Converting to Dish - Guidance Please

Jim Gell · July 27, 2019

We suspended our DirecTV account while we went to Alaska for the summer of 2017. After we came back to lower 48 we didn't feel the need for it and closed the account. Now we want satellite TV again. There seem to be quite a few permutations of how to go about that. I have been skimming through threads on here and other sites and have a rough plan.

Would you look at this outline of my plan and tell me if you see ways I could or should tweak it?

1) Buy a Winegard RP-SK21 Reflector Bracket and LNB Assembly for SK-1000 TRAV'LER Dish 1000 and a Winegard RPSK11 Reflector to convert my DirecTV Traveler to receive Dish. I plan to do this by myself. Other than falling off my roof, any technical reason this would be an issue?

2) Buy or lease a Hopper 3 DVR and 4K Joey. I would prefer to lease, but want to be able to save $ by suspending service when we don't need it. Do we need to own it to suspend service? How do the costs compare for leasing vs buying and for month to month vs annual contract?

3) Install the Hopper 3 in our bedroom near our Traveler controller and the cable(s) from the Traveler. Our living room entertainment center is in a slide that would be difficult to re-route cables to.

4) Install the 4K Joey in the living room with wireless connection to the Hopper 3 in bedroom (about 30 feet away). I assume we will be able to control the Hopper 3 in bedroom from the living room through the Joey. Does that sound right?

5) Call someone and sign up for service. Is https://www.dishformyrv.com/ my best choice? Are there any discounts through affiliations such as Escapees, FMCA, AARP etc?

Any thoughts greatly appreciated! Thank you in advance!

Jim

remoandiris · July 27, 2019

You may be better off going to a local Dish retailer with these questions. Your install is not much different than a S&B, except with the Travel'r.

A retailer should also be able to give you the current prices of leasing with a contract vs. buying the equipment outright and then paying for service.

Answers may also differ between full timers and part timers.

Second Chance · July 27, 2019

Dish network has two satellite groupings (eastern and western arcs). HD local channels are on different arcs depending on where you are in the country. I believe the Trav'ler is a single-arc antenna - the LNBs may be able to be switched out between east and west, but I'm not sure. Here's a good article on the topic:

Article

Rob

Jim & Wilma · July 28, 2019

Jim, you'll also need a Dish DPH-42 and associated power inserter for the standard LNBs to work with the Hopper 3. See Tom Hughes' (Zulu on the forum) diagram for connection details.

Dutch_12078 · July 28, 2019

2 hours ago, Second Chance said:

Dish network has two satellite groupings (eastern and western arcs). HD local channels are on different arcs depending on where you are in the country. I believe the Trav'ler is a single-arc antenna - the LNBs may be able to be switched out between east and west, but I'm not sure. Here's a good article on the topic:

Article

Rob

While it's physically possible to swap the standard western arc LNB for an eastern arc LNB, the Trav'ler's controller doesn't know how to align with those satellites. With the western arc LNB, it is possible to manually access one of the eastern arc sats though. I think it's the 72.7 sat, but I'm not sure.

Zulu · July 28, 2019

7 hours ago, Jim Gell said:

1) Buy a Winegard RP-SK21 Reflector Bracket and LNB Assembly for SK-1000 TRAV'LER Dish 1000 and a Winegard RPSK11 Reflector to convert my DirecTV Traveler to receive Dish. I plan to do this by myself. Other than falling off my roof, any technical reason this would be an issue?

I converted a DirecTV SWM Travler to the DISH version. Very doable. Mind the IDU/ODU software stuff.

7 hours ago, Jim Gell said:

2) Buy or lease a Hopper 3 DVR and 4K Joey. I would prefer to lease, but want to be able to save $ by suspending service when we don't need it. Do we need to own it to suspend service? How do the costs compare for leasing vs buying and for month to month vs annual contract?

Ask Dutch about this. I think he leases his Hopper 2.

7 hours ago, Jim Gell said:

3) Install the Hopper 3 in our bedroom near our Traveler controller and the cable(s) from the Traveler. Our living room entertainment center is in a slide that would be difficult to re-route cables to.

4) Install the 4K Joey in the living room with wireless connection to the Hopper 3 in bedroom (about 30 feet away). I assume we will be able to control the Hopper 3 in bedroom from the living room through the Joey. Does that sound right?

Though I think folks generally install the Hopper up front in the living room, it doesn't matter. A Joey can record/delete/play back programs just like the Hopper. I think the Hopper has more diagnostic stuff, but that's it. A Joey and Hopper each have their own, separate remotes.

7 hours ago, Jim Gell said:

5) Call someone and sign up for service. Is https://www.dishformyrv.com/ my best choice? Are there any discounts through affiliations such as Escapees, FMCA, AARP etc?

If you plan on suspending your service, I believe you have to purchase your Hopper. I trust these guys for DISH equipment: Dish Depot.

I wouldn't use any of those above (FMCA, etc) -- especially DishForMyRV because DISH's "party line" for RVs is "Wally Yes, Hopper No". However, as you know there are plenty of folks with Hoppers in their RVs (since 2012 for me).

