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Roadtrek 1

You should be very pleased that you purchased a Class B RV...

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This is not a pretty picture .... and a reminder that Class B's are designed with Federal Automotive Standards, air bags, electronic stability controls and are generally safer than many other larger vehicles without these features.   This picture is an example of how strong a Class B is....the head on crash resulted in the couple unharmed and walked away from the accident.   This video shows how much damage the front occupants in the Class A would sustain.... not good....

https://www.autoblog.com/2019/05/14/rv-motorhome-camper-crash-tests/

 

 

image%3A21522

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Here's the picture of the crashed Sprinter 3500 where the people walked away from the scene. 

I hope your RV has safety features;  it's very important.   

Old vehicles are "nostalgic",   but,  you can't fool around with your personal safety.   

Anti-lock brakes,  air bags and electronic stability control are among the most important features you can have on your vehicle.  

It's terrible that many RV manufacturers don't have these safety items because they're not required.  

Maybe they should be.  

Sprinter collision.jpg

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I've read on the forum here of a preference for a 5er over a Class A due to the truck being designed with Federal Automotive Standards.

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6 minutes ago, rm.w/aview said:

I've read on the forum here of a preference for a 5er over a Class A due to the truck being designed with Federal Automotive Standards.

YES,   I can certainly see that.   Although,  you have to be very careful towing anything. 

By the way,  sorry,  the video from Sweden is not in English, but,  you'll get the idea. 

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1 minute ago, Roadtrek 1 said:

YES,   I can certainly see that.   Although,  you have to be very careful towing anything. 

Gotta be careful with anything on the roadways. Heck, gotta be careful stepping off the curb. In the past the stress of life disappeared as I was focused on staying alive while riding my motorcycles.

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10 minutes ago, rm.w/aview said:

Gotta be careful with anything on the roadways. Heck, gotta be careful stepping off the curb. In the past the stress of life disappeared as I was focused on staying alive while riding my motorcycles.

Understood.   What I should have said was that when you "add" another vehicle to the mix as in towing, you need to be sure you have everything covered including coordinated braking,  proper weight distribution,  etc.   It completely changes the dynamics from a single vehicle and I'm sure that the Federal Safety Standards from the  Insurance Institute for Highway Safety would have an opinion about towing vs. just driving one vehicle. 

What I've heard about motorcycles ( I don't own one) is that after 5 years your number is up.  Be careful out there;   motorcycles are practically invisible to most car drivers,  if you know what I mean. 

https://www.iihs.org/

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If I were selecting an RV based on safety in a vehicle accident alone, it would be a super C.

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11 hours ago, Roadtrek 1 said:

Understood.   What I should have said was that when you "add" another vehicle to the mix as in towing, you need to be sure you have everything covered including coordinated braking,  proper weight distribution,  etc.   It completely changes the dynamics from a single vehicle and I'm sure that the Federal Safety Standards from the  Insurance Institute for Highway Safety would have an opinion about towing vs. just driving one vehicle. 

 

What I've heard about motorcycles ( I don't own one) is that after 5 years your number is up.  Be careful out there;   motorcycles are practically invisible to most car drivers,  if you know what I mean. 

 

https://www.iihs.org/

 

I haven't been riding motorcycles as long as some, only 46 years.  I must have over 9 lives because my number hasn't come up yet. 

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On 5/15/2019 at 5:59 AM, FL-JOE said:

I haven't been riding motorcycles as long as some, only 46 years.  I must have over 9 lives because my number hasn't come up yet. 

Great, and I hope luck continues to be in your favor. Statistically, it's all about exposure and depending on where and how you ride makes a difference. Traffic vs. open road for example. 

Someone commuting in bumper to bumper traffic and splitting lanes is at a much higher risk.   People on motorcycles are practically ghosts to car drivers....

And, I certainly don't have to point out that the lack of metal around you is a serious problem. 

Bicycles are similarly dangerous in car vs. bicycle crashes....the number of cycle incidents in many cities like LA..cars are causing a lot of fatalities.... it's physics. 

I'm not saying that you shouldn't do it, but, be careful, which you are obviously doing.... you can never be complacent when you are this much exposed.   I have to be very careful on my bicycle as well and it's only pedal power....

 

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There are numerous reasons why motorcycles are considered more dangerous.  Recent stats indicate that 13 cars out of every 100,000 are involved in fatal crashes, whereas 72 motorcycles out of every 100,000 are.  I personally believe that ratio will increase if something isn't done about distracted driver's and the use of cell phones while driving on a national level.

Motorcycle riders that develop safe defensive habits early on and stick with them will have a much better safety record.  I never stay in someone's blind spot.  I drive at appropriate speeds.  I don't mix alcohol and motorcycle riding.  

I suppose we could all stay in a sticknbrick, never go outside those walls, and if needed drive an armored car to doctor's appointments...…..or...….we can live life and not worry about it until the grim reaper comes calling.

