Considering getting a small TT

[Teri Fernandez]

Hi we are new to this site. My DH, age 65 and I, age 61 are considering purchasing a small TT for travel throughout the US. We have NEVER owned an RV of any sort before but are recently retired and longing to see the US with our goldendoodle pup while health permits. 

We have a 2011 Toyota Tacoma and this would be our tow vehicle, but since we have no idea what we are doing, we are reaching out regarding types of TT that forum members have found reliable, while being affordable. Our kids are grown and we want to see the world. One concern is whenever we are not taking extended trips is where to park the TT for storage. Our small community has very strict HOA guidelines regarding this and prices in Miami for storage cost as much, if not more than the TT monthly cost ! What do you do with the TT when not in use? We are willing to look outside of Miami as we could drive to the storage site when readying for a trip.

Any ideas, advice and the like would be most appreciated !

[trailertraveler]

Welcome to the Escapees Forum!!!

In order to match your Tacoma with a trailer, you will need to become familiar with some terms such as Gross Vehicle Weight Rating (GVWR), Gross Combined Weight Rating (GCWR), etc. This calculator may help you keep all the capacities within limits.

Another consideration is the relationship between trailer length and the wheelbase of the tow vehicle. Here is an article that discusses this.

Again, Welcome to the Escapees Forum!!!

[JimK]

Casita is a well known brand.  If you have not done so, take a look at their webpage to see if that size trailer will fit your needs.  I will warn you in advance, that small does not mean inexpensive.  In fact it often works the other way.  Small RVs can cost more because the design and engineering are often more involved.  With a Tacoma you will not have many choices.  You will only be able to pull a small trailer or something like a popup tent trailer.  Used RVs depreciate quickly so that is the way to go for keeping down costs.  I bought mine on consignment.  The dealer had an incentive to find everything that needed repair or was questionable because the seller was going to pay to bring the unit to like new condition.

I have some other bad news regarding traveling with a dog.  You may not know that dogs are not allowed on trails in most national parks and many other wilderness areas.  You will also not be permitted to leave the dog in the trailer for the day.

Of course, there is also no magic in parking an RV for storage.  It sounds that you will need to pay for this.  Costs are typically pretty low.

[TCW]

58 minutes ago, JimK said:

...I have some other bad news regarding traveling with a dog.  You may not know that dogs are not allowed on trails in most national parks and many other wilderness areas.  You will also not be permitted to leave the dog in the trailer for the day...

In 14 years of RV travel with as many as three dogs, this has not been my experience. JimK is correct about most National Parks not allowing dogs on trails. Not sure what he means by "other wilderness areas" there are lots of public lands such as National Forests, Bureau of Land Management lands, Corps of Engineers, state parks,  state wildlife management areas, etc., where dogs are permitted and on some can even be left off leash. I have hunted with my dogs on these lands all across the country. The county park where we are in Georgia has lots of Rving dogs and they are allowed on the trails. Most campgrounds and RV parks that have a rule about leaving dogs unattended further define that as outside the RV picketed or in an enclosure. Now if Fluffy stands on the dashboard barking all day when you are gone, you may be asked to take action to stop that behavior or leave. I suspect that there are hundreds of thousands of RVers that travel with dogs.

[sandsys]

1 hour ago, JimK said:

Casita is a well known brand. 

If you go with a Casita, Scamp, or Oliver fiberglass trailer you will want a cap on the truck's bed for extra storage.

I looked up the specs for the 2018 Toyota Tacoma and they show 5600 GVR, 11360 GCVR, 640 tongue load, and 6400 towing capacity. I don't know how those relate to your 2011 Tacoma but at least it gives you a place to start.

6400 is not a lot of towing capacity so you will indeed be looking for a SMALL trailer.

But, it can be done and, to me and many others, it is worth the effort. I wish you well in your search.

Come back with more questions after you've done some more research; we love helping newbies.

Linda Sand

[JimK]

I am not sure what the argument is about dogs.  They are typically not allowed in national parks or wilderness areas.  The definition of other wilderness areas is covered by the National Wilderness Preservation System.  The NWPS currently covers 765 locations and over 100 million acres.

National Parks include some areas which are a long way from being wild.  I was a campground host at Capitol Reef NP.  The developed part of the park including the campground, orchards, and visitor center has many areas where you can walk a dog on a leash.  Even that can pose a problem.  Turkeys and deer roam through the public areas and campground on a daily basis.  I should probably say on a regular basis.  Dogs are not permitted on trails or in the backcountry areas.  They cannot be left alone in campgrounds.