Anyway, at first DISH insisted on installing Hoppers. If that's still the case, contact a local sat installer. You may have to look a bit since many installer dislike RVs. Too hairy. Since you sound tech savvy, you can essentially "do" most of the install before an installer arrives -- all the wiring.

However, since Hopper installation & activation has much improved since 2012, you may be able to install your Hopper 3 yourself. Here's the Hopper 3 Activation Process (may be a bit dated).

Here's a Hopper 3-to-DISH Travler wiring diagram:

dph42_winegard-travler_one_hopper3_one-o

Finally, about those DISH satellite "arcs" . . .

Western Arc (sats 110, 119, 129) -- what a DISH Travler uses. I've been able to just use my Travler for most of the time. However, there are times when I park under trees, too near Mount Rundle, etc that I need to drag out my portable tripod.

Eastern Arc (sats 61.5, 72. 77.7) -- I almost never have to drag out my tripod for these.

Long story short . . . a portable sat dish with a Western & Eastern arc LNBF is a good buy.

RonandSue · July 28, 2019

I believe you will need to contact a residential installer to be able to lease the equipment as dishformyrv is for pay as you go and does not support Hopper 3 equipment. Hopper 3 is not intended to be installed in a rv. That being said it is very doable. As to point 3 and 4, you do not have to install Hopper 3 in the bedroom. Mine is not. Mine has the DPH 42 switch install on the roof. Power inserter and solo hub and joey install behind bedroom tv where cable comes in from switch and travler. Hopper 3 is installed in living area. This install work great and have not had a problem with the install in a year and half. This install is in a fifth wheel.

Good Luck

Dutch_12078 · July 28, 2019

We own both of our Hopper 2's, but there is no difference in the monthly fees for the equipment service whether owned or leased. At the time we first signed on with Dish as part-time RV'ers, we wanted the pay-as-you-go month to month option which requires owned equipment. Since then we've gone full-time and never shut the service off. If we decide to upgrade, we'll likely accept the 2-year contract and let Dish supply the equipment.

Jim Gell · July 28, 2019

First off, thanks to everyone who jumped on this to help me. It is very appreciated. I also want to especially thank “Jan and Tom on the road” for making those fantastic diagrams, photos, and information available on their blog. It sounds like you all have provided good info to tweak my plans, but I ask if anyone else has thoughts to continue to share them.

Adjustments and embellishments to my plan with a few more questions:

A) I need to buy the DISH Pro Hybrid 42 Switch With Power Inserter (DPH42) to go with the
DISHProPlus LNB for the western arc satellites 119/110/129 and I may also want to buy a separate portable dish to get Eastern Arc signals as well as an A/B switch for selecting the one I am using,

If I understand the conversion chart linked above, and my Traveler is an SK SWM3 as I suspect because the DirectV power inserter says SWM 3 on it, I may not need need to check the IDU and ODU software versions. Right?

C) It sounds like it would not matter which room I put the Hopper 3 or the 4K Joey. We primarily use our living room TV, The Traveler controller needs to stay in bedroom. We can do occasional diagnostics in the bedroom. Is there any other advantages, such as being able see a display, that would make it better to have the Hopper in the living room?

D) It sounds like leasing may be a better choice. I will get real current costs to compare and consider how often we will want to suspend service. If they own it and it fails, I assume they would replace it without us being charged...Right?

E) I have not talked to any Dish retailers to see if they do RV's because whenever I Googled them they never seem to be close to where I am. Right now the closest is about 80 miles away. Would they need to come to me for an “install”? Will they run new cables across and through my roof to my bedroom entertainment cabinet? Even if they would, I don't think I trust an installer to do that. I want to replace cables for our OTA antenna and WiFi Ranger at the same time I drill a new hole in my roof.

F) Now lets talk about cables to the Traveler. As my Traveler is wired for DirecTV, I have ONE multi-conductor “control cable” going the Traveler Control Box and ONE , COAX that is connected to the receiver through a “SWM 3” labeled power inserter. Tom's Hopper 3 Diagram referenced above with a red colored heading, shows THREE cables to the Traveler for DISH. This raises questions. Do I just need to run some additional cables? If so how many, and what specs? Or is my Traveler different from the ones others have converted to Dish service and may not be convertible?

Thank you all again for your assistance!

Jim

Edited July 28, 2019 by Jim Gell

Zulu · July 28, 2019

4 hours ago, Jim Gell said:

If I understand the conversion chart linked above, and my Traveler is an SK SWM3 as I suspect because the DirectV power inserter says SWM 3 on it, I may not need need to check the IDU and ODU software versions. Right?

Sorry, not sure. Here's what I did. Contact Winegard Tech Support before you start.

4 hours ago, Jim Gell said:

C) It sounds like it would not matter which room I put the Hopper 3 or the 4K Joey. We primarily use our living room TV, The Traveler controller needs to stay in bedroom. We can do occasional diagnostics in the bedroom. Is there any other advantages, such as being able see a display, that would make it better to have the Hopper in the living room?

I can't think of any.

4 hours ago, Jim Gell said:

D) It sounds like leasing may be a better choice. I will get real current costs to compare and consider how often we will want to suspend service. If they own it and it fails, I assume they would replace it without us being charged...Right?

