Escapees survey of NPS improvements

[bobsallyh]

Just received the email from Escapees for taking a survey about National Parks. It is set-up by Survey Monkey.com. I hope whatever outfits subscribe to Survey Monkey gets it cheap. Over the last several years I have taken or refused to take surveys that are driven by the Monkey. And this one is more of the same. The largest question which has numerous headings asks for your priority by numbers being 1-14. There is no explanation: is 1 being highest priority and 14 being the lowest or the other way around? I just had an AARP survey where they told you that 1 was the lowest priority and 10 being the highest priority. No explanation needed. Which way is it, Escapees?

[Orvil Hazelton]

     It clearly indicates that we are to arragnf the statements from 1 -  14, 1 being highly desired thru 14, least desired; very straight forward when instructions are read.  

[Barbaraok]

I found the whole survey poorly done.   They make assumptions and I’m pretty sure they won’t like my answers.  I also dislike not having the option to say “I prefer not to answer “ for Q about $$.  

[dzwiss]

40 minutes ago, bobsallyh said:

 The largest question which has numerous headings asks for your priority by numbers being 1-14. There is no explanation: is 1 being highest priority and 14 being the lowest or the other way around? I just had an AARP survey where they told you that 1 was the lowest priority and 10 being the highest priority. 

It's obvious........AARP needs to go to 14 so they will not be outdone.😂

[Al F]

Everyone who is an Escapees member with a valid email address on file with Escapees (not the forum) should have received an email providing a link to the survey.

I urge everyone to at least look at the survey.  If you don't want to participate, then fine, but at least make your own decision.

I also urge anyone with an opinion about the direction the National Parks are taking to fill out the survey and make your voice heard.

Here is the text of the Email:

Quote

National Park Service Survey

We at Escapees have a rich tradition of engaging in advocacy on behalf of the RVing community. And, while we cannot fight every fight, nor will we win every fight we’ll fight, we do try to make a difference when and how we can. Sometimes we know exactly which issues to tackle, and how best to approach them. Other times, the path is less clear. We find ourselves presented with such an issue—using public-private partnerships (3Ps) to improve the RVing community’s experience on National Parks Service (NPS) lands, including updating, repairing, expanding and reopening RV campgrounds.

We think it’s appropriate to turn to you, members of the RVing community, for guidance and direction. We will attempt to advocate in a manner that most closely follows the majority opinion of our members. And, if no clear majority of our members presents itself, we will stay neutral on the issue.

A bit of framing is necessary to understand the nature and scope of the issue. Currently, there are 417 sites (59 national parks) operated by the NPS. And, there is approximately $12 billion in backlogged maintenance negatively affecting the health of the parks, campgrounds, roads and the overall visitor experience. In short, our national parks and campgrounds, built in the Eisenhower era, are falling into a state of disrepair. Moreover, NPS campgrounds have been closing over the years, due to lack of funding and resources. Additionally, the U.S. Congress has consistently failed to allocate enough money to fixing and improving the NPS parks and campgrounds.

3Ps, at their most basic level and being the version we think most closely aligns with the values of the RVing community, the RV Industry Association, the Department of the Interior, and the National Park Service, use the funding and operational expertise of private companies to manage and maintain federal property. The private companies are called concessioners. Concessioners must be approved by NPS and operate under strict guidelines set forth by the NPS and federal law. Concessioners must seek approval from the NPS for proposed changes to a park, so that the integrity, iconic look and feel, and natural beauty of the park is maintained and campgrounds critical to the RV experience are repaired, modernized, expanded and reopened for your enjoyment. After an agreed upon time, either an extension is granted to the concessioner by NPS or the improvements made to a park become property of the federal government. Contracts typically range from 5-15 years.

There are many forms that a 3P can take. In the version we favor, at no time do the concessioners own the federal land (this is not privatization or selling off federal lands)—rather they manage, maintain, and operate the NPS asset, under strict terms. As such, the cost to stay overnight at national parks may or may not increase to provide a safe and modern camping experience for all Americans to enjoy. And, it is important to note that new amenities will likely be included in these rates, such as access to wi-fi, updated/larger RV sites, site-specific hookups, renovated bathhouses, etc.  Although unlikely, this could reduce some families’ ability to use and enjoy some national parks—and, the national parks should be accessible to all. But, the model we support would implement a more dynamic or “à la carte” pricing so campers that do not want or require additional amenities only pay the economical base rate. 