[Kirk W]

First of all, welcome to the Escapee forums! We are here to help and will do our very best to assist you.

4 hours ago, Teri Fernandez said:

We have NEVER owned an RV of any sort before but are recently retired and longing to see the US with our goldendoodle pup while health permits. 

I am wondering if you might not be wise to try renting an RV for a week or two of travel before you jump into purchasing one? Travel trailers for rent are not that common but small motorized RVs are quite available and come in a range of sizes. Even small RVs are pretty costly, and to buy and then sell one would be an expensive process. 

4 hours ago, Teri Fernandez said:

with our goldendoodle pup

Travel with a dog does present some special accommodations but most of our RV travels over the past 35+ years has been with a dog. We have spent a lot of time visiting more than 30 national parks and monuments, all with our dogs. Add to that dozens of state parks and historic sites, national forest, BLM, and Corps of Engineer parks and I really do not see that great a problem. Some commercial parks charge a small extra fee for dogs and you do need to pick up after them religiously, but we have no regrets over traveling with our dog. 

57 minutes ago, sandsys said:

I looked up the specs for the 2018 Toyota Tacoma and they show 5600 GVR, 11360 GCVR, 640 tongue load, and 6400 towing capacity. I don't know how those relate to your 2011 Tacoma but at least it gives you a place to start.

 

I searched for a 2011 Tacoma and found specs that are the same as yours so believe them to be correct. Small travel trailers can come in at less than 4000# but higher quality and larger trailers will weigh significantly more. You will probably be limited to something of 25' length or less. 

4 hours ago, Teri Fernandez said:

One concern is whenever we are not taking extended trips is where to park the TT for storage. Our small community has very strict HOA guidelines regarding this and prices in Miami for storage cost as much, if not more than the TT monthly cost ! What do you do with the TT when not in use? We are willing to look outside of Miami as we could drive to the storage site when readying for a trip.

This is a problem that is probably beyond the scope of knowledge of those of us who have never lived in that area. All that I can tell you is to shop the cost of storage in outlying areas. I'd look down toward the Homestead area. 

[TCW]

57 minutes ago, JimK said:

...I am not sure what the argument is about dogs...

No argument, just different experience and possibly interpretation of the rules that do exist.

57 minutes ago, JimK said:

...They are typically not allowed in national parks or wilderness areas...

 I disagree. They are allowed in many National Parks just not in some areas as designated by the individual park. Here is a link to how to visit Yellowstone National Park with a dog. Here is a link to a webpage from the Wilderness Society about visiting public lands with a dog that states:

"Designated Wilderness Areas? Only in certain areas

Wilderness visitors are welcome to bring leashed pets, but if you plan to travel to wilderness that is inside or adjacent to a national park, of course you will need to follow their regulations. Always remember that dogs can pose problems for wildlife, so keep them under good control."

The Klamath National Forest Rules of Thumb for Wilderness Areas states:

"Dogs
• Dogs can cause problems with wildlife, pack-and-saddle stock and other dogs, and they may be annoying or threatening to other visitors. Be aware of these potential conflicts and keep your dog either on a leash or under direct voice control at all times. " 

  

[JimK]

Seems very clear to me.  Your link to Yellowstone rules is exactly what I have said.  There are other stipulations but the main ones are:

"Pets are not allowed on trails or boardwalks, in the backcountry, or in thermal areas. Pets may not be left unattended or tied to an object."

So, yes, you can visit a national park with a pet, but you will likely be highly restricted.  I cannot imagine going to Yellowstone and not walking the thermal areas.

[Kirk W]

4 minutes ago, JimK said:

So, yes, you can visit a national park with a pet, but you will likely be highly restricted. 

Some things we just have to disagree about. It is a little like having children. Some folks just do not believe they are worth the trouble. Our quiet dog has visited many national parks and has never been a significant problem. 

 

[Teri Fernandez]

 Thank you for the warm welcome to this for him as well as your many thoughtful ideas and tips. Definitely something to think about. We have considered renting a small RV to try it out but I think right now our best bet is to visit some RV shows just see what would best suit us and our price. Thank you so much for all your comments keep them coming please everything is very much appreciated !

[TCW]

Teri,

One last point about RVing with your dog. The rules can and do vary from location to location even within the same agency such as the National Park Service. It is your responsibility to know and comply with the applicable rules. This statement was made about camping in National Parks.

Quote

...You will also not be permitted to leave the dog in the trailer for the day...

To make my point, this is from the Arches National Park Website:

Quote

Pets may not be left unattended (except in a paid-for campsite in Devils Garden Campground, where they must not cause a disturbance). 