Technically, no, since your Hopper 3 would be in an RV, and from what DISH told me a while back, "They don't support Hoppers in RVs". From DISH's standpoint, they won't stop you from using a Hopper in our RV, but that's it.

That said, DISH did replace my 1st 2016 Hopper 3 as the hard disk went south. But at the time we (and our Hopper 3) were staying in our AZ park model. Buyer beware.

4 hours ago, Jim Gell said:

E) I have not talked to any Dish retailers to see if they do RV's because whenever I Googled them they never seem to be close to where I am. Right now the closest is about 80 miles away. Would they need to come to me for an “install”? Will they run new cables across and through my roof to my bedroom entertainment cabinet? Even if they would, I don't think I trust an installer to do that. I want to replace cables for our OTA antenna and WiFi Ranger at the same time I drill a new hole in my roof.

Right, you should run any needed cabling, not a home DISH installer.

Would an installer drive 80 miles? Only one way to find out.

4 hours ago, Jim Gell said:

F) Now lets talk about cables to the Traveler. As my Traveler is wired for DirecTV, I have ONE multi-conductor “control cable” going the Traveler Control Box and ONE , COAX that is connected to the receiver through a “SWM 3” labeled power inserter. Tom's Hopper 3 Diagram referenced above with a red colored heading, shows THREE cables to the Traveler for DISH. This raises questions. Do I just need to run some additional cables? If so how many, and what specs? Or is my Traveler different from the ones others have converted to Dish service and may not be convertible?

Even though the DPH42 can be installed outdoors, I would run all three because I want that DPH42 switch inside my RV and not constantly exposed to direct sunlight.

However, installing the DPH42 on the roof sure makes things easier as you now only have to run 1 coax cable inside. If you do install it on the roof, I'd suggest erecting some sort of sun shield over it . . . just don't put the DPH42 in a box.

Dutch_12078 · July 28, 2019

1 hour ago, Zulu said:

...

Even though the DPH42 can be installed outdoors, I would run all three because I want that DPH42 switch inside my RV and not constantly exposed to direct sunlight.

However, installing the DPH42 on the roof sure makes things easier as you now only have to run 1 coax cable inside. If you do install it on the roof, I'd suggest erecting some sort of sun shield over it . . . just don't put the DPH42 in a box.

Tom, are you aware of any DPH42 failures due to weather exposure? I know of several residential installations where the DPH42 was installed at the dish with no failures I'm aware of. The switch is packaged about the same as the Duo Node at our upstate NY cottage that's been exposed 24/7 for the past 6 years with no failures.

Zulu · July 29, 2019

1 hour ago, Dutch_12078 said:

Tom, are you aware of any DPH42 failures due to weather exposure?

Nope.

1 hour ago, Dutch_12078 said:

I know of several residential installations where the DPH42 was installed at the dish with no failures I'm aware of.

"At the dish" . . . so not on a roof constantly exposed to sunlight.

1 hour ago, Dutch_12078 said:

The switch is packaged about the same as the Duo Node at our upstate NY cottage that's been exposed 24/7 for the past 6 years with no failures.

A DPH42 is powered, Duo Nodes are not. My DPH42 is inside a fan-vented, open-back cabinet, yet the switch is hot to the touch.

I'm guessing that your unpowered Duo Node in not installed on your cottage roof where it would be constantly exposed to sunlight, right?

Maybe the sunlight in upstate NY is gentle, but in the South West where I spend my time it's brutal.

Finally, the DPH42 install manual warns:

Do not install the apparatus near any heat sources such as radiators, heat registers, stoves, or other apparatus (including amplifiers) that produce heat.

I'm including the sun as a heat source.

Dutch_12078 · July 29, 2019

56 minutes ago, Zulu said:

Nope.

"At the dish" . . . so not on a roof constantly exposed to sunlight.

A DPH42 is powered, Duo Nodes are not. My DPH42 is inside a fan-vented, open-back cabinet, yet the switch is hot to the touch.

I'm guessing that your unpowered Duo Node in not installed on your cottage roof where it would be constantly exposed to sunlight, right?

Maybe the sunlight in upstate NY is gentle, but in the South West where I spend my time it's brutal.

Finally, the DPH42 install manual warns:

Do not install the apparatus near any heat sources such as radiators, heat registers, stoves, or other apparatus (including amplifiers) that produce heat.

I'm including the sun as a heat source.

"At the dish" as in usually attached to the mast, and that may well be on the roof.

The Duo and Solo Nodes receive power from the receiver. My Duo Node is attached to the ground post that supports my dish. The Solo Node on my tripod mounted RV dish is attached to the LNB arm where it spends months exposed to the Florida sun each year. Whether or not a DPH42 is mounted topside or not makes no difference to me obviously, since I don't have a Trav'ler, but I'm not aware of any failures from roof mounting one. Possibly attaching it to the LNB arm would add some heat dissipation though.

GlennWest · July 29, 2019

I understand wanting Dish. Do you have a strong cell service where you go? We have streamed all our TV for a few months now. Actually prefer it. Cost lot less to. We have our Pathway 2 in our storage.