said Phil Well said, Phil. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dollytrolley Posted June 22, 2015 Report Share Posted June 22, 2015 some states will deny you entry if your overlength ... Cough Cough... OREGON.... i dont know the exact details but they were over length and they were denied entry into oregon. they were headed south and had to go thru idaho instead. Double tow in Oregon is a BIG-NO-NO........You want to see a trooper hook a FAST-U-TURN....... just try to get a few miles into Oregon with a double.........( I think the trooper gets a double-pay-day reward for a double-tow pinch). Several moons ago Beaver Coaches here in Bend had a big-engine (550 HP) +45 ft class A DP rig called a Thunder and it was pretty impressive but it actually was a little over + 46 ft as I recall and Oregon DMV would register these rigs but fairly soon California discovered that these rigs were over-length and started a campaign of "Revenue Enhancement" and it was pretty ugly to get put out-of- service for over length with your new $300K rig......... Beaver actually came out with a kit to bring the rigs back to 45 ft is was not cheap.......... Size matters........ Drive on .........(get a short tape measure.....) 97 Freightshaker Century Cummins M11-370 / 1350 /10 spd / 3:08 /tandem/ 20ft Garage/ 30 ft Curtis Dune toybox with a removable horse-haul-module to transport Dolly-The-Painthorse to horse camps and trail heads all over the Western U S Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dollytrolley Posted June 22, 2015 Report Share Posted June 22, 2015 Some moons ago........"we" conducted "operations" that were conducted under the heading of "PUBLIC USE".........often this type of "operations" exempted "us" from many or ALL regulations regarding whatever we were "Tasking" .......... Some of the younger "operators" were often prone to feel that being "exempted" was a free-pass to be a macho-cowboy-dare-devil........not really the case in the real world..........'us-old-geezers" would reel-in the young cowboys and explain that just because we were allowed to fly as low as we could it did not stop some clouds from having BIG ROCKS inside them......... The cowboys would laugh and say "you old-geezers are no fun at all"..........I would respond "your right, us old-geezers are no fun.....but the "fun" guys are all dead"........ In the real world, the "PUBLIC USE"-NO-RULES " "operations" were a pain-in-the-kister because we had to operate in often "risk-adverse-conditions" and devise our own "rules" just to stay alive....... Don't get me wrong there are plenty of pain-in-the-kister laws that are just a pain..........but a fair amount of transportation laws have a history that defines the need for the laws. I have had to operate too big of loads (+100 ft wide, +300 ft long, +1000 tons) and I found it to be a LOT of work and a fair amount of STRESS. Many on the forum operate past the 65 ft length so this begs the question.......... What does everyone think the RV max length limit should be? As I recall Idaho has a 75 ft RV limit is that a good start? How long is long enough? Pondering....... Drive on..........(maybe long is not too bad....) 97 Freightshaker Century Cummins M11-370 / 1350 /10 spd / 3:08 /tandem/ 20ft Garage/ 30 ft Curtis Dune toybox with a removable horse-haul-module to transport Dolly-The-Painthorse to horse camps and trail heads all over the Western U S Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rickeieio Posted June 22, 2015 Report Share Posted June 22, 2015 D/T, My first thought was to respond that we should fall under the same length limits as commercial rigs. (53' trailer, but no limit on tractor) But a half second later, I realized that it would get badly abused. So that said, I think a 48 or 53' trailer and 75' over all would be reasonable. With a 40' trailer and 67' over all, it's already difficult in some parks, and back roads. Personally, we like to travel the smaller roads, and are considering down-sizing to a 36' trailer, but not a toy hauler. KW T-680, POPEMOBILE Newmar X-Aire, VATICAN Lots of old motorcycles, Moto Guzzi Griso and Spyder F3 currently in the front row Young enough to play in the dirt as a retired farmer. contact me at rickeieio1@comcast.net Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CrazyCooter Posted June 22, 2015 Report Share Posted June 22, 2015 I don't think I would want a 53' RV trailer since the roads getting to the places aren't built strait or wide enough to stay in your own lane to make the tighter corners. I know there were some changes recently in CA laws allowing over 40' RV trailers, but there were wheelbase and rear overhang considerations attached to the law. Funny most of the 5er toy hauler crowd have been running illegal all these years and nobody got sued for selling them to us? With that said, I think 68-70' is plenty for a two vehicle combination, but three vehicles maybe 75'? Or 80' if on an STAA route? 