This from the Grand Teton National Park website:

Quote

Unattended pets are not permitted to be tied up in campgrounds, picnic areas or trailheads. They may be left within vehicles with appropriate ventilation, water and/ or food. 

An RV is a vehicle.

[bigjim]

If you go to RV shows just be real careful  about what they will tell you that your truck will tow.  And I do mean real careful. You can get some good ideas and such but try to determine what you can tow with what from other sources.  I want you to have a pleasant experience.

One thing about the Casita and Scamp and a few others retain their value more than some of the expensive rigs.

[JimK]

4 hours ago, Kirk Wood said:

Some things we just have to disagree about. It is a little like having children. Some folks just do not believe they are worth the trouble. Our quiet dog has visited many national parks and has never been a significant problem. 

 

This is not a matter to disagree about.   The facts are clear.  Nor do the restrictions have anything to do with how noisy your dog is.   

When I go to a national park I want to explore and at a minimum see some of the iconic places.  Perhaps you just don't care and are content looking out the RV window or stopping at a few overlooks. 

I know the Big 5 in Utah best.  Here is what you can and cannot see.  Arches:  you and the dog can drive to the end of the park road.  Along the way you can see balanced rock and the features around the area called Park Avenue.  You and the dog cannot walk to Landscape, Navajo, Broken, Sand Dune, Delicate or most other arches in the park and there are hundreds definitely worth seeing.  You and the dog cannot take the ranger walk into the Fiery Furnace.  Canyonlands:  you and the dog can look at the Green River and some of the other overlooks.  98% of the park is out of bounds.  Bryce:  you and the dog can look from the overlook loop down into the hoodoos.  That and the campgrounds and parking lots are all you can see.  Zion:  you and the dog can drive through the park.  You and the dog cannot hike the narrows or even take the bus up the scenic drive to the narrows.  Again you will never be able to see more than about 2% of the park from you car.  Capitol Reef:  the story is the same.  You can see only a very small fraction of the park from the road and scenic drive.  The vast majority of the park is off limits.

Having kids is a completely different situation.  Many adults carry their small kids using the kid carry backpacks.  By ages 6-8, most kids can walk the trails for miles. 

I have met lots of first time visitors who showed up at national parks with dogs and then were surprised and disappointed to find out about the restrictions.  You can even have better access with a wheel chair than with a dog.  In fact places like Yellowstone have miles of wheel chair friendly walks that are off limits to dogs.   

[sandsys]

One advantage to a tent trailer is that it folds down to a level below your vehicle's rear window so you can see behind you. Another is that we were able to park our tent trailer in our garage since clearance is not a problem; that might help with your storage challenge. But you do need to be physically able to open and close the trailer so be sure to check that out before you buy one of those if you decide to go that way.

Linda Sand

[TCW]

19 hours ago, JimK said:

...This is not a matter to disagree about.   The facts are clear...

And what facts might those be? The ones you cherry pick? Not every dog owner feels the need to take their dog everywhere they go. Some dogs, like mine, even though they are hunting dogs do not enjoy or need to go for long hikes on a leash. Before I retired, the dogs I had were use to spending 10-12 hours in the house. They easily adapted to the RV. The dogs I have now have RVed their entire lives.  I already provided some links that contradict your statements  about dogs in Wilderness Areas and not being able to leave dogs in National Park Campgrounds. I am not aware of a law that says that because I own a dog, I can not hike without them.  I have hiked most of what you claim I can not in Arches while the dogs stayed in the trailer (as permitted by park regulations linked to in my previous post). I have also camped in the BLM campgrounds on UT-128 along the Colorado River or disperse camped on BLM land North of Arches and left the dogs in the trailer while hiking or sight seeing. From these same campgrounds; I have visited Canyonlands National Park, the Needles District, Dead Horse Point State Park, Sago Canyon and driven a number of the Scenic Byways and Backways all without the dogs. 

When we visit Capitol Reef, I don't even bother to go to the Fruita campground as it has become so popular that it is not worth wasting my time to see if there are any available sites. There are campgrounds and dispersed camping opportunities in the adjacent Dixie and Fish Lake National Forests where dogs can be left in the trailer and even run loose, under voice control, outside of the campground area.

Although it has been many years, I worked as a Park Ranger in Yellowstone. I never heard of anybody checking to see if dogs were left in RV's in the campgrounds. We did occasionally get calls to check on pets left in vehicles at trailheads and parking lots. In recent visits we have stayed outside the park at Forest Service Campgrounds like