SuiteSuccess

So sorry to hear this.  Glad everyone is ok.  Prayers are with you.

14 hours ago, NeverEasy said:

I did not think yours would have melted the plastic due to the low current you electric/hydraulic system pulls.

Don't use any petroleum-based oil or grease.  Silicone grease only on that "O" ring.

 

Yep.  All I ever use.

Ok got my switch changed out.  Turns out the 0 ring on the plunger was hard and had glued itself to the housing.  Took a lot of effort to get the plunger to pull out but it was in good shape and not melted.  Would probably be a good idea to periodically lubricate the O ring to keep it supple.  I’m not so sure that it would not have broken the cable from the plunger if suddenly jerked.

My Progressive through Miller insurance.

Interesting Jim.  I just changed to Progressive from National General through Miller Insurance.  My contact was Roxanne Sutton.  I specifically asked her about bob tail coverage and was told there were no restrictions.  They did have to cover the trailer also but it is a separate policy.  Wonder why a difference?  I did also speak with Grace Street at Lazy Days in Florida (same company Rick is using) and she was quoting me a Progressive policy but it was the same rate and coverage Miller quoted so I stayed where I had been for the past 14 years.

9 hours ago, NeverEasy said:

1. Slip a pared down popsicle stick between the contacts to let them cool for awhile, then quickly change with the plastic plunger. OR 2. Put an on/off switch on the 12 volt wire. (Not ideal but should work).  

Carl,

I agree that you should open the old breakaway and see if the plastic plug is melted.  Just consider this:  The original electric magnetic brakes used about 12.6 AMPS via the house battery(ies) to engage the brakes.  Read that, 4 brake magnets each have a resistance of 3.4 ohms.  Those in parallel work out to close enough to 1 ohm. 4/4 =1  Therefore, the AMPs required to engage those brakes are just about equal to the battery voltage  I=E/R or 12.6/1 - 12.6.

Ok, that's enough to generate heat if the contacts in the breakaway do not create a dead short across the contacts. On a system using electric brake magnets, it would be good to put some contact cleaner on your popsicle stick and push it in and out a few times.

Now, consider your system on Electric/Hydraulic.  The controller for that system only requires enough current to operate itself.  I have that system on my rig.  My testing shows no more than .8 amps (yes, 8/10s of an amp) when the brakes are fully activated.  .8 amps is not enough heat to melt that plastic.   An annual cleaning of the breakaway contacts still would not hurt.

 

Thanks Chet.  Always a teaching/learning experience with you. I so much appreciate it.

Happy Birthday 🎁 

1 hour ago, Jim & Wilma said:

@SuiteSuccessCarl, I had a similar issue years ago. I would often test the switch and measure the current, sometimes taking a few minutes in the process. One of the times I just couldn’t pull the plunger out. Got me curious why it stuck.
 

So I did a forensic exam of the switch. I found the plastic plunger, that separates the spring loaded contacts, had melted into the contacts. My conclusion was the contacts had previously made poor contact and became rather hot, probably glowing. When the plunger was reinserted to separate the contacts, the contacts also melted into the plastic plunger.

After that experience,I paid a bit more attention to switch current handling capacity, though that data can be a challenge to find.  It was one more reason I changed to electric over hydraulic  

 

I am electric over hydraulic.  Interesting finding on your forensics. Makes sense though.  I’ve ordered a new switch and when installed will tear apart the old to see if what you describe might be a reoccurring issue.  If so two solutions come to mind.  1. Slip a pared down popsicle stick between the contacts to let them cool for awhile, then quickly change with the plastic plunger. OR 2. Put an on/off switch on the 12 volt wire. (Not ideal but should work).

10 hours ago, NeverEasy said:

Yep, concur with Jim.

Clamp on a DC clamp on meter on only one of the two black wires at the breakaway switch.  Like Jim said, 3 amps per wheel if you are electric brakes.  From my experience, you only get .8 amps if you are running an electronic over hydraulic setup.  

 

Chet,

Reason for replacement is the “plug” connected to the lanyard has become fused to the body of the switch so I can’t pull on the lanyard and remove it.  Going to probably have to put vice grips on it to get it out.  Want to have a new one available cause I’m sure it’s probably going to break.  If so couldn’t I just cut and connect the two wires to complete the circuit, reconnect the battery and test with the clamp on meter?

54 minutes ago, Jim & Wilma said:

Functionally they’re all the same; contact closes when pin is pulled out.  If you’ve got hydraulic brakes, it’s pretty low current and any switch should work fine. If electric/magnetic brakes, each wheel is 3 amps and I’d try to check and make sure it’s rated for the amp load.  
 

In either case, it’s a good practice to routinely pull the pin to make sure it works. For electric brakes, a clamp on amp meter will tell you if all the magnets are working; total current = 3 amps times # of wheels. 

