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PEIFamily

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Well, she is still frozen in ice, but I started it up after disconnecting the ecm fuse for a few dozen turns.. Started up pretty good, but the belt was squealing (was doing that a bit before being stored when idling) but the battery light still won't go out. It shows between 12.2 and 12.4 when idling. I had it running about 20 or so minutes.

 

Would I be best to replace my belts and hope that by doing that it fixed the squealing/ low voltage?

 

When the truck is idling, the fan is turning pretty slow. Is this normal or due to the slipping?

 

Options are?
belts
alternator
batteries

 

My front tank also is empty, what would cause that? The other tanks had good pressure and drained fine when I drained them - but the first was empty (guage and tank).

Thanks

Jason

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If your batteries are down, it's going to take a bunch of charging to get them back up. Like

hours and hours of driving at highway speeds or a good charger plugged into shore power.

You also might speed up the idle to 1000 for a while to see if it starts coming up.

The alternator load is a lot of horsepower until the charge rate can come down, change the belt.

The baby is alive but sounds like wants a little TLC and she might be mad you let her sleep in the ice.

Others must chime on the air tank thing.

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If your batteries are down, it's going to take a bunch of charging to get them back up. Like

hours and hours of driving at highway speeds or a good charger plugged into shore power.

You also might speed up the idle to 1000 for a while to see if it starts coming up.

The alternator load is a lot of horsepower until the charge rate can come down, change the belt.

The baby is alive but sounds like wants a little TLC and she might be mad you let her sleep in the ice.

Others must chime on the air tank thing.

 

 

Had a charger on it all winter, manually turning it on and off every few days with only leaving it on a day at a time, It don't seem to come up past the 12.4v so I guess I need to unhook the alternator and check voltages there, but it could be the belts too..I will do those first before replacing the alternator or batteries.

 

Yep, the charging thing was something I started seeing last fall, but time now to fix it. The air tank thing is new.. She sounded pretty nice when she was running. Nice and smooth.

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My first inclination on both the charging issue and the air tank, knowing that it has been just a tad bit cold and snowy there, is ice. I'd check that the belt tensioners are moving freely, and would guess that the check valve that allows the front/secondary tank to fill might have just enough water frozen in it preventing it from opening.

 

Given how easy it is to pull an alternator off of most of these engines, one option would be to pull it off and have it bench tested. At least in the US, the major auto parts chains (e.g. Advance, AutoZone) will bench test an alternator for free.

 

What are you reading on the batteries with the engine off vs. running? If you've had a charger on them and the batteries aren't totally dead, you should have at least seen the voltage above 13 with 20 minutes of idle time, assuming you weren't running a bunch of stuff.

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JASON

As has been said, set the fast idle up to around 1000 RPM and that will help with the electric. On the air. there can be ice in the tank or line. Push in the brake button and pump the brake peddle a dozen times are so. Before you start the truck take the air line off at the compressor and pour some air line anti-freeze in it and reconnect it and start the truck.

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Had a charger on it all winter, manually turning it on and off every few days with only leaving it on a day at a time, It don't seem to come up past the 12.4v so I guess I need to unhook the alternator and check voltages there, but it could be the belts too..I will do those first before replacing the alternator or batteries.

 

Yep, the charging thing was something I started seeing last fall, but time now to fix it. The air tank thing is new.. She sounded pretty nice when she was running. Nice and smooth.

 

Sounds like you are going to do some maintenance on the truck. If you are going to change the belts you are half way to get the alternator out. Why not take the alternator in to a shop and have it bench tested. My thought on this, is for some piece of mind. Now I know the condition of the alternator. Then put your new belts on. Sorry about no help about the air problem.

 

Just my 2 cents,

Al

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Check the batteries (load test), you might have a bad cell. If it's been cold enough to freeze, it's possible that you froze a battery. Sure, keeping them plugged in will generate heat and help but freezing is still possible, especially the days that you had them off the charger.

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If you take the airline off at the compressor and dump brake line antifreeze in there you are throwing about 90% of it away and shortening the life of your air dryer cartridge. Your air dryer is designed to remove moisture from the air, be it water, oil or brake antifreeze.If you get much fluid in your "wet" tank that indicates you need to replace the cartridge and should probably put a rebuild kit in at the same time.