1999 Peterbilt 385 C12 430/1650 13spd 2006 Dodge 3500 DRW 4x4 2010 Hitchhiker Champagne 36 LKRSB Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dollytrolley Posted June 22, 2015 Report Share Posted June 22, 2015 D/T, My first thought was to respond that we should fall under the same length limits as commercial rigs. (53' trailer, but no limit on tractor) But a half second later, I realized that it would get badly abused. So that said, I think a 48 or 53' trailer and 75' over all would be reasonable. With a 40' trailer and 67' over all, it's already difficult in some parks, and back roads. Personally, we like to travel the smaller roads, and are considering down-sizing to a 36' trailer, but not a toy hauler. Rick, good points, Depending on our configuration(s) (we have a couple of different bed / box combos for the FL) our FL can be from 27 ft to 34 ft long and trailers vary from 18ft to 30 ft TT and we can do a 5er or goose if needed. Like you we travel a lot of remote back roads with Dolly-the-paint-horse 'adventures so our 30ft toy-Dolly-hauler is about all I care to wind around some of the twisty pig-trail-roads we travel. We are pretty weird in that we are pretty happy with our basic / simple no-slide toy-hauler BUT we tend to have a LOT of storage on the FL including 330 gal of water that would tax even the largest 5er...... With a horse in our RV travels a lot of RV parks are not a option but many of the fairgrounds and rodeo grounds are configured for double livestock rigs so we often have the most space to park at the end of the day. Mini-mart diesel pumps are not much fun at 64 ft and some towns are pretty tight for space just for a short rest stop. We do see some pretty long RV's in Idaho so some folks get by fairly long and likely seem not bothered at 75 ft or more....... We own a home on the central Oregon Coast and the main highway is pretty twisty and the length limit is 65 FT and a long-logger with a few logs poking out back gives you the new meaning to the term Right-of-way......... when a log tail-swings 3 ft into your lane on a sharp curve, trust me the log indeed has the right-of-way......... Long can be a adventure in many ways...... Drive on.........(watch the tail-swing) 97 Freightshaker Century Cummins M11-370 / 1350 /10 spd / 3:08 /tandem/ 20ft Garage/ 30 ft Curtis Dune toybox with a removable horse-haul-module to transport Dolly-The-Painthorse to horse camps and trail heads all over the Western U S Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shallow Draft Posted June 22, 2015 Report Share Posted June 22, 2015 Gotta love the no frills camping at fair grounds and racetracks!!! Lots of room but lite on luxury. 2004 Volvo 630, Freedomline, Rear view camera, Max Brake, Jackalopee, 38 ft 4 horse LQ Platinum, 40ft Jayco Talon toy hauler Http:/www.flickr.com/photos/shallow_draft/ Https://flic.kr/p/fqhyAN You are not lost if you don't care where you are!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jack Mayer Posted June 23, 2015 Report Share Posted June 23, 2015 I would think the length would depend on what is pulling it. I'd say go with commercial rules and let the owner decide if they want that 53' trailer that may or may not fit into the park he would like to go to. My trailer is 45' and I have ZERO issues finding parks. The bigger issue I see is a safety one. A 48' trailer being pulled by a pickup is real iffy IMO. But I know of no way to regulate stupidity. Jack & Danielle Mayer #60376 Lifetime Member Living on the road since 2000PLEASE no PM's. Email me. jackdanmayer AT gmail 2016 DRV Houston 44' 5er (we still have it) 2022 New Horizons 43' 5er 2016 Itasca 27N 28' motorhome 2019 Volvo 860, D13 455/1850, 236" wb, I-Shift, battery-based APU No truck at the moment - we use one of our demo units 2016 smart Passion, piggyback on the truck -------------------------------------------------------------------------See our website for info on New Horizons 5th wheels, HDTs as tow vehicles, communications on the road, and use of solar powerwww.jackdanmayer.com Principal in RVH Lifestyles. RVH-Lifestyles.com Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dollytrolley Posted June 23, 2015 Report Share Posted June 23, 2015 I would think the length would depend on what is pulling it. I'd say go with commercial rules and let the owner decide if they want that 53' trailer that may or may not fit into the park he would like to go to. My trailer is 45' and I have ZERO issues finding parks. The bigger issue I see is a safety one. A 48' trailer being pulled by a pickup is real iffy IMO. But I know of no way to regulate stupidity. Good points Jack, I guess I have a fairly low opinion of pickups stemming from my childhood around heavy equipment........pickups were mostly light service vehicles and TRUCKS were TRUCKS not.....pickups....... Being a geezer now I am amazed at the Super-Pickup market hipe and even more amazed at the $$$$ spent on pickups......oh the simple entertainment that geezers have......... Anyhow one of the things that seems to have little consideration is the consideration of hitch-tail-swing in relation to trailer axle geometry and the best practices of tractor / trailer tracking......... Granted, until you get into ultra-custom trailer builds do we have much say in trailer axle location so it seems that the only real chance to obtain better hitch / tailswing is when the tractor has it's drive axle relocated during the single process AND then the hitch is located in relation to the axle............ Of course short, mid or long single conversion has many points to ponder........over-all length.....SmartCar room......DOM......Hitch type.....Axle weight and balance distribution .etc, etc. Much talk on the forum centers around the turning radius of short, mid or long axle location but the effect of hitch-tail-swing gets very little comment it is almost assumed that IF one can turn sharp enough the we can make the trailer do whatever we want....... In the real world a good- tracking trailer makes life good.... a poor tracking trailer is a constant source of higher-work-load and often results in cut-corner-damage to trailer axles, body panels and bent-over stop signs, etc. We had a couple of crane carriers that were HUGE and were not fun to move around BUT they had THREE steer axles AND at crawl-speed the FOUR drive axles could be steered to closely follow the front steer axles..........these huge cranes were in some ways were easier to position than many RV units...........now of course at a few million a pop the cranes had some features missing on RV's....... My point is that long trailers are best served by close attention to tracking considerations........ something to ponder Drive on.........(watch the curbs.....) 97 Freightshaker Century Cummins M11-370 / 1350 /10 spd / 3:08 /tandem/ 20ft Garage/ 30 ft Curtis Dune toybox with a removable horse-haul-module to transport Dolly-The-Painthorse to horse camps and trail heads all over the Western U S Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jack Mayer Posted June 23, 2015 Report Share Posted June 23, 2015 My point is that long trailers are best served by close attention to tracking considerations........ something to ponder Drive on.........(watch the curbs.....) Yup...I could not agree more. In most cases it is not much of a consideration with HDTs, and MOST trailers. But I can tell you that it does matter. On my current trailer, relative to my previous 43' one, the tracking has changed enough to be noticeable. Why is that? It is because I added to the axle centerline/kingpin dimension by creating a larger upper deck. The axle are moved as far forward as possible given the door/steps location. The maneuvering difference is notable, although not a "problem". Jack & Danielle Mayer #60376 Lifetime Member Living on the road since 2000PLEASE no PM's. Email me. jackdanmayer AT gmail 2016 DRV Houston 44' 5er (we still have it) 2022 New Horizons 43' 5er 2016 Itasca 27N 28' motorhome 2019 Volvo 860, D13 455/1850, 236" wb, I-Shift, battery-based APU No truck at the moment - we use one of our demo units 2016 smart Passion, piggyback on the truck -------------------------------------------------------------------------See our website for info on New Horizons 5th wheels, HDTs as tow vehicles, communications on the road, and use of solar powerwww.jackdanmayer.com Principal in RVH Lifestyles. RVH-Lifestyles.com Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CrazyCooter Posted June 23, 2015 Report Share Posted June 23, 2015 I agree in that whatever commercial length and wheelbase is allowed on a given road should be allowed on an RV setup....but most times that isn't over 65' on many of our local roads leaving our city to a common recreation destination. 1999 Peterbilt 385 C12 430/1650 13spd 2006 Dodge 3500 DRW 4x4 2010 Hitchhiker Champagne 36 LKRSB Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
earlvillestu Posted June 23, 2015 Report Share Posted June 23, 2015 The bigger issue I see is a safety one. A 48' trailer being pulled by a pickup is real iffy IMO. But I know of no way to regulate stupidity. Speaking of stupidity. Driving down I90 (in my Taurus) this morning between the Wisconsin line and Rockford and passed by a dude towing a Mobile Suites 36TK3 with Louisiana plates with an F250, weaving in and out of traffic at 75-80 mph, and drifting all over whatever lane he happened to be in. Yep, you can't regulate it, and you can't fix it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Broncohauler Posted June 23, 2015 Report Share Posted June 23, 2015 I don't think I would want a 53' RV trailer since the roads getting to the places aren't built strait or wide enough to stay in your own lane to make the tighter corners. I know there were some changes recently in CA laws allowing over 40' RV trailers, but there were wheelbase and rear overhang considerations attached to the law. Funny most of the 5er toy hauler crowd have been running illegal all these years and nobody got sued for selling them to us? With that said, I think 68-70' is plenty for a two vehicle combination, but three vehicles maybe 75'? Or 80' if on an STAA route? Weekend warrior was sued for many reasons that's one of them. They underrated dry weight on trailers so people would not have to get an RV license. When I bought mine from them they made me sign a form after I had given them my money and sale is complete saying that my truck could handle towing the trailer they were selling me. At that time in F350 super duty. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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