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Why convert to single axle?


RJHILL

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Sorry I'm sure this is an dead horse.  I'm in the market to purchase a  HDT to pull a large fifth wheel.  I can see the advantage of the ET hitch getting the pin height and necessary movement not available with the class 8 fifth wheel.  The question I have is why convert to single axle?  I plan on adding a smart car and my Harley bagger on a platform behind the sleeper with a stinger for the ET. Any thoughts or advice would be greatly appreciated.

  Tks Ray  

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I stayed tandem for two reasons. 1.  Didn’t know what future held as far as vehicle/vehicles  I might be carrying. 2.  IMO can take off bed and hitch and re-sale in commercial market as well as recreational.   When you single weight can become a consideration on the bed. Tandem gives you added capacity. For me, remaining tandem has created no issues other than cost for tires, brakes etc. 

2006 Volvo 780 "Hoss" Volvo D12, 465hp, 1650 ft/lbs tq., ultrashift

Bed Build by "JW Morgan's Custom Welding"

2017 DRV 39DBRS3

2013 Smart Passion Coupe "Itty Bitty"

 

"Don't go around saying the world owes you a living. The world owes you nothing. It was here first!"

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Now if you single you have room for larger tool boxes.  It is probably about four thousand to single so that buys a lot of tires and brakes.  If you are unsure use the truck for a while and see what you need before building a bed.  Also try to get to one of the rallies, the National is in Kansas next month.

 

Nigel

2006 Volvo VNL 430, 2006 smart cabrio cdi, 2000 Triple E Topaz 30'

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Now that everyone has told you why to stay tandem, the biggest reason to single is location dependant. If your registration jurisdiction requires a CDL for tandem, go single. 

I have been wrong before, I'll probably be wrong again. 

2000 Kenworth T 2000 w/N-14 and 10 speed Gen1 Autoshift, deck built by Star Fabrication
2006 smart fourtwo cdi cabriolet
2007 32.5' Fleetwood Quantum


Please e-mail us here.

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For me?

Insurance and emergency roadside service.  No different than a dually PU.  They view me as a class 7 or equivalent to a MDT.

Four fewer tires.  Two fewer wheels to polish.  No power divider to service.

Reduced weight.

Better fuel mileage (+1 mpg).

Lower tolls (when encountered)

Only 12" longer than a 4 door long bed PU.  Easier to find a parking spot.

Less hassle from some narrow-minded campgrounds that believe tandem tears up their roads - no semis allowed.

Improved ride quality with a more resilient suspension (two fewer airbags and Z springs).

Improved turning radius.

Less overall length allows compliance with 65' limitation is many eastern states.

 

I still have clearance on the bed for an "original" Smart.  I currently carry a golf cart.

"My" cost of singling was about $1,000.  I quickly recovered that cost (see above).  I had some help from a mobile crane truck that serviced heavy equipment to move the axles around.  The most expensive item was the new driveshaft and U joints.  I did a lot of the work myself and I am an old guy with no inside shop space.

I don't see my truck returning to commercial service so prospects for resale are a moot point for me compared to my perceived advantages.  Each individual owner must carefully consider their needs and future options.  The switch will not suit everyone.

 

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Randy, Nancy and Oscar

"The Great White" - 2004 Volvo VNL670, D12, 10-speed, converted to single axle pulling a Keystone Cambridge 5th wheel, 40', 4 slides and about 19,000# with empty tanks.

ARS - WB4BZX, Electrical Engineer, Master Electrician, D.Ed., Professor Emeritus - Happily Retired!

 

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WOW what a great forum.  Lots of info. Thank you guys very much.  I have a good chance at getting a 1985 359 peterbuilt from a old retired trucker which he has owned since new.  He has now restored it from the ground up it took him 5 years  but it's now almost mint.  It has 10 brand new goodyear tires on polished rims, 425hp 3406B cat with a 13 speed both have less then 10 hrs you on them and you could eat off the engine and frame. He's asking around 25k  which is less then he has in the restoration.  Still talking about the price but I know he likes the fact it would be pulling a light 20k lb trailers and still on the road.  I just might want to leave out the fact about cutting his baby up if I go that road ..... LOL

Tks again

Ray

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Everything that RandyA said plus I did not need the extra axle. I carry a smart car on the bed but I have a heavy front axle (14.6k) so I had no problem with the weight transfer to the front. That gave me room for 2 more boxes under the bed and full timers tend to carry lots of stuff.

Brad

Brad and Jacolyn
Tucker the Wonder dog and Brynn the Norfolk Terrier
2009 Smart "Joy"
2004 VNL630 "Vonda the Volvo"
2008 Hitch Hiker 35 CK Champagne Edition
VED12 465 HP, Freedomline, 3.73 ratio, WB 218"
Fulltiming and loving it.

 

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Not gonna say it won't work out, but a Smart AND a Bagger  may take up more room than you think.  Realistically, that's going to take about 9 ft of clear space, and that doesn't really count much for jack knife turns.  The handlebars hit, crash bars and saddlebags do OK.  I got a bit of a surprise when I realized that the DW's CanAm Spyder  three wheeler takes up as much room as the Smart. Get the ol' measuring tape out and some sidewalk chalk & lay it out. Make sure to check for odd protrusions, like mirrors and handlebar ends. Try swinging the tape from the Kingpin around the outside of the trailer nose  the change in dimension might surprise you.

