chirakawa Posted January 28, 2019 Report Share Posted January 28, 2019 2 hours ago, lockmup68 said: I'm in IT also and if you want the hardware to last, get a Mac. If you want to replace every 1-2/3 years, get a PC. I'm not picking on you, but you're the nearest target. It's blanket statements like this which pisses people off when discussing PC vs Mac or other. It's just not accurate. The fact is that there is a whole spectrum of pc equipment out there with no consistent standards. If you buy cheap junk, you get cheap junk. Mac has a very narrow product line, and none of it is junk. A $300 laptop is not going to perform as well as a $1500 one, pc or Mac. I've got 20 year old pc's which will start up and run tomorrow without a problem. Are they modern hardware? No, but neither is a 20 year old Mac. If I'm not mistaken, MacBooks are using basically the same processors, memory, ssd's, etc. as better pc's are using. I've been running pc's since the mid 80's with very few hardware issues. Software? That's a different discussion. I've been on pc laptops exclusively for the past 25 years and have never had a hardware failure. The only reason I ever replaced them was to upgrade to faster, more modern hardware. You say to buy Mac hardware to last, then recommend getting insurance against failure in the same conversation. I do think that Mac has some advantages and I'm contemplating buying one to play with, but I'm not the least bit afraid of my pc equipment failing in 1 2/3 years. Everybody wanna hear the truth, but everybody tell a lie. Everybody wanna go to Heaven, but nobody want to die. Albert King Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mptjelgin Posted January 28, 2019 Report Share Posted January 28, 2019 40 minutes ago, chirakawa said: It's blanket statements like this which pisses people off when discussing PC vs Mac or other. It's just not accurate. I agree. I've been on PC's since they came into existence, and have had good luck and excellent reliability from them. I am writing this on a high-end Dell laptop that was provided to me by my employer. It is over five years old and still running like a top. No issues at all. Ever. The OS is still Windows 7 and that will have to be dealt with shortly, but operating systems do have to be updated now and then, right? Mark & Teri 2021 Grand Designs Imagine 2500RL, 2019 Ford F-350 Mark & Teri's Travels Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sculptor Posted January 28, 2019 Report Share Posted January 28, 2019 Another option Might be to get a Mac, and install Bootcamp. This method allows you to automatically create a partition on your (solid state) hard drive. Then you would need a copy of your favorite Windows OS to install on the secondary partition. It seems intimidating but it's not hard. i have this setup on on my old Mac Pro desktop. I just don't know if it will work on a newer machine. If the newer MacBooks are running a standard Mac OS it should function well. Think of it like owning one of each but you reboot if the "other side" is needed. https://support.apple.com/boot-camp Kevin and June 2013 Volvo VNL 730 D13 Eco-Torque @ 425 Ratio 2.47 2014 DRV 36TKSB3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SuiteSuccess Posted January 28, 2019 Author Report Share Posted January 28, 2019 So chirakawa, brings us back to the original question. In the past ten years, I’ve had a HP and Dell desktop and now a Dell Laptop. None were $300 “cheap junk”. I ended up with recurrent blue screens and other issues on both desktops and the “professional repair “ folks finally said better to replace than continue to try to repair. My laptop still working but takes eons to boot up and open programs. Maybe is the software but someone in the know couldn’t find a software issue. So back to the original question, if you recommend another brand, what is it? My $1500 budget, I don’t consider would be “ cheap junk”. On edit: Upon reading my post it seems like I’m being argumentative which is not my purpose at all. I’m looking for recommendations of specific brands or models or such that people have used and consider them to be reliable. 2006 Volvo 780 "Hoss" Volvo D12, 465hp, 1650 ft/lbs tq., ultrashift Bed Build by "JW Morgan's Custom Welding" 2017 DRV 39DBRS3 2013 Smart Passion Coupe "Itty Bitty" "Don't go around saying the world owes you a living. The world owes you nothing. It was here first!" Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sculptor Posted January 28, 2019 Report Share Posted January 28, 2019 36 minutes ago, SuiteSuccess said: My laptop still working but takes eons to boot up and open programs. Check how full your drive is. Over 80% full then swap up for a larger hard drive. This is usually a cheap fix. Kevin and June 2013 Volvo VNL 730 D13 Eco-Torque @ 425 Ratio 2.47 2014 DRV 36TKSB3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Carlos Posted January 28, 2019 Report Share Posted January 28, 2019 48 minutes ago, SuiteSuccess said: I’m looking for recommendations of specific brands or models or such that people have used and consider them to be reliable. Apple...? 😀 The Windows users will post up ideas in a few hours after booting up, installing security updates, and cleaning some viruses. