8d battery thoughts

[Wrknrvr]

  I was looking at batteries this am and found this make.

https://www.oreillyauto.com/detail/b/fleet---heavy-duty-5000/powersport-25066/deep-cycle---marine-batteries-17354/f696dedb9b3f/super-start-fleet-heavy-duty-group-size-8d-t904-battery/agm8dt904/4742646/1972/chevrolet/c20-pickup-rwd?pos=7

 

. Just wondering if anyone has experience with this make. They are from Australia, but are sold at O'rielys auto parts. If you look at O'rielys auto parts web site they have different 8d batteries available.

 

 Just saying,.   Vern

[Smitty77_7]

No experience. And suppose you know the naming of the battery is a bit contradictory:)! Usually Marine Batteries, are not true Deep Cycle Batteries. 

For light duty, casual house support, would probably do OK. But for traditional boon docking like usage, Deep Cycle are the way to go... 

Best of luck to you, and if you are a light house battery user, and get this unit - please let us know how it goes for you:)!

Smitty

[Wrknrvr]

  I do not need batteries at this time. I just stumbled into it and thought I would pass the info along.

 They do have a wide range of batteries. 

 

 Just a thought,   Vern

 

 

[Pat & Pete]

We've had a Super Start since this past September . No problems . 

We are usually hooked up and do little boon docking . 

The battery I replaced was a CAT brand AGM . That battery lasted about 12 years . I couldn't find a reasonably close source and bought the SS .

I don't expect the SS to last near that long , but , we'll see . 

[oldjohnt]

First, 8D is simply the frame size. Next its rated 12 volts at 245 Amp Hours, which as near the same you get with two Trojan True Deep Cycle T-105's in series (225 AH). The page you linked states they are available in starting and deep cycle not sure which is which, but they are AGM. I recommend you get the True Deep Cycle unit versus the Starting Battery for RV boondocking use. Specs don't look bad so I would check their price versus say Trojan or Lifeline or FullRiver or Renogy in an AGM true deep cycle then make an informed decision....

 I recently bought some Renogy 12 volt 208 Amp Hour 129 pound 4D Frame True Deep Cycle AGM's for $245 delivered to Walmart and loaded in my car.

 John T

   

[jcussen]

Ran 4 of them for 4 years,  still loaded tested them at 95%  when I sold them. Bought for $400 each at O'reilly's, [on sale], [worked good for deep cycle use. [only brought them down to 60% SOC only]

[CrazyCooter]

To my knowledge, that battery is built by East Penn. Ran them in our last RV. Lasted about 5 years 90% boondocking and never dipping below 65% soc.

I also run the smaller versions in my pickup and Jeep.

[Tom_M]

On 2/17/2019 at 11:58 AM, oldjohnt said:

I recently bought some Renogy 12 volt 208 Amp Hour 129 pound 4D Frame True Deep Cycle AGM's for $245 delivered to Walmart and loaded in my car.

 John T

   

Price has gone to $339.99.

https://www.walmart.com/ip/Renogy-Deep-Cycle-AGM-Battery-12-Volt-200Ah/900928791

[oldjohnt]

3 minutes ago, Tom_M said:

Price has gone to $339.99.

Tom, when I bought mine for $245 free delivery in my car at Walmart, they were $399 on the Renogy Website and a week later Walmart listed them as not available ...........I got a bargain yayyyyyyyyyyyyyy

John T

[Tom_M]

Price is now $399.99.

[Chad Heiser]

I'm not familiar with that particular battery make, but I run 8D sized batteries in my 5th wheel.  8D batteries will not fit in many RV's without some significant modifications due to their sheer size.  My batteries also weigh 170 lbs a piece (a bit heavier than the ones linked above) and I have four of them.  That is a significant amount of weight to add to most RV's.  I had to take up basement storage space to accommodate my batteries.  I also had factory modifications made to the basement flooring of my 5er during the order process to deal with the added dead weight.  The only reason I chose them was because I was able to purchase them at a significantly reduced price due to a one off deal I happened upon.  If it hadn't been for the great price I got, I probably would have stayed away from an 8D sized battery because of the other difficulties they present due to their size and weight.  I still would have probably ended up with about the same amount of weight invested in batteries, but the weight would have been broken up into smaller footprint batteries to make them easier to manage.

[oldjohnt]

20 hours ago, Tom_M said:

Price is now $399.99.

Indeed, it was ONLY A FEW WEEKS AFTER I bought mine from Walmart for $247  THE PRICE SUDDENLY AND DRASTICALLY INCREASED lol   Lucky meeeeeeeeeeeee

John T

[Smitty77_7]

John T - That's a Blue Light Special for sure (Oh wait, that was the other 'mart', as in K-Mart:)!). Good score on those:)!

Smitty

[Ray,IN]

JohnT, I didn't think amperes were additive when using 6V batteries to create a 12V battery bank.

[Lou Schneider]

3 hours ago, Ray,IN said:

JohnT, I didn't think amperes were additive when using 6V batteries to create a 12V battery bank.