Paul

 

Paul & Paula + Daisy the amazing wiggle worm dog...

2001 Volvo 770 Autoshift, Singled, w/ Aluminum Bed - Toy Draggin

2013 395AMP XLR Thunderbolt Toy Hauler

2013 Smart Passion

2012 CanAm Spyder RT

2013 Harley Davidson Street Glide

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What Paul said x2.  I thought I had plenty of room to load things in various configurations, but found out otherwise when the license plate on my bride's bike hit the nose of the camper.  Loading the smart sideways gives me just enough room.  Couldn't fir a unicycle in there.

BTW, I'm still tandem, because of the reasons listed above by Suite Success, and besides, I'm cheap.  I don't see additional costs for tires or brakes, as the tires are far under stressed, so I'm comfortable running them a few years longer, and the brakes, in theory, should last just short of forever in our application (pun intended).  Another consideration for staying tandem, is it may handle better when bob tailing with more weight hanging out back.  If you're intending to full time and need storage space, singling is likely the way to go.

KW T-680, POPEMOBILE
Newmar X-Aire, VATICAN
Lots of old motorcycles, Moto Guzzi Griso and Spyder F3 currently in the front row
Young enough to play in the dirt as a retired farmer.
contact me at rickeieio1@comcast.net

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9 hours ago, RJHILL said:

WOW what a great forum.  Lots of info. Thank you guys very much.  I have a good chance at getting a 1985 359 peterbuilt from a old retired trucker which he has owned since new.  He has now restored it from the ground up it took him 5 years  but it's now almost mint.  It has 10 brand new goodyear tires on polished rims, 425hp 3406B cat with a 13 speed both have less then 10 hrs you on them and you could eat off the engine and frame. He's asking around 25k  which is less then he has in the restoration.  Still talking about the price but I know he likes the fact it would be pulling a light 20k lb trailers and still on the road.  I just might want to leave out the fact about cutting his baby up if I go that road ..... LOL

Tks again

Ray

If you like vintage and the truck is done right I would be all over it. I was going done I-80 and an old restored Peterbilt pulling a large horse trailer passed me going 80MPH. The sound it made and the smoke coming out was WAY too cool. GET IT!

2002 Beaver Marquis Emerald   C-12 Cat 505 HP

2014 Volvo 630 D-13 I Shift SOLD

2017 New Horizons SOLD

 

 

 

 

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There are pros & cons to going either direction.  The beauty of the HDT is you can take it either direction.  You can build it to fit your needs and lifestyle.

Personally I said stayed tandem.  I carried a Jeep and could have done it with a single rear axel.  It just would have required me being very careful not to overload the front axel.  You must not forget about the front axel weight too.  What you carry and your pin weight all have an affect of loading/unloading the front axel.  Singling, especially singling long will transfer weight to the front axel in most cases.

While it is very important to plan your conversion based on what you are going to carry today, don't forget about tomorrow.  Things/plans have a tendency to change over time for various reasons.  Smart Cars have gotten a little longer and little wider over time.  In my case the Jeep we started out with was about 6" shorter than the one we replaced it with.

2017 Entegra Anthem 44A

SOLD - 2004 Volvo 780. 465hp and 10sp Auto Shift (from 2010~2017)

SOLD - 2009 Montana 3400RL

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GEEZ just taped the bike it's almost 40" at the widest and just over 103" (8' 7") long.  Add a smart car (unknown width) might have to leave the bike idea out without a real long bed.  LOL   I want to put my 60" wide x 40" high toolbox (800lbs) with storage tubs on shelving above that inside a cabinet (bed width x cab height x 24" deep) attached to the headache rack behind the cab .  Looks like I need to define my requirements. 

I like this forum getting great response from those who have walked the walk. 

Tks again

Ray 

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Buy a toy hauler, and haul the bike(s)back there.  Living space is over rated.

So far, my bride is going along wth that, but she rides too. 

KW T-680, POPEMOBILE
Newmar X-Aire, VATICAN
Lots of old motorcycles, Moto Guzzi Griso and Spyder F3 currently in the front row
Young enough to play in the dirt as a retired farmer.
contact me at rickeieio1@comcast.net

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3 hours ago, noteven said:

Ray leaving a bike at home is crazy talk. Cut it out.

I’d be tempted to apply Red Green’s principal of Leave ‘er - 

pack less stuff around

What suspension is under the 359? 

 

He said pete air leaf (bags), 13 sp, 250" WB, 12k front axle,  40K rear axle and he said he PTO and pump for a wet kit (no tank at this time). It's also has a rebuilt cab operated adjustable holland fifth wheel. 