Four potential courses of action include:

1. Escapees remains neutral on 3P initiatives.
2. Escapees advocates for the federal government to properly fund the repair and improvement of NPS campgrounds and other infrastructure.
3. Escapees supports the federal government utilizing 3Ps to help fund and manage the repair and improvement of NPS campgrounds and other infrastructure.
4. Escapees supports utilizing a dual track approach using a combination of options 2 and 3 where appropriate

The RV Industry Association, the Outdoor Recreation Roundtable, the Department of the Interior, and the National Park Service favor option utilizing option 4 – the dual-track approach.

Therefore, given the information provided above, we ask our members’ opinions on whether the federal government should engage in 3Ps to repair and improve NPS services and infrastructure, including RV campgrounds.

The survey below attempts to help us at Escapees understand whether you support the use of 3Ps in the context of the NPS, and how you use these parks. 

Please note, the survey will close on May 27, 2018.

 

[Al F]

Here is the link to the survey:  https://escapees.us9.list-manage.com/track/click?u=d8bc0f46a19a696e5c335f4d2&id=bd68b8910d&e=3426fad0f4  for anyone not receiving the email.

I initially didn't include the link thinking the survey was for members only, however one of the questions is "Are you a member of Escapees?" so I assume the survey is open to everyone. 

[Chris-n-Dennis]

I'm really glad they are taking the survey or at the very least, touching base with the membership on which way to go. Unfortunately the first step should have been some research from the membership on what the workkampers, volunteers and visitors saw as problems within the park system so the resources could be better allocated. In my experience from volunteering on the state and federal level, while you won't find a more dedicated bunch on the front lines,  the departments themselves are pretty much their own worst enemy for getting things done. The bureaucracy and self-made regulations bring efficiency to a whole new low so the "3Ps" plan is almost an assured failure before getting out the gate.

Getting off soapbox, vent far from complete but you get the idea.

[Kirk W]

1 hour ago, rm.w/aview said:

Every vote counts, except the ones not cast.

I just did one of them and suggest that everyone do the same. Since they are anonymous I really don't see why it matters so much that they ask your income level. I suspect that may relate to how at least some of us answer. I have used Survey Monkey in an organization that I'm part of and I will assure you that your answers are kept anonymous. Creating surveys is not an easy task and to create one that isn't criticized as bad is probably impossible. It shows a clear attempt by management to know what we members want, even though Escapees is a for-profit, privately held company. 

[TCW]

I took the survey, however I wish that Escapees would be looking to support other options in addition to increasing the use of concessionaires.

The National Park Restoration Act is currently working its way through Congress. It would use revenues from oil and gas leases to fund the National Park Maintenance Backlog. 

I have said this a number of times before on this forum. In my opinion; patrons of public lands like RVers, campers, hikers, outdoor photographers, etc., need to take a lesson from hunters, fishermen and boaters who decades ago set up systems to at least provide some permanent sustainable funding for the public lands that they use and enjoy. Research the history of the Migratory Bird hunting stamp, Dingle-Johnson, Pitman-Robertson and Wallops-Bordeaux excise tax acts.  If an excise tax was charged on all camping/outdoor equipment such as is charged on hunting and fishing gear, it would amount to millions of dollars a year. This was proposed decades ago and as far as I know no major outdoor/conservation organization supported it and most of the industries/retailers with the exception of Cabela's and Bass Pro opposed it also because they were afraid that it might result in a small increase in the cost of backpacks used for school book totes and urban sheek camo outfits.

[Kirk W]

9 minutes ago, TCW said:

I have said this a number of times before on this forum.

But have you said this to anyone from the staff or management of Escapees? Since no member of the staff read or participate in the forums posting here doesn't change much. All of us who are members have access to contact the business office by email or phone. 

[bobsallyh]

1 hour ago, Kirk Wood said:

I just did one of them and suggest that everyone do the same. Since they are anonymous I really don't see why it matters so much that they ask your income level. I suspect that may relate to how at least some of us answer. I have used Survey Monkey in an organization that I'm part of and I will assure you that your answers are kept anonymous. Creating surveys is not an easy task and to create one that isn't criticized as bad is probably impossible. It shows a clear attempt by management to know what we members want, even though Escapees is a for-profit, privately held company. 

I went back to the survey to re-read the instructions numbered 1 - 14 to see what ORV was reading that I must have missed.  I could not go back because it said that I had already taken the survey which I did.  Since I thought it was individual numbers, I put in a bunch of 1's, 7's, and 14's.  They accepted my answers.  On the question of the income, which I did not answer, there was no place for me to reply that I did not care to answer a private question.  This is why I think Barbaraok did not care for the income question with no opt out.  Since they knew I had already took survey, they must be tracking my computer and know who I am.  This does not seem to be anonymous.

