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Tesla Battery/Inverter testing


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Time will tell what the full Tesla giga battery factory will produce. But ran into a piece that for the first time mentioned the size of unit and KW of the home battery. (I did look to see if RV had posted this, and could have missed it, as he does have a few Musk's related threads going. Hi!)

 

 

  • "The Battery has the inverter also."
  • "The battery is about 3 ft tall and 2.5 ft wide and looks good."
  • "The installer offered a choice between 10KWH and 15KWH; he went with 10KWH."

http://finance.yahoo.com/news/teslas-product-secretly-tested-330-111912047.html

I suspect most of us would be supported well in our RV's by the 10K unit! That size is the tough one for most of us, and until it is announced, the price may be high too. And most of us do not require the inverter. So, as mentioned, we'll just need to wait to see how this play out, and what other batteries will be available that might work well for RV applications.

For home application, this is a natural next step in reducing energy costs. With todays rebates and incentives, a home solar panel system pencils out to be about a 5-6.5 year breakeven point. That's with an all cash purchase, longer if financing part or all of it. But with low interest rates, still cost effective. Time will tell how much the costs of battery will add, and the expected life cycle, and if Solar City offers package deals.

Exciting times over the next few years!

Best to all,

Smitty

(And sorry if RV has this thread going somewhere else!)

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The power is good. The size and weight are the deciding factors: 1.2v 300ah cell at 23 pounds. To get 12v at 300ah you are looking at 230 pounds, not to mention a lot of space required.

 

I helped haul these type of batteries from our ship to a shore nav light. We could each carry about 3 of them in a pack so it was an all hands evolution to repower the aid.

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Smitty,

Not only did I not post it, I completely missed this thread until today.

 

The crucial tipping point has happened for both the EV transportation industry and solar industry, and all that goes with those technologically. As we both know. Any doubters read on. The cost of batteries is the main factor and just Tesla's sales would not bring the economies of scale needed to bring not only th price down, but exponentially increase competitive battery tech R&D because there is real money to be made. He always said he wanted competition, the more the better. And like all of us who invested long and hung in there through all the infrastructure and production years to the Model S the payoff has been great. So when we saw Elon open his patents up as he was breaking ground on the gigafactory,we knew what was up, and, as usual, it was daring but calculated in the risk. All batteries needed was demand. And now it is coming and all at about the same time as the Tesla economy car comes out ~ 2017/2018.

 

Musk created the demand singlehandedly bringing the rest of the car industry into active production after waiting seven years for anyone to come up with anything that could compete with his Tesla line that went into full production with the Tesla Roadster in 2008. The only major manufacturer to come out with an actual EV was Nissan with the Leaf that only got about 60-80 miles per charge, and it took two years after Tesla put his Roadster on the road to even come up with that. Not much competition. So he gave all his patents away three years after putting the first Model S on the road with 250-300 mile range per charge in 2012. He gave away his patents for use by any car maker less than six months ago and suddenly every manufacturer is announcing a real EV, not hybrid, within two to three years.

 

I do get a kick out of the truly ignorant investment news writers/talking heads, who keep missing the boat. Or are paid to write or report false reports in hope of stampeding investors or buyers with stupid protectionism by insisting a new tech company do bad business like their dealers and pay a middleman toll when no franchise dealers are needed or wanted.

 

I imagine Tattoo from Fantasy Island looking afar and shouting "Ze price, Ze price!" every time I hear EVs are too expensive. Duh? But about to change faster than vinyl records turned into CDs once they came out. He has again singlehandedly created demand where there was only Tesla before. By letting others use his patents he gains the economies of scale as well as the others. But, and this is significant, he will control the majority of battery production. And as such make sure greedy oligarchs don't artificially fix prices higher like the hedge funds are doing with oil and gas markets and futures today.

 

Once the economies of scale kick in the prices will drop like a K-Mart thermometer in a Blue Northern'.

 

Still 2 - 4 years off, but coming fast.

 

And then there's LEO communications satellites and his monopoly on military launches while the ULA scrambles to get a launch platform built and certified. Those profits can sure pay for lots of R&D.

 

The next decade will not even resemble this one. I expect major changes. Now see what my little investment in the future of energy and transportation has gone and done? Tho miniscule alone, it was all of us little guys that ignored the frightened old oligarchs, that chipped in to sustain the return of the electric car, and even the deniers of solar power are starting to back up and change their rhetoric.

 

You see, the batteries are key to cheap power worldwide, for both transportation and solar distributed generation as well as major grid production. Oh, and powering satellites, Mars missions, and the Internet.

 

Thanks for the link Mike. I'll bet we see more than one type getting development in the next few years.

Ain't technology wonderful!

 

Thanks Smitty for a great thread and topic.

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Smitty,

Not only did I not post it, I completely missed this thread until today.