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21 hours ago, RJHILL said:

WOW what a great forum.  Lots of info. Thank you guys very much.  I have a good chance at getting a 1985 359 peterbuilt from a old retired trucker which he has owned since new.  He has now restored it from the ground up it took him 5 years  but it's now almost mint.  It has 10 brand new goodyear tires on polished rims, 425hp 3406B cat with a 13 speed both have less then 10 hrs you on them and you could eat off the engine and frame. He's asking around 25k  which is less then he has in the restoration.  Still talking about the price but I know he likes the fact it would be pulling a light 20k lb trailers and still on the road.  I just might want to leave out the fact about cutting his baby up if I go that road ..... LOL

Tks again

Ray

Uhhhh..... you didn't give info about the Pete when you asked the question.  If I owned the truck you described there is NO WAY I would drop the tandems.  The restoration sounds too good to go hacking it up.  It always PO's me to see a true classic that has been chopped up and, IMHO, ruined!  Now, my '04 670 Volvo does not fit into that class.

300.JPG.c2a50e50210ede7534c4c440c7f9aa80.JPG

Randy, Nancy and Oscar

"The Great White" - 2004 Volvo VNL670, D12, 10-speed, converted to single axle pulling a Keystone Cambridge 5th wheel, 40', 4 slides and about 19,000# with empty tanks.

ARS - WB4BZX, Electrical Engineer, Master Electrician, D.Ed., Professor Emeritus - Happily Retired!

 

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My truck is singled out but long wheel base. I didn't know what I wanted. I just just looking for an affordable truck. I was the only one out there at the truck auctions with a tape measure. I had the bed before I had the truck. The truck I happened to find was already singled. With a single rear I have way more room for storage boxes.  I don't have plans to carry a car. Maybe way in the future when I can afford to have a custom bed built. I don't have any problem turning. These freightliners turn pretty sharp. Here is a before and after pic.

DmUa8anl.jpg

mhAlEpSl.jpg

Farmer, Trucker, Equipment operator, Mechanic

Quando omni flunkus moritati-When all else fails, play dead
I'm a man, but I can change, if I have to, I guess.

 

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13 hours ago, RandyA said:

Uhhhh..... you didn't give info about the Pete when you asked the question.  If I owned the truck you described there is NO WAY I would drop the tandems.  The restoration sounds too good to go hacking it up.  It always PO's me to see a true classic that has been chopped up and, IMHO, ruined!  Now, my '04 670 Volvo does not fit into that class.

Thanks for the response Randy

Love your "Great White" rig very nice

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  • 2 weeks later...
On 9/10/2018 at 8:39 PM, RandyA said:

Uhhhh..... you didn't give info about the Pete when you asked the question.  If I owned the truck you described there is NO WAY I would drop the tandems.  The restoration sounds too good to go hacking it up.  It always PO's me to see a true classic that has been chopped up and, IMHO, ruined!  Now, my '04 670 Volvo does not fit into that class.

I'm with Randy on this....while I believe the majority of people are best served by singling their truck, in this case, NO WAY should that truck ever be singled. That would destroy its value. And would be a shame.

And for those that think leaving it tandem means that it can more easily be put back into commercial service - that is true. But you are overlooking the fact that in almost every case you will get more value out of the truck if it is re-sold into RV service - assuming it is set up properly.  That is my opinion, but it is based on 15 years of monitoring pricing of converted trucks.

 

Jack & Danielle Mayer #60376 Lifetime Member
Living on the road since 2000

PLEASE no PM's. Email me. jackdanmayer AT gmail
2016 DRV Houston 44' 5er (we still have it)
2022 New Horizons 43' 5er
2016 Itasca 27N 28' motorhome 
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No truck at the moment - we use one of our demo units
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Jack,

You are absolutely correct. You will get more value in the RV market. I did not really know how I wanted to use the truck when I purchased and at JW Morgan’s suggestion I left tandem knowing I could single later if I wanted (more $$). A question that may need to be explored is what about 10 years in the future. Smart cars may not be as much of an option and other choices may need to be made. That being said, if I was in the market now I would probably go with a singled truck, although in 10 years the tandem has not presented any issues. 

2006 Volvo 780 "Hoss" Volvo D12, 465hp, 1650 ft/lbs tq., ultrashift

Bed Build by "JW Morgan's Custom Welding"

2017 DRV 39DBRS3

2013 Smart Passion Coupe "Itty Bitty"

 

"Don't go around saying the world owes you a living. The world owes you nothing. It was here first!"

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Howdy RJHILL,

What you are about to read is "my opinion" but to me it would be a CRIME to butcher a classic such as a 359 by singling it.  I went to great pains to keep my truck looking like a truck especially when I built the Smart Car, bed I didn't want to ruin the look of the classic truck.  To each his own but if your set on using an HDT with a single rear axle I think you would be better served to get a different truck.  YES, I am very biased on this subject.

I went from this,

IMG_2629-L.jpg

to this.

IMG_2898-L.jpg

And am now using it like this.

fullsizeoutput_3069-XL.jpg

Dave

2001 Peterbilt, 379, Known As "Semi-Sane II", towing a 2014 Voltage 3818, 45 foot long toy hauler crammed full of motorcycles of all types.  Visit my photo web site where you will find thousands of photos of my motorcycle wanderings and other aspects of my life, click this link. http://mr-cob.smugmug.com/

IMG_4282-600x310.jpg

 

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