[TCW]

1 hour ago, Kirk Wood said:

But have you said this to anyone from the staff or management of Escapees? Since no member of the staff read or participate in the forums posting here doesn't change much. All of us who are members have access to contact the business office by email or phone. 

I did years ago and never got a response. Did someone have to ask for Escapees to support the 3Ps initiatives or did Escapees take the initiative to create this poll on their own?

It will be very interesting to see what if anything Escapees actually does on this issue since most topics on this forum having anything to do with raising the cost/fees on public lands seem to be dominated by those opposed to any increases or claiming that increases will deny a large number of folks access. The use of more concessionaires and requiring them to make infrastructure improvements as part of their contract is very likely to increase the cost of any services they provide. My impression is that many RVers are not that pleased with the operation and cost of current concessions so it will be interesting to see if they support an increase in concession operations.

I doubt that Escapees is interested in supporting the excise tax concept that they know RVers and the no fee crowd have historically opposed.  In my opinion, small organizations like Escapees, that I doubt have lobbyists and lawyers in Washington, are not as important as individuals contacting their members of Congress. 

[sandsys]

7 hours ago, Kirk Wood said:

I just did one of them and suggest that everyone do the same. Since they are anonymous I really don't see why it matters so much that they ask your income level.

I left that question blank and it let me do that.

Linda

[trailertraveler]

13 hours ago, bobsallyh said:

...I went back to the survey...Since they knew I had already took survey, they must be tracking my computer and know who I am.  This does not seem to be anonymous...

It seems to also means that a spouse or significant other can not complete their own survey unless they have a separate computer/device.

[Dutch_12078]

The survey site sets a cookie. Clearing it lets you retake the survey. Using more than one browser would also work.

[Kirk W]

13 hours ago, bobsallyh said:

Since they knew I had already took survey, they must be tracking my computer and know who I am.  This does not seem to be anonymous.

Having used Survey MonkeyI assure you that you are anonymous and not tracked. I suspect Dutch is correct, but I know that two different computers from the same house can each do the survey.

 

[Chalkie]

On 5/16/2018 at 12:26 PM, Barbaraok said:

I also dislike not having the option to say “I prefer not to answer “ for Q about $$.  

I agree so I simply did not answer that question. The survey did not care and moved along even with no answer. 

 

[Vladimir]

On 5/16/2018 at 2:30 PM, TCW said:

I took the survey, however I wish that Escapees would be looking to support other options in addition to increasing the use of concessionaires.

The National Park Restoration Act is currently working its way through Congress. It would use revenues from oil and gas leases to fund the National Park Maintenance Backlog. 

I have said this a number of times before on this forum. In my opinion; patrons of public lands like RVers, campers, hikers, outdoor photographers, etc., need to take a lesson from hunters, fishermen and boaters who decades ago set up systems to at least provide some permanent sustainable funding for the public lands that they use and enjoy. Research the history of the Migratory Bird hunting stamp, Dingle-Johnson, Pitman-Robertson and Wallops-Bordeaux excise tax acts.  If an excise tax was charged on all camping/outdoor equipment such as is charged on hunting and fishing gear, it would amount to millions of dollars a year. This was proposed decades ago and as far as I know no major outdoor/conservation organization supported it and most of the industries/retailers with the exception of Cabela's and Bass Pro opposed it also because they were afraid that it might result in a small increase in the cost of backpacks used for school book totes and urban sheek camo outfits.

TCW's post is worth rereading. There needs to be a stable, funding mechanism for public lands. Doesn't have to fund the entire program, but just a stable base as Congress changes the overall picture due to national priorities.

Washington state has a refund of the state gas tax to support recreational activities. The money is gas tax funds "burned" on public roads that are NOT supported by gas taxes. Primarily, state and federal roads accessing recreation areas. Here is an explanation of the program: https://www.rco.wa.gov/grants/nova.shtml.

At the Federal level something similar can be done with the Federal gas tax with the money refunded to the Federal agencies with roads that are NOT funded with gas taxes. That would include the NPS, FS, BLM, USFWS, as well as COE (I think). 

The 10% tax on outdoor clothes and equipment is also needed. Still mad at REI and the industry for opposing the tax.

On a related note. Having worked for the NPS, BLM and FS. I understand the focus on NPS, but the real need is on FS and BLM lands. Any fix to recreation funding for the Park Service needs to include the BLM, FS and other Federal land management agencies.