Batteries in series add voltage, the total amp-hours stay the same as a single battery.

Batteries in parallel maintain the same voltage while the amp-hours add.

Two Trojan T-105 6 volt, 225 amp- hour batteries in series are about the same size and weight as a 12 volt 245 amp-hour 8D sized battery.  They just split the battery weight into two pieces for easier handling.

[Kirk W]

5 hours ago, Lou Schneider said:

Batteries in series add voltage, the total amp-hours stay the same as a single battery.

Batteries in parallel maintain the same voltage while the amp-hours add.

This assumes that the batteries in the system are all the same type, size, and condition. If you mix batteries that are not the same the math gets more complex. 

[oldjohnt]

7 hours ago, Kirk W said:

This assumes that the batteries in the system are all the same type, size, and condition.

Of course if multiple batteries are connected together its best for charge and load balance if allllllllllll are same type and design and even brand and age, HOWEVER it remains true as I posted "Batteries in series add voltage"

While correcting a post believing two batteries in SERIES yielded double the Amp Hours, I responded "Batteries in PARALLEL maintain the same voltage, while the amp-hours add"  THAT RESPONSE CONCERNED A QUESTION REGARDING TWO I ASSUMED IDENTICAL  BATTERIES. IE voltage of the two in parallel stays the same but AH does double.  

Its true batteries in series add voltage and that's true REGARDLESS if they are the same voltage or not !! A 6 in series with a 12 yields 18 volts,,,,,,,,,a 6 in series with a 6 yields 12 volts

Fun chat yall, hope this helps

 

13 hours ago, Lou Schneider said:

Two Trojan T-105 6 volt, 225 amp- hour batteries in series are about the same size and weight as a 12 volt 245 amp-hour 8D sized battery.  They just split the battery weight into two pieces for easier handling.

Right on Lou, its mostly about lead and acid and plates (basically weight) and surface area etc and you can put more lead n acid n plates in a bigger case.

John T

[oldjohnt]

17 hours ago, Ray,IN said:

JohnT, I didn't think amperes were additive when using 6V batteries to create a 12V battery bank

Neighbor Ray, that's correct, if you put two 6 volt batteries in series do get a 12 volt bank AMPS ARE NOT ADDITIVE  yayyyy lol

John T

[NDBirdman]

30 minutes ago, oldjohnt said:

 if you put two 6 volt batteries in series do get a 12 volt bank AMPS ARE NOT ADDITIVE

I do get this now, 6v (100 amp) + 6v (100 amp)=12v (100 amp) in series; 12v (100 amp) + 12v (100 amp) = 12v (200 amp) parallel, easy peasy.  This does make me wonder, since the amps are not added on 6vs, why do I keep hearing it is best to have 6volts if you have the room over a 12 volt?

[oldjohnt]

1 hour ago, NDBirdman said:

This does make me wonder, since the amps are not added on 6vs, why do I keep hearing it is best to have 6volts if you have the room over a 12 volt?

That's so because OFTEN (not always depends on batteries) a big heavy duty full deep cycle 6 volt such as a Trojan T-105 which has 225 Amp Hours still (with two in series for 12 volts) yields MORE amp hours then a cheaper dual purpose 12 Volt RV/Marine Battery like sold at Walmart which may be less then 100 Amp Hours at 12 volts.   But they do make a single 12 volt which has around 200 AH BUT THATS A HUGE FRAME LIKE 4D and 129 pounds.  They also make a smaller frame (like Group 31 or similar in size, 60 to 70 pounds) 12 Volt deep cycle but those are around 100 up to maybe around 135 Amp Hours.

I suspect people who made statements like you referred to knew 6 volt batteries like Trojans etc are true Deep Cycle while the twelves they were talking about  weren't IE they professed its better to use two sixes if they were comparing deep cycles to non deep cycles as that series sixes combination may ??? yield more energy storage.

For dry camping to maximize the amp hours of energy storage USE WHATEVER COMBINATION that you can fit into your available space. That may be two sixes in series orrrrrrrrrrrr it may be two twelves in parallel    HAVE TO COMPARE APPLES TO APPLES Im running three 12 Volt AGMs in parallel now for 520 Amp Hours but that's a lot of space n weight ya know. But remember I run a CPAP all night plus a 120 VAC compressor fridge 24/7  and like enough capacity so I don't draw down near 50% overnight.

Sure Lithium are much lighter and can be drawn down deeper if that's what you prefer 

 

John T

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

[Lou Schneider]

12 hours ago, NDBirdman said:

why do I keep hearing it is best to have 6volts if you have the room over a 12 volt?

A couple of reasons.  Golf cart 6 volt batteries are a huge market, leading to scales of economy in production so you get more battery for the buck compared to two 12 volt batteries of equal capacity.

With only one path through a pair of 6 volt batteries, all of the charging and load currents pass through both batteries, helping to keep all of the cells evenly balanced.  A pair of 12 volt batteries connected in parallel provides multiple paths for current to flow through the batteries.  This is sort of like a teeter-totter ... fine if everything stays in balance, but if you get something like a slightly corroded connection that lets the batteries get out of balance,  one battery will start working harder than the other, reducing the life and effective capacity of the pair.