 

The crucial tipping point has happened for both the EV transportation industry and solar industry, and all that goes with those technologically. As we both know. Any doubters read on. The cost of batteries is the main factor and just Tesla's sales would not bring the economies of scale needed to bring not only th price down, but exponentially increase competitive battery tech R&D because there is real money to be made. He always said he wanted competition, the more the better. And like all of us who invested long and hung in there through all the infrastructure and production years to the Model S the payoff has been great. So when we saw Elon open his patents up as he was breaking ground on the gigafactory,we knew what was up, and, as usual, it was daring but calculated in the risk. All batteries needed was demand. And now it is coming and all at about the same time as the Tesla economy car comes out ~ 2017/2018.

 

Musk created the demand singlehandedly bringing the rest of the car industry into active production after waiting seven years for anyone to come up with anything that could compete with his Tesla line that went into full production with the Tesla Roadster in 2008. The only major manufacturer to come out with an actual EV was Nissan with the Leaf that only got about 60-80 miles per charge, and it took two years after Tesla put his Roadster on the road to even come up with that. Not much competition. So he gave all his patents away three years after putting the first Model S on the road with 250-300 mile range per charge in 2012. He gave away his patents for use by any car maker less than six months ago and suddenly every manufacturer is announcing a real EV, not hybrid, within two to three years.

 

I do get a kick out of the truly ignorant investment news writers/talking heads, who keep missing the boat. Or are paid to write or report false reports in hope of stampeding investors or buyers with stupid protectionism by insisting a new tech company do bad business like their dealers and pay a middleman toll when no franchise dealers are needed or wanted.

 

I imagine Tattoo from Fantasy Island looking afar and shouting "Ze price, Ze price!" every time I hear EVs are too expensive. Duh? But about to change faster than vinyl records turned into CDs once they came out. He has again singlehandedly created demand where there was only Tesla before. By letting others use his patents he gains the economies of scale as well as the others. But, and this is significant, he will control the majority of battery production. And as such make sure greedy oligarchs don't artificially fix prices higher like the hedge funds are doing with oil and gas markets and futures today.

 

Once the economies of scale kick in the prices will drop like a K-Mart thermometer in a Blue Northern'.

 

Still 2 - 4 years off, but coming fast.

 

And then there's LEO communications satellites and his monopoly on military launches while the ULA scrambles to get a launch platform built and certified. Those profits can sure pay for lots of R&D.

 

The next decade will not even resemble this one. I expect major changes. Now see what my little investment in the future of energy and transportation has gone and done? Tho miniscule alone, it was all of us little guys that ignored the frightened old oligarchs, that chipped in to sustain the return of the electric car, and even the deniers of solar power are starting to back up and change their rhetoric.

 

You see, the batteries are key to cheap power worldwide, for both transportation and solar distributed generation as well as major grid production. Oh, and powering satellites, Mars missions, and the Internet.

 

Thanks for the link Mike. I'll bet we see more than one type getting development in the next few years.

Ain't technology wonderful!

 

Thanks Smitty for a great thread and topic.

RV, Hardly a new development, probably see drawings of those on cave walls LOL. But a very interesting chemistry and as they said . . . the last battery you will ever buy. VELLY INTARESTING!!!

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Sure is interesting. Solar isn't new either. Prior to the industrial revolution we had mostly solar economies too. The new developments come when fresh eyes look at old limits and push them back.

 

But Mike you'll have to show me where I said they were a new development? I think you may have misread my statement about development.

 

Transistors aren't new either, but they've been getting/under development for half a century or more too. How many transistors on a silicon chip now? They've just done denser lithium batteries too.

 

I do believe more than one type will be under development, be they new ideas f design, or new developments in manufacture to bring about economies of scale.

 

Here's more perspective on what I mean by development. And this article acknowledges the sparse data available due to intense competition just now developing to fill large scale battery applications and manufacturing.

 

Excerpt:

 

"Learning rate

 

To reach that level, costs will have to fall further. But a commercial breakthrough for the next generation of lithium batteries “is still distant,” the paper says, and many improvements in cell chemistry have already been realised. This seems to pour cold water on frequent claims of new battery types “transforming” the electric vehicle market.

 

However, there are still savings to be made in manufacturing improvements, industry learning, and economies of scale, which have already brought down costs in recent years. Cumulative global production and sales of electric vehicles are roughly doubling annually, the paper says.

 

That means the 30% cost reduction expected at Tesla Motors’ planned “Gigafactory” battery plant by 2017 represents a “trajectory close to the trends projected in this paper.” On the other hand, Renault-Nissan’s plans to build battery manufacturing capacity for 1.5 million cars by 2016 have hit the buffers as electric car sales have trailed expectations.

 

There are large uncertainties in the paper’s findings. Despite being the most comprehensive review to date, it relies on “sparse data” and acknowledges that a secretive industry might avoid revealing high costs, or conversely might subsidise battery packs to gain market share."

 

That article has a graph that shows dramatically how far we have come already, it is here:

http://cleantechnica.com/2015/03/26/ev-battery-costs-already-probably-cheaper-than-2020-projections/

 

Like I said, great times to invest and watch. (And to have an RV)

 

Safe travels!

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