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lockmup68 Posted January 28, 2019 Report Share Posted January 28, 2019 4 hours ago, chirakawa said: I'm not picking on you, but you're the nearest target. It's blanket statements like this which pisses people off when discussing PC vs Mac or other. It's just not accurate. The fact is that there is a whole spectrum of pc equipment out there with no consistent standards. If you buy cheap junk, you get cheap junk. Mac has a very narrow product line, and none of it is junk. A $300 laptop is not going to perform as well as a $1500 one, pc or Mac. I've got 20 year old pc's which will start up and run tomorrow without a problem. Are they modern hardware? No, but neither is a 20 year old Mac. If I'm not mistaken, MacBooks are using basically the same processors, memory, ssd's, etc. as better pc's are using. I've been running pc's since the mid 80's with very few hardware issues. Software? That's a different discussion. I've been on pc laptops exclusively for the past 25 years and have never had a hardware failure. The only reason I ever replaced them was to upgrade to faster, more modern hardware. You say to buy Mac hardware to last, then recommend getting insurance against failure in the same conversation. I do think that Mac has some advantages and I'm contemplating buying one to play with, but I'm not the least bit afraid of my pc equipment failing in 1 2/3 years. Wasn't trying to piss anyone off, just giving an opinion. I buy super hi-end PCs for my entire company weekly. We've done extensive testing and do extensive testing on an ongoing basis. The windows software runs better on mac hardware in fusion or parallels (don't use bootcamp). But, the CFO doesn't like buying Mac, so we buy hi-end Lenovos and HPs (also continually test other brands: Dell/Toshiba/custom) and replace them often. For reference, I buy about $10m worth of hardware a year in my biz. about $100k of that is Mac, the rest is all Windows-based machines. I recommend getting applecare or dell/lenovo/hp or whatever it is you get for every machine. When a hard drive fails or something, you want replacement covered. You will prob not use applecare, but it is best to have. You will use lenovo/hp/dell support. I stand by my statement: $1500 laptop to $1500 laptop, get a mac. If you want to run windows, get a mac and run windows fulltime using fusion, it'll work better and last longer. Whatever you do, max out the RAM and SSD. If you want to keep your old windows laptop, upgrade hard drive to SSD and max out the RAM and it'll feel like a new machine. 2003 International Eagle 9200i, Cummins ISX, Freedomline 2007 Teton Scottsdale XT4 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hot Rod Posted January 28, 2019 Report Share Posted January 28, 2019 I can't speak to macs, but if you decide on a windows based machine I can heartily endorse Toshiba. My first Toshiba laptop was off the shelf and got me through 5 years until it started getting slow and battery ready to crap out and I decided time to upgrade. I went with a custom built to order Toshiba in 2010 that was pretty much top of the line at the time with a core i7 processor. I am typing this on the same laptop from 2010 and it is still going strong and trouble free and will still do anything I need it to do. It was about $1000 at the time and a little pricey, but has born out well. I just priced a new top of the line custom built Toshiba with the best core i7 processor and the biggest solid state drive and came in about $1700. I think not bad given 8 years of inflation. I have not pulled the trigger yet because while I would like a new computer, this 8 year old job is still doing well and it is still hard to justify replacing it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Carlos Posted January 28, 2019 Report Share Posted January 28, 2019 9 hours ago, lockmup68 said: Whatever you do, max out the RAM and SSD. This is the only thing I would disagree with, you need to evaluate it for your own needs. I have only 8GB of memory in my laptop, and getting that forced me to get a 512 SSD. I absolutely do not need an SSD of that size. I do need 8GB simply because I need to run virtual machines for testing, in VMware, otherwise 4 would be alright. My wife needs about 12GB for what she does. My desktop has some ludicrous amount of memory because it was a refurb that came that way, and watching actual memory usage tells me that 12GB would have been my reasonable max. I've never met a non-tech person who needs more than 8GB memory. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chirakawa Posted January 28, 2019 Report Share Posted January 28, 2019 I've never bought a Mac, but I went on their site to price them. If you max out the memory and drive and buy Applecare, you ain't going to buy a new MacBook for $1500. I put together a package of the MacBook with 512 drive, 16 gb memory, Applecare, and a usb adapter. It came to $2067 plus tax. And, that was the i5 processor, not the i7. That also did not include a mouse. Not bashing Mac in any way, just trying to be realistic about the discussion. I think the typical individual computer user would rather buy a $500 laptop every three years than buy a $2000 one every ten years. And, many of us get much longer than three years out of our pc's, even the cheaper ones. That may be because most people don't have $2000 lying around to spend on a computer. Now, if I was spending $1 million per year on hardware for my company, I might try to convince my boss that he would be better served by Mac equipment. I'm sure there are some IT professionals who make that argument. It must fall mostly on deaf ears, though, because from what I can find by Googling about 90% of the business world uses pc's. For greater wisdom, please refer to post #2 of this thread. 