 

If you want to put some antifreeze in it should go in the outlet hose at the air dryer.

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Batteries will only freeze if they are severely discharged or dead. Their output amps drop way off when they are cold (50% of sticker output is not uncommon) but they are not frozen if there are volts present. They take much longer time to recharge when they are cold. A 160 amp truck alternator puts out maybe 60 or 70 amps at engine idle rpm. My really limited understanding of vehicle DC electrics is alternators do not really "bulk charge" discharged batteries properly - the regulator tapers the charge rate quickly...

 

Perhaps a proper knowledgeable person can explain it better :huh:

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Depending on your alternator - (Mine is a 35si) - you'll find a bunch of info here - http://delcoremy.com/Alternator-Models/35SI-HP-Heavy-Duty-Brushless-Alternator.aspx

 

If you have a Remote sense alt (great) - mine was but not hooked up (it Is NOW) - use it. (or change to hook it up) It will help a LOT) - http://delcoremy.com/Documents/Flyers/Delco-Remy-Remote-Sense-Flyer.aspx

 

What this does is sense the actual voltage at the battery instead of going through the 12 volt power system and uses that as the reference for the charge system. As the brochure explains. This really helps the 12 volt system and 'pumps' the batteries better.

 

I use the truck inverter to "power" the trailer @ 125 volts. I figure that I have a powerful (100 amp - limited to 50 amps for alternator protection) charger there that is set for my AGM batteries. It (the trailer inverter/charger) compensates for any line losses at 125 volts and there is a lot less (100X less) than a 12 volt line from the truck. There are other considerations but the system works well.

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If your belt is slipping the alternator might not be getting the spin it needs especially if it is trying to work hard with low batteries . Friend of mine had this on an older truck, replaced the bad alternator and thought the new one was bad because it did not show a good charge rate. Ended up he did not tension the belt enough. Once the the belt working properly all was fine.

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For a quick check of the alternator output you dont need to disconnect it. Measure the voltage of the batteries with engine not running using a multimeter. Then start the engine and measure the voltage at the batteries again...you should be seeing at least 13 volts but preferably 13.5 or even 14. I like to do this once in a while to verify if the dash voltage indicator is reading properly.

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My first inclination on both the charging issue and the air tank, knowing that it has been just a tad bit cold and snowy there, is ice. I'd check that the belt tensioners are moving freely, and would guess that the check valve that allows the front/secondary tank to fill might have just enough water frozen in it preventing it from opening.

 

Given how easy it is to pull an alternator off of most of these engines, one option would be to pull it off and have it bench tested. At least in the US, the major auto parts chains (e.g. Advance, AutoZone) will bench test an alternator for free.

 

What are you reading on the batteries with the engine off vs. running? If you've had a charger on them and the batteries aren't totally dead, you should have at least seen the voltage above 13 with 20 minutes of idle time, assuming you weren't running a bunch of stuff.

 

Never checked when running, but off its at 12.57 currently after not being started or charged since. I believe it was 12.7 after I shut it off.

 

 

 

Sounds like you are going to do some maintenance on the truck. If you are going to change the belts you are half way to get the alternator out. Why not take the alternator in to a shop and have it bench tested. My thought on this, is for some piece of mind. Now I know the condition of the alternator. Then put your new belts on. Sorry about no help about the air problem.

 

Just my 2 cents,

Al

 

I have the belts on order and should be here next week. I will take the alternator off and get it tested. Also going to hook a few extra ground wires up, one on the alt to frame and one cab to frame just to be sure.

For a quick check of the alternator output you dont need to disconnect it. Measure the voltage of the batteries with engine not running using a multimeter. Then start the engine and measure the voltage at the batteries again...you should be seeing at least 13 volts but preferably 13.5 or even 14. I like to do this once in a while to verify if the dash voltage indicator is reading properly.

I will give that a try soon as I get another warmer day. Don't want to start her below freezing, Oil pan is still sitting in snow, (can't see under the truck)

 

Thanks!!

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We have nearby, a heavy equipment electrical service center in Bend Oregon with a very large rebuild shop that is able to test huge alternators at full speed and full loads.

Huston Walters has over 50 years of heavy duty electrical and rebuild experience and he ALLWAYS tests the alternator pulley for wear because history has proven that heavy alternators WILL wear out the pulleys over time and then new belts simply become worn out to fit the out of spec pulley in no time.

Huston proves the point by running up my alternator on the test stand and then pulling off my pulley and installing a new pulley and guess what he almost always gets at least 20 percent increase in peak power. Huston stocks about 1000 pulleys and it is the only way to restore full power to a worn used heavy alternator. Huston says that if the belts scream your pulley is trashed and the louder they scream the faster they wear.

Huston has a impact wrench plumbed into his test benches to install new pulleys as part of each alternator tested.....when you see the actual increase in power by simply replacing the worn pulley it is amazing ..... (It's a real cheap upgrade). Heavy truck engines operate in a low RPM range so the alternators highly tax the pulley capacity so out of spec pulleys degrade alternator power output fast. Some folks tension the belts very tight and all that does is overload the alternator bearings and......make the pulley and belts wear out faster.....

Something to consider....

Happy travels,

Dollytrolley

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  • 3 weeks later...

Well, Took my alternator into a rebuilding shop and he said it was too far gone. He said he could put $200 of parts in it and it may last 3 months before more would need to be replaced. He ended up getting me a new one in for $330. Happy with that price as I was quoted upwards of $800 at another shop.

 

Got new belts ordered in and ended up just cleaning my old ones up, they look pretty good. Going to keep the new belts as a backup vs trying to swap them out now.

 

Truck is staying steady at 13.7 volts now.

 

Still having issues with my tanks, the wet tank is bone dry and the other two tanks are full. When I do the release on the wet tank, nothing comes out, the valve pushes in freely. I never tried any antifreeze yet into it though,

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Hello. I have a 2005 780, my belts were squealing. I have a Cummins isx 500 hp. I changed the tensioners both Alt/water pump and Ac and the idler. The belts I got from Tracton and transaxle. - Hamilton Ont. The tensioners and idler from the Kenworth dealer because they were hundreds cheaper then Volvo. $524 for the tensioners. No squealing.

 

As to your air issue its pretty easy to disconnect the air supply to the tanks, well kinda easy, I'm wondering if the line is blocked by possibly rust from inside the tanks. Maybe if you blow air backwards it might clear. There is a truck wrecker in Kingston Ont called Morgan's they have several Volvos I got a steering wheel for $100 plus HST.

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Thanks! The new alternator took some of the noise away but will look at the tensioners more.. The one on the alt was "repaired" about 1-2 years ago.. He said he put a new bearing in it at a shop but its still pretty rough looking.

 

 

when I pull the hose of the front wet tank at the front, there is no air in the hose.. there is air in the "rear" of the wet tank (split chamber) and there is air in the other two tanks. I will crawl under her today to see where that 3/8" line goes and see if anything visible is wrong. The tanks were all replaced about two years ago but its possible there is something clogged or a blocked air filter.

 

Thanks

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I just am in the works of changing both tensioners and an idler pulley. All the bearing where running lose and noisy. If you look at the tensioner at the swivel point, the gap should be parallel, if they are not then the tensioner is worn so replace the whole tensioner and not just the pulley.

 

If you have a bad tensioner it can throw the belt with the possibility of the fan ingesting it and taking out the radiator. Thought the pulleys where cheap insurance.

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The front part of the wet tank is a "ping" tank for dryer. Provides a "blast" for regen. On mine I have an automatic purge on the "rear" of the tank.

Baffled the s&*&$%t out of me when chasing air leaks until I noticed the weld line. It is not well documented.

That's what I was thinking. I crawled under her the other day and tested all the plungers, drained my tanks until the compressor fired up, checked airlines, got air pressure at the front wet tank then she filled up partway and then drained back off, but the back and other two tanks were still full.. redid the test to confirm lol

 

I just am in the works of changing both tensioners and an idler pulley. All the bearing where running lose and noisy. If you look at the tensioner at the swivel point, the gap should be parallel, if they are not then the tensioner is worn so replace the whole tensioner and not just the pulley.

 

If you have a bad tensioner it can throw the belt with the possibility of the fan ingesting it and taking out the radiator. Thought the pulleys where cheap insurance.

Thanks! I will recheck mine for parallel. It sounds a lot better now, but sometimes still hear a bit of a noise.

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