Thanks Jim.

I have a 2017 DRV trailer that has a two wire emergency breakaway switch for the brakes.  It’s the one that has the lanyard that activates the brakes if the trailer becomes disconnected from the hitch.  The present factory one is ESCO and I’m wondering if a generic, Curt, or Hobbs replacement should work (I can get those locally)?  

Good reminder, Rick.  It’s okay to build outside the box but the further we stray from compliance the more we place ourselves on the radar for regulation.  Sooner or later it will bite us on the backside. 

New myth to discuss. Wheel bearings on a trailer need to be repacked every other year.

On 3/7/2024 at 8:26 PM, Av8r3400 said:

I am with Auto Owners insurance.  For my home, cars, RV and the Big Truck.

When our truck was hit by lightning (2022), they not only paid for the HDT tow to a Volvo dealer 30 miles away, but also paid for the repairs to the truck totaling almost $70,000.  They not only renewed me (twice), with only a small market increase in the premium since then, but did not require me to change the $100 deductible.

As a side note, in the fall of 2022 my wife hit a deer with her car adding another $7500 claim to our policy that year and they still didn't cancel us.

 

Good to know.

9 hours ago, rickeieio said:

I would hope a $565 claim would not trigger a non-renewal after 15 years of paying premiums, but we'll see.

Rick,

Allstate cancelled a homeowner’s policy we had in Texas for a broken window claim.  We had been with them 20 years with only one other claim 5 years prior for hail damage on roof.

8 hours ago, RickW said:

Rick/Carl,

I have progressive with their road side assistance and twice they covered the tow on the Volvo with trailer, no questions asked.  I even clarified when calling what I needed to be towed.  The only problem with Progressive was this past September had to have the Entegra towed.  The tow company would not send a truck until they secured payment from Progressive.  In reality Progressive was subbing out the ERS with 3rd party vendor and the vendor kept dragging their feet.  After waiting 4 hours on the side of the interstate in 110* temperatures, it took Alicia giving Progressive some hell for them to finally light a fire under their vendor to get the job done.

Thanks for the info Rick.

7 hours ago, Danfreda1 said:

Just talked to our agent in South Dakota the other day, need a new windshield. I asked about some non renewal that I’ve heard of and she said nationwide insurance is cutting back or not taking new policies on converted trucks. They are keeping current policy holders and she hasn’t heard of any non renewal to customers that were not claims related. Truck and trailer went up about 400 combined. I know this is off the topic but just wanted to share the info. 

I switched because my agent since we bought the truck said National General (our previous insurance) was probably pulling out of Tennessee for conversion coverage.

9 hours ago, rickeieio said:

Don't know about roadside assistance policies, but I can tell you that my agent for nearly everything insurance told me that in 2020-2021 he had a LOT of folks come to him, trying to schoolie insurance, and could not.

The problems with insurance are wide and deep.  My Progressive policy covers towing, and I'll see if they reimburse me for a recent tow when we get back from this trip.

Rick,

Let me know because I’m now with Progressive.  I also have the tow insurance.  Be careful, my agent said it is filed as a claim against the insurance and may result in them considering non-renewal.

1 hour ago, Dutch_12078 said:

Using Prevost to make your point hasn't been valid for a number of years now. Prevost currently makes units specifically for the RV conversion market.

https://prevostmotorhomes.com/

Yes and Kenworth and Volvo have speced a truck for folks we know specifically to pull a fifth wheel and be registered in their respective states for that purpose. So should they not be covered because Kenworth and  Volvo mainly build commercial vehicles?  Jack Mayer and RVH are ordering trucks and purpose building to not be used commercially.  So I think the point I was making still has validity.  Plus, I still would bet Prevost primary market is still for commercial use. In fact they sold shy of 400 commercial buses to New York State in 2023 with an option for more. https://prevostcar.com/. BTW you do know Prevost is owned by Volvo Truck Group?

46 minutes ago, jenandjon said:

I learned a few things about roadside assistance recently. A friend of mine works for AAA as a recruiter. Any roadside assistance company is as good as the people they have in the area. For example, if I call AAA in the town where I live it better be between 9 am and 5 pm because I live in a dead zone. They cannot get someone in my area to do 24/7 service. If I have a flat 5 miles from my house at 9 pm my AAA is completely worthless. If I'm in Omaha at 9pm I get great service. 

So just because you called Good Sam and got crap service doesn't mean they are garbage. It just means the people they have in the area are bad. 

I am in no way advocating for any roadside assistance company. I only have AAA because he got it for me for free. If I have a flat tire, I will change it myself. 