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In the days well before cell phones, Dave's brother was riding his motorcycle on a highway with grade level crossings. A car pulled up to the stop sign at a crossing; the driver appeared to look right at him; then she pulled out in front of him causing him to hit the side of her car which threw him up over the hood. In spite of months in traction his one leg is several inches shorter than the other. She said she never saw him.

Reality is our eyes filter what we see to keep from being overwhelmed. She probably asked herself if there was any oncoming traffic--meaning trucks, cars or buses. Her brain probably filtered out motorcycles. That's why I was so happy to see the bumper sticker campaign start that reads, "Start SEEING motorcycles."

Linda

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9 hours ago, FL-JOE said:

Motorcycle riders that develop safe defensive habits early on and stick with them will have a much better safety record.  I never stay in someone's blind spot.  I drive at appropriate speeds.  I don't mix alcohol and motorcycle riding.

Unfortunately, far too few motorcycle riders do their part. If the motorcyclist can't see the mirrors of the car, that driver can't see him/her. And far too many of them do not wear appropriate safety gear. I still don't understand why it is that the federal highway laws can tell the drivers of steel cocoons (cars) that they must have air-bags and wear seat-belts, while the motorcyclists usually revolt at any state that requires them to wear only a helmet!  I have learned that the lack of a helmet is the first warning of a biker with an attitude. 

And then there is what motorcyclists like to call lane splitting!

Edited by Kirk W

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12 minutes ago, Kirk W said:

Unfortunately, far too few motorcycle riders do their part. If the motorcyclist can't see the mirrors of the car, that driver can't see him/her. And far too many of them do not wear appropriate safety gear. I still don't understand why it is that the federal highway laws can tell the drivers of steel cocoons (cars) that they must have air-bags and wear seat-belts, while the motorcyclists usually revolt at any state that requires them to wear only a helmet!  I have learned that the lack of a helmet is the first warning of a biker with an attitude. 

And then there is what motorcyclists like to call lane splitting!

SHOTS FIRED!

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7 minutes ago, Kirk W said:

Unfortunately, far too few motorcycle riders do their part. If the motorcyclist can't see the mirrors of the car, that driver can't see him/her. And far too many of them do not wear appropriate safety gear. I still don't understand why it is that the federal highway laws can tell the drivers of steel cocoons (cars) that they must have air-bags and wear seat-belts, while the motorcyclists usually revolt at any state that requires them to wear only a helmet!  I have learned that the lack of a helmet is the first warning of a biker with an attitude. 

And then there is what motorcyclists like to call lane splitting!

Let me first say that I wear a helmet about 90% of the time.  Has there been a time in Florida where I am running down to the gas station 1/2 miles away and I don't strap it on?  Certainly.  Have I rode to a buddy's house a mile away without it and wearing only shorts and a tee shirt, yep, I have.

I have three friends who have ridden motorcycles since being teenagers (45 years plus).  One is a retired diesel mechanic and two are retired LEOs.  One always wears his helmet (mechanic) and the other two only wear helmets when in a state that requires it.  

So these retired grandpas are on their motorcycles enjoying a ride and when you spot the two without a helmet you immediately think "okay, now there is two guys with an attitude"? 

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24 minutes ago, FL-JOE said:

So these retired grandpas are on their motorcycles enjoying a ride and when you spot the two without a helmet you immediately think "okay, now there is two guys with an attitude"? 

It is an alert that they probably do have one. Neither being a grandpa or a retired cop lessen that likelihood. 

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5 minutes ago, Kirk W said:

It is an alert that they probably do have one. Neither being a grandpa or a retired cop lessen that likelihood. 

Wow.  Here are two guys in their late 60's.  One of them did 2 tours as a Marine in VN and got shot twice for this country, came home and served his local community by being a police officer for 25 years.  He has a wonderful family and doesn't care where we are stopping for lunch because before we eat he is saying the prayer. 

The other one served just over 30 years in the inner city as a police officer and lost two of his buddies in the line of duty.  He would do anything for anyone at the drop of a hat.

These two are quality Americans that I am proud to call my friends.  

You are correct about one thing though.  All three of us have a certain attitude.  It has nothing to do with helmets or motorcycles.  It is an attitude that anyone who profiles another person based on what they wear, how they look, or what color skin they have, is a person not worth giving the time of day to.  

Kirk, you really need to reevaluate how you look at others.  

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Before I click Submit Reply I'll review & rethink what I've written and in many cases will delete it all and move on without a response, after all I'm under no obligation to respond at all. I'll also review & rethink a post before any action whatsoever, as is the case here. And on this one I can't leave Joe out there alone. I'll ride with or without a helmet depending on the day and the ride. Highway or inclement weather = helmet use, safety & comfort primarily because I have no windshield. I'll ride without a helmet when circumstances allow me to feel the breeze, and feel the freedom without the restriction, women with underwire bras may relate (though one gets used to a good fitting full face helmet). So there I am, killing bugs with my face & teeth while riding happily along with a Christmas morn smile. 