😀 Everybody wanna hear the truth, but everybody tell a lie. Everybody wanna go to Heaven, but nobody want to die. Albert King Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Carlos Posted January 28, 2019 Report Share Posted January 28, 2019 Yeah, I wouldn't max out memory and drive if you don't need it. Also you can often pick up Applecare for 40% off on eBay, which is what I always do. You can get Applecare any time during the first year. I'm not sure which model you're looking at, but the one that I use and that I recommend for 90% of users tops out at $1599. You also have to consider the resale value; I replace my machines when it makes sense to get a newer one, and get back a bunch of money. So I just look at it like almost a rental cost. I got a deal on my current machine for $1200 and sold the one it replaced for $800. Small jump. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chirakawa Posted January 28, 2019 Report Share Posted January 28, 2019 9 minutes ago, Carlos said: Yeah, I wouldn't max out memory and drive if you don't need it. Also you can often pick up Applecare for 40% off on eBay, which is what I always do. You can get Applecare any time during the first year. I'm not sure which model you're looking at, but the one that I use and that I recommend for 90% of users tops out at $1599. You also have to consider the resale value; I replace my machines when it makes sense to get a newer one, and get back a bunch of money. So I just look at it like almost a rental cost. I got a deal on my current machine for $1200 and sold the one it replaced for $800. Small jump. Yes, if you stay with the smaller drive, it's $1599 plus the Applecare. How much space does the OS take up on the drive? Everybody wanna hear the truth, but everybody tell a lie. Everybody wanna go to Heaven, but nobody want to die. Albert King Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Carlos Posted January 28, 2019 Report Share Posted January 28, 2019 I really don't know, but an educated guess would put it around 8GB or so. Basically tiny. $1599 is for the larger drive and memory. Also, like I said, look around as I picked up that machine as an open box for $1200. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chirakawa Posted January 28, 2019 Report Share Posted January 28, 2019 1 hour ago, Carlos said: I really don't know, but an educated guess would put it around 8GB or so. Basically tiny. $1599 is for the larger drive and memory. Also, like I said, look around as I picked up that machine as an open box for $1200. The one on the right is the one I was working with. That's not the top price for that unit, if you click on it you can add memory to 16 gb and also go to the i7 upgrade. I hear what you're saying about not needing the extra memory, just saying that it doesn't top out at that price. Everybody wanna hear the truth, but everybody tell a lie. Everybody wanna go to Heaven, but nobody want to die. Albert King Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lockmup68 Posted January 28, 2019 Report Share Posted January 28, 2019 go to refurbished section and save some dough as indicated earlier: https://www.apple.com/shop/product/FPXT2LL/A/Refurbished-133-inch-MacBook-Pro-23GHz-dual-core-Intel-Core-i5-with-Retina-display-Space-Gray?fnode=712705e9d6a5b3d295c89a012a66e9bd849640b62efa9b1eb0a88ce1b66b8458b8f2f9a9d755a92ab13dfcc05b11f4ead0e0c8f57870db399c6a981cdd752274ed655d7eddd30cdcc8f5fb3f7d91d1ec Also, the airs are very reasonable. https://www.apple.com/shop/product/FQD42LL/A/Refurbished-133-inch-MacBook-Air-18GHz-dual-core-Intel-Core-i5?fnode=3e5fecdde3e7fa698cd24b17fe3e8aefc8563cf5d36dff3765e8d599f2316ff9dcbff550b9bbfe5c66559b93653379196e2ac898efd47af1d8c6046a95e9b01939aee4f46eaa027219ee1ac40eb55c2a 2003 International Eagle 9200i, Cummins ISX, Freedomline 2007 Teton Scottsdale XT4 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Carlos Posted January 29, 2019 Report Share Posted January 29, 2019 The Air is certainly worth considering also. I don't have a recommendation one way or the other. And yeah, +1 on the refurb site, Best Buy and Amazon open box, and things like that. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lockmup68 Posted January 29, 2019 Report Share Posted January 29, 2019 On 1/28/2019 at 8:28 AM, Carlos said: This is the only thing I would disagree with, you need to evaluate it for your own needs. I have only 8GB of memory in my laptop, and getting that forced me to get a 512 SSD. I absolutely do not need an SSD of that size. I do need 8GB simply because I need to run virtual machines for testing, in VMware, otherwise 4 would be alright. My wife needs about 12GB for what she does. My desktop has some ludicrous amount of memory because it was a refurb that came that way, and watching actual memory usage tells me that 12GB would have been my reasonable max. I've never met a non-tech person who needs more than 8GB memory. I apologize, I was unclear here, Max out RAM and get an SSD. Size doesn't matter in this case--unless it does. It's just a choice. No performance benefit either way on size, just get an SSD. 2003 International Eagle 9200i, Cummins ISX, Freedomline 2007 Teton Scottsdale XT4 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Carlos Posted January 29, 2019 Report Share Posted January 29, 2019 But don't you think 16GB is overkill for most users? I know it is for me, even when running a VM. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lockmup68 Posted January 29, 2019 Report Share Posted January 29, 2019 56 minutes ago, Carlos said: But don't you think 16GB is overkill for most users? I know it is for me, even when running a VM. Not for windows users, for macs, 8 GB is fine. PC RAM is so cheap, why not? 2003 International Eagle 9200i, Cummins ISX, Freedomline 2007 Teton Scottsdale XT4 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Carlos Posted January 29, 2019 Report Share Posted January 29, 2019 Because if it does nothing, then why not spend the cash on something that does? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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