My problem was and is with their “business model”.  Even McDonalds teaches their employees to make the burgers the same way every time.  Good Sam did not teach every employee the same answer to a basic question….am I covered?  Having read a previous thread on this forum, I consistently called a representative (supposedly recorded response) and described my rig and what I was using it for BEFORE renewing.  It was only recently that I was informed I was not covered because of the conversion of a commercial vehicle.  I took it up the chain to a supervisor and then the head office rep only to find the “policy” had apparently changed four years previously.  Why had the previous three reps not been informed of a company wide policy change?  Why had the customers not been informed of a coverage change?  Answer from higher up…it was my responsibility to find it, they had no obligations to inform.  So I looked…their brochure indeed said no coverage for a commercial vehicle…I’m not commercial…registered as a Motorhome.  DOT recognizes the difference.  Called back to head office.  Asked if they covered Prevost, MCI bus/motorhomes?  Answer…yes.  Well primary business of both is commercial bus production for passenger hauling.  Met with crickets on the end of the line.  Facts always lead to the truth and I choose not to deal with any business that I believe is less than truthful.  BTW they would NOT refund my previous four year’s premiums for the time their policy was not going to provide coverage.

12 hours ago, spindrift said:

Corvairs were prone to rolling over.

Aw, those were the days.  No power, no torque.  My “Fred Flintstone” mobile.

On 1/22/2024 at 8:35 AM, Deezl Smoke said:

Then, look into a roadside service program. Some can use AAA, some Sam's club, and many, like me, use Coachnet.

I see you’re singling so the roadside assistance packages should cover you but check and get it in writing.  The three listed will not cover you if you are tandem.  Do not believe their representative on the phone without verifying because half of them don’t know what they do and don’t cover.  I went to the top of the chain with Good Sam before finding out my tandem hadn’t been covered for four years.  Luckily I didn’t have to use it, but I didn’t get my premiums back either.  BTW most people think these are insurance.  They are service contracts not insurance and function under different regulations.

11 minutes ago, NeverEasy said:

Here is an interesting post of how to connect batteries in a four-battery configuration.  For an equal charging hook the positive to the center left battery and the negative to the center right battery.  I would assume then that the load on the batteries should be hooked up in a similar fashion.  He shows examples of the other ways to hook up batteries.  

How to Configure a Battery Bank – Windy Nation Inc

Chet,

That is EXACTLY the explanation I was looking for.  Thank you.  It just seemed logical to even my grade school electronics brain that resistance was the culprit in the whole setup.  Minimize resistance whenever possible.

57 minutes ago, NeverEasy said:

Carl, I have seen where the recommendation is to hook both + and - connections to the center most point of the batteries.  However, I don't see the need if the batteries have a good connection to the bus.

Question, what size inverter (watts) will you install.  For a true calculation of current, add 10% to that for the internal workings of the inverter (overhead).  Use that to calculate the amps with the formula Current equals watts divided by voltage.  I = P/V.   I have found that most installations max out the size of the inverter due to cable size needed to support anything bigger than 1500 watts..  I = 1515/12 volts = 126.26 amps.   

The length of the cable run is very important.  Mount the inverter as close to the battery source as you can.  You must calculate the length using both the positive cable length + the negative cable length.  Measure in meters to use the following chart.

This is a good site to calculate cable size needed:  DC Cable Size Calculator | Fabhabs.  

As an example of using anything bigger than a 1500 watt inverter, let's say you are going to install a 2400 watt inverter.  The max current is 202 amps.  Put that in the above chart with a 1 meter cable length and the chart will show you that there is no cable big enough to support that installation.

At one of the Kansas HDT rallies, I was asked to look at a 2400 Watt inverter install.  I found that the installr used a 4-AWG 2 meters (4 meters total) away from the batteries.  To protect the cables, a 40 amp fuse was put inline thereby effectively limiting the output of the inverter to (P=I x V) or 40 x 12 = 480 watts.  The size of the inverter than became a 480 watt inverter.  Shit!

 

 

 

Chet, 

I have a Xantrex Freedom 1800 HF which I installed years ago with 3/0 cable and short runs.  I connected to battery 4 positive and battery 1 negative but really had no good facts to support that configuration. I’m putting four new batteries in (one battery died [tested] all four only 22 mos old) and was questioning whether my connection configuration might have been a culprit. BTW that battery was #4 and had little electrolyte while all others had plenty of fluid. Also I’m fused properly. (You helped me choose the size years ago.)

1 hour ago, Randyretired said:

Connect to opposite ends.  + on one battery and the - on the far battery.  Be sure to wire and fuse properly.  Short of buss bars this will be best for balancing the batteries.

So you’re saying the latter option.  Positive on battery 1 and negative on battery 4 or vice versa. That makes the most sense for balanced charging and the way I’ve always done it but really couldn’t explain the REASON I do it that way.