5 hours ago, FL-JOE said:

Kirk, you really need to reevaluate how you look at others.  

I agree.

 

edit: I've edited this post so as not to appear combative. To those that have read it, it may not have seemed so to you, and that's fine. But in retrospect, it appeared that way to me and I'm the one that I have to live with.

Edited by rm.w/aview

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When Dave's brother had his accident he was wearing a helmet. It was not comfortable lying on the pavement with it on so he asked a cop to remove it for him. The cop refused. So Tim lifted his head and threw his neck in such a way as to thow off the helmet. The cop's response? He was taught not to remove the helmet because sometimes it's the only thing holding the head and neck together. You might want to remember that when choosing to ride without a helmet.

Linda

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1 hour ago, sandsys said:

 He was taught not to remove the helmet because sometimes it's the only thing holding the head and neck together. You might want to remember that when choosing to ride without a helmet.

Linda

Believe me Linda, without my full face helmet I feel naked (and free, sort of like skinny dipping). My helmet, an Arai, has tabs for the first responders as it has been designed with this scenario in mind. The beanie, half helmets, and 3/4 helmets do not match the protection given by the full face helmet, but folks choose them based on their parameters. I'm reminded of a photo of a crash survivor that was wearing the half helmet that is typically used to meet minimum standards along with the beanie. The look on his face read "What do I do now?" as he no longer had the lower jaw. And it is with this knowledge that when the desire to ride and feel the wind & freedom arises, I'll ride with a more than usual expectation of a situation to present itself. Typically I ride in this way, with an expectation of the situation, so that I'm more prepared when it does, and more relaxed when it doesn't. Oddly, it becomes second nature. I started riding legally in '77 and when I started driving OTR, as well as the standard truck/car, driving with the expectation of a circumstance to occur is the way of life and is something that I've shared with the young-uns when we had those discussions. Many people have rider casualty stories, both riders and non, and I have some too. Some stop riding, some never start, and some never stop. Count me in the latter. 

 

Edited by rm.w/aview

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18 hours ago, sandsys said:

When Dave's brother had his accident he was wearing a helmet. It was not comfortable lying on the pavement with it on so he asked a cop to remove it for him. The cop refused. So Tim lifted his head and threw his neck in such a way as to thow off the helmet. The cop's response? He was taught not to remove the helmet because sometimes it's the only thing holding the head and neck together. You might want to remember that when choosing to ride without a helmet.

Linda

As a young local police officer first starting out you never forget your first fatal traffic crash.  Mine was a rather simple intersection crash involving a crotch rocket ridden by a college kid vs a car.  The car ran a red light and the motorcycle struck him in the rear quarter panel.  The kid was wearing leathers and a full face helmet.  It threw him over the trunk of the car.  I was only a few blocks away and when I arrived a minute or so later the kid was standing there looking at his crunched motorcycle.

I talked to him briefly to ensure he was okay.  He said he felt fine.  I had to ask him twice to sit on the curb and relax because I had rescue on the way to check him over.  I went about securing the scene because we were in a busy intersection.  Just as the rescue pulled up the kid toppled over.  He had suffered some type of internal injury and died right there.  Had nothing to do with a head injury.

I'm not saying he shouldn't have been wearing a helmet.  What I am saying is a helmet certainly did not save his life.  

Over the years I would handle numerous other fatal motorcycle crashes.  Many of those crashes the victim died as the result of injuries not related to the head.  

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Well, that last post sparked sadness.  They (usually motorcyclists) say that the difference between wearing a helmet or not is whether or not the funeral is open casket or closed.

 

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I don't think anyone could argue that wearing a helmet increases your chances of surviving a serious motorcycle crash.  Just like traveling in a small Class B with all the safety features vs a larger rig would no doubt increase your chances.

Experienced motorcycle riders consider other safety factors also when reaching for that helmet or when leaving it at home.  A full face, and even some 3/4 helmets can restrict your hearing and your side vision.  I think you can compensate for this but it could still be a factor to consider.  

No matter if a rider is wearing a helmet or not, I hope Kirk is the exception to the rule and folks don't consider riders they see on the road without helmets as having a "bad attitude".   Sure there are some bad apples out there just like with anything.  However, for the most part they are just regular folks, many of which are fathers/mothers, grandpas, and even grandmas.  Some people might golf or have other activities for recreation, most bikers I know just want to ride and that is our R&R. 

It is sad that we have a part time moderator on this forum that profiles a certain class of folks in a negative manner.

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So, golfers need helmets ? I’m with Kirk, and not even a part time moderator, or agitator. Who pays for the injuries caused by their ________?

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4 hours ago, dewilso said:

Who pays for the injuries caused by their ________?

The same people who pay for all those who overeat, drink alcohol, smoke, chew tobacco, don't exercise, and all other behaviors which lead to poor health and require medical attention.  We all have our bad behaviors.

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