Finally, a pair of 6 volt batteries have half as many individual cells as a pair of 12 volt batteries of equal capacity.  This means each 6 volt cell is twice as large as a cell in the 12 volt equivilent capacity bank.  Bigger cells means larger and heavier plates, both of which are very good for deep cycle use.

[NDBirdman]

With 4 100 amp 6vs, connect 2 sets in series to get 2 12v 100 amp.  Now, can you connect the 2 different sets also in parallel to make use of all 400 amp 12v?  Or am I creating a welder?

Now, since this is going to get heavy and I don't want to put that in a camper basement not set up for that much weight support, can I put these in the back of my truck, in the front of the bed and run a connection to the bumper.  Use a connector/cable to connect from there to the camper as needed or am I going to have too much of a voltage drop to make this not doable?  I have room weight wise for the added weight in the truck bed.  Then I would have to figure out a way to charge them, probably suitcase solar panels.  I'm just thinking out loud, if bad idea say so.

Thinking, bed tool box, inverter in box, just have an outdoors type protected outlet on outside of box, run an extension cord to plug-in on camper specifically run for 2 outlets only by each bedroom nightstand... I need more coffee.... it's early.

[oldjohnt]

11 minutes ago, NDBirdman said:

With 4 100 amp 6vs, connect 2 sets in series to get 2 12v 100 amp.  Now, can you connect the 2 different sets also in parallel to make use of all 400 amp 12v?  Or am I creating a welder?

YES you can configure what's called a "series parallel" HOWEVER the two 100 AH sixes in series still equals 100 AH at 12 Volts, and if you parallel that combination with another two sixes in series you end up with 200 total AH NOT 400...……...

In the past I used four Trojan T-105 (225 AH) in series parallel to achieve 450 AH at 12 volts not a problem. Now I converted to multiple  12 Volt 200 AH AGM's Frame size 4D 129 lbs in parallel to get more AH. Its what Amp Hours you need and the room to place them that matters, there's all sort of combinations out there

 

14 minutes ago, NDBirdman said:

Use a connector/cable to connect from there to the camper as needed or am I going to have too much of a voltage drop to make this not doable?

18 minutes ago, NDBirdman said:

 

YES you can connect batteries located in your truck to your RV that's no problem HOWEVER use big cables to reduce voltage drop PLUS you need good quality high current rated connectors. If the cable is too small and/or the length to great of course there's more V = I x R Voltage Drop  but such a system is certainly  manageable and doable ..

19 minutes ago, NDBirdman said:

Then I would have to figure out a way to charge them, probably suitcase solar panels.  I'm just thinking out loud, if bad idea say so

Its a GOOD idea, I would size the solar array such that its possible to achieve 100% SOC by mid morning to noon where possible and reasonable subject to sunlight and angle of sun to the panels and room....

Great questions Birdman, you're getting there yayyyyyyyyyyyyyyy

John T  Live in the RV from Alexander Springs dry camping in the Ocala Natl Forest Florida

[NDBirdman]

Cool, thanks.  I'm slow but surely getting there.  I am about at the point of info overload so I will stop for now, I know what options I have if I want to stop running the generator.  I will ask more after the kill a watt arrives and I figure out what wife's and mine CPAPs require for amps per night.  I kinda like the idea of having the batteries in the truck as we are going to upgrade our camper within 2 years.  The toolbox idea would make the battery set-up easier to deal with.

[NDBirdman]

Now I have to ask.  I am thinking of this fuel tank/tool box combo.  Can I use this with the batteries on top in the tool box area, or am I setting up a large explosion? 

https://www.northerntool.com/shop/tools/product_200373145_200373145?hotline=false

I'm also thinking if I get the above, I might be better off getting 2 boxes, the above for fuel and tools, and the below for batteries/small gen set.  It would take the explosive part and remove it from the equation. 

https://www.4wheelparts.com/p/westin-brute-pro-series-goose-neck-tailgate-box-polished-80-rb257d/_/R-BCTC-80-RB257D?gclid=EAIaIQobChMInsb6yvaL4QIV_h-tBh1gdgLCEAQYAiABEgIFR_D_BwE&ecmp=s:google_738830849_38035436109__pla-322289623861_Westin_WES80-RB257D_base_US&utm_source=google&utm_medium=cpc&utm_campaign=shopping&emlprox=out&ppcfon=1&gp=1&utm_source=google&utm_medium=cpc&sc_intid=WES80-RB257D&ef_id=EAIaIQobChMInsb6yvaL4QIV_h-tBh1gdgLCEAQYAiABEgIFR_D_BwE:G:s&s_kwcid=AL!7836!3!172972240203!!!g!322289623861!&utm_source=google&utm_medium=cpc&utm_campaign=SC Shopping - NTM Desktop&ecmp=s:google_738830849_38035436109__pla-322289623861