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motorcycle lifts for back of an Airstream


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We are researching motorcycle lifts for an 800 lb Harley that we would like to attach to our current 25' Airstream.  Or, something with wheels that could be welded on.  Any advice would be greatly appreciated.  We are able to carry another motorcycle, bicycles, and kayaks in the bed of the pickup, but, alas, there is no room for the Harley Electroglide.  This would be a much less expensive solution to upgrading to a toy hauler.

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Putting an 800 lb weight on the back of a trailer will produce an enormous moment (torque) that will lift the front of the trailer and will significantly reduce the hitch weight.  Having a hitch weight that is an appropriate percentage of the trailer weight is an important aspect of maintaining proper control while towing.  I would investigate this carefully before committing to this approach.

OTOH a wheeled solution would probably be construed as "triple towing" which, I believe, isn't legal in all states.

Sandie & Joel

2000 40' Beaver Patriot Thunder Princeton--425 HP/1550 ft-lbs CAT C-12
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11 minutes ago, DesertMiner said:

Are they even “legal” attached to a bumper pull trailer?

Here's an old thread in which this issue is addressed: Idaho Tote

Sandie & Joel

2000 40' Beaver Patriot Thunder Princeton--425 HP/1550 ft-lbs CAT C-12
2014 Honda CR-V AWD EX-L with ReadyBrute tow bar/brake system
WiFiRanger Ambassador
Follow our adventures on Facebook at Weiss Travels

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You need to understand that you will be removing weight from the hitch and impacting the handling of the total RV combination as you look at this website.

Quote
Can I mount the Cruiserlift System to my Travel Trailer or Fifth Wheel Trailer?
No! Travel Trailers and Fifth Wheel Trailer frames were not designed for the direct downward weights associated with the system and bike to be added to the rear of the trailer. Other manufacturers have installed and continue to install these types of lifts onto trailer frames. The stories that are relayed to us is that the installation of the lift systems will do two things:  1. The 1000+ pounds of weight pushing directly downward on the rear of the trailer frame bends the trailer frame. One client has such a system and the rear frame bent so that the slide out will no longer function. We have talked to numerous customers with frame problems associated with a motorcycle lifts being installed. 2. When adding that 1000+ pounds to the rear of the frame, it removes the weight from the front king pin so that the trailer does not track or handle correctly. Below is an email received from one of many customers that had a lift system installed onto their fifth wheel trailer.
hi i am needing more info on your swivel wheel trailer .can i legally pull it behind my 5th wheel trailer with out any problems, such as fishtailing and problems backing? i had overbilt lifts install their lift on my new 5th wheel with the promise of no problems.boy was that a big mistake.the fishtailing is so bad that it is scary. so i need to find a better safer way of taking our harley along with us.
There is a big difference between pulling a boat or small cargo trailer behind a fifth wheel trailer with a 350 pound tongue weight, than by adding 1300 to 1400 pounds of direct downward force, bouncing at the rear of the trailer.

 

Good travelin !...............Kirk

Full-time 11+ years...... Now seasonal travelers.
Kirk & Pam's Great RV Adventure

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Even with the Idaho Tote, you will be adding probably 25% of the 800 pounds of motorcycle plus some of the weight of the trailer to the hitch on the Airstream.  So you should figure your tongue weight of the hitch will be 250-350 pounds.  That also removes close to the same amount of hitch weight of the Airsteam to truck connection.  That may make you much more susceptible to trailer sway.  Especially with a cross wind and then being passed by a large truck. 

Also you want to look closely at the CCC (cargo carrying capacity) of the Airstream.  Some Airstream's have a very small CCC and they are very easy to exceed the GVWR (gross weight of the trailer).

Al & Sharon
2006 Winnebago Journey 36G 
2020 Chevy Colorado Toad
San Antonio, TX

http://downtheroadaroundthebend.blogspot.com/

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Happy W - Warshington is a “no double tow” state. An Idaho Tote is not a trailer or semi-trailer because it does not swivel hitch to the tow vehicle but becomes part of it, attached at two points, with wheels and brakes under the load. Because it is not a trailer, weight does not need to be placed on it’s “hitch” for it to handle properly.

It is a self steering tag axle with a deck and ingenious method to adjust the caster angle so you can back up. 

If the steering tension is set correctly it should reduce sway tendency of the trailer because it moves the effective wheelbase of the combination back from the close to center position typical of rv trailers which causes them to weathercock in crosswind and bow waves from large trucks.

Having said all that blah blah ^ first thing I would do is talk to Idaho Tote and find out if they have Airstream experience...

Or - draw straws and looser has to herd the rv winner rides the bike to where you’re going 😀

 

"Are we there yet?" asked no motorcycle rider, ever. 

 

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Looks like on all of them except the shortest, weight can be more or less centered on tote axle. So stresses on trailer would be more horizontally than vertically. Would need to attach to frame rails.  Looks like the tote is a good idea. Wish it wasn't so expensive.

Foretravel 40ft tag 500hp Cummins ISM  1455 watts on the roof, 600 a/h's lithium in the basement.

 

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21 hours ago, noteven said:

Happy W - Warshington is a “no double tow” state. An Idaho Tote is not a trailer or semi-trailer because it does not swivel hitch to the tow vehicle but becomes part of it, attached at two points, with wheels and brakes under the load. Because it is not a trailer, weight does not need to be placed on it’s “hitch” for it to handle properly.

It is a self steering tag axle with a deck and ingenious method to adjust the caster angle so you can back up. 

If the steering tension is set correctly it should reduce sway tendency of the trailer because it moves the effective wheelbase of the combination back from the close to center position typical of rv trailers which causes them to weathercock in crosswind and bow waves from large trucks.

Having said all that blah blah ^ first thing I would do is talk to Idaho Tote and find out if they have Airstream experience...

Or - draw straws and looser has to herd the rv winner rides the bike to where you’re going 😀

 

Since the Idaho Tote is a 2 wheel platform attached to the back of another vehicle and the wheels are behind the center of the platform (trying to keep away from the term "trailer"), there will be some weight on the hitch.  With an 800 pound motorcycle and some weight from the platform, there will be some amount of weight on the Airstream. 

There is probably some info about how much of the total weight that needs to be forward of the wheels in the owners manual.  However I don't see a link to the manual on their website.  Calling Idaho Tote will probably provide an answer.

Al & Sharon
2006 Winnebago Journey 36G 
2020 Chevy Colorado Toad
San Antonio, TX

http://downtheroadaroundthebend.blogspot.com/

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If the Airstream is still under warranty for the frame, you should check to see if attaching any kind of hitch to the rear will void the warranty. 

Even if the trailer is out of warranty, someone with knowledge of metal frame structure should look closely at the frame to estimated just how much weight and stress can be applied to the frame.  Not just the vertical weight & stress, but there is also the side to side stress in towing 1000-1500 pounds.

Al & Sharon
2006 Winnebago Journey 36G 
2020 Chevy Colorado Toad
San Antonio, TX

http://downtheroadaroundthebend.blogspot.com/

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1 hour ago, trailertraveler said:

One consideration I do not think has been mentioned yet is the Gross Combined Weight Rating (GCWR) of the tow vehicle.

Ditto!  Especially with a motorcycle already in the bed of the pickup truck.  Also not sure how many passengers in the truck.  That weight has to be added to get the GCWR, not to mention if the truck will exceed the GVWR as well.

Al & Sharon
2006 Winnebago Journey 36G 
2020 Chevy Colorado Toad
San Antonio, TX

http://downtheroadaroundthebend.blogspot.com/

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As a retired mechanical engineer, I look at adding 800 lb plus to the back of a travel trailer or 5th wheel is a recipe for disaster.  First the frames are not meant to have that much weight hung on them, and second, think of a see-saw.  The weight will unload the tongue and cause handling issues.  On a travel trailer, you want 10% to 15% of the trailer weight on the tongue.

Next issue is one of the free wheel dolly attachment to the rear of the trailer.  Can the rear of the trailer support the weight?  Also, some states look at this as a double tow and it is not allowed in many states.

Keeping the Air Stream, your best bet is to load the scooter in the back of the truck is the bed is long enough.  Then you have to be concerned that the payload capacity on the truck is sufficient to carry the 800 lb scooter plus the tongue weigh of the trailer.

Ken

Amateur radio operator, 2023 Cougar 22MLS, 2022 F150 Lariat 4x4 Off Road, Sport trim <br />Travel with 1 miniature schnauzer, 1 standard schnauzer and one African Gray parrot

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Another option is a dual rear wheel truck with an AmeriDeck lift which is capable of loading 2 bikes and up to 2500lbs. 

Then carry light stuff like bicycles on the rear of the airstream. 

I have an AmeriDeck and have carried bikes while towing a TT.  The main disadvantage to this system is you see a road that would be a nice mid day 4 hour ride up to that glacier or whatever and you have to unhitch the trailer to get your trusty steed(s) on the ground.  

Oh and the attention it gets, folks walk over, compliment the machine how handy and safe it looks etc.

Loading and tying down is sweetness, and quick...walk around on the ground tying down, and push a button to load and unload. 

"Are we there yet?" asked no motorcycle rider, ever. 

 

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I have a Harley also. I purchased a Class A with a tag axle and put a Hydrolift on the back. I was told that even with a Class A I would need a tag axle to use a Hydrolift lift welded to the frame.

2015 Itasca Ellipse 42QD

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Just so we're clear on giving info to a newbie, the company that makes the Idaho Tote says it is not a trailer.  That does NOT mean each (or any) state doesn't call it a trailer.  

I know, for a fact, using one in Florida is still considered double towing.  That does not mean LEO will stop you in Fla or anywhere else double towing is illegal.  

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Not sure why some think the weight is going to be put on the back of the trailer. Is it not the purpose of the two wheels and suspension on the tote to carry the weight of the load on the tote, and not on the airstream?  Not much different than a regular trailer except that it is attached to two or more points on the airstream. Because it it is firmly attached to the airstream, tote carries the weight of the load, what am I missing?

Foretravel 40ft tag 500hp Cummins ISM  1455 watts on the roof, 600 a/h's lithium in the basement.

 

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No, the tor does carry the load and part of the load is carried by the rear of the trailer.  In order to put no load on the trailer, the load would have to be perfectly centered over the axles.  Again, think of a see-saw.  

 

Ken

Amateur radio operator, 2023 Cougar 22MLS, 2022 F150 Lariat 4x4 Off Road, Sport trim <br />Travel with 1 miniature schnauzer, 1 standard schnauzer and one African Gray parrot

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The few swivel wheel totes, whether single or duel wheel I have seen, the bikes were loaded in the center of the deck. Simple physics would tell you that half the weight is on the wheels and the other half is on the attachment points.  I am sure you can fudge the 50/50 by moving the weight forward or back but not by much!

2004 Freightliner m2 106  2015 DRV lx450 Fullhouse  2019 Indian Springfield 2014 Yamaha 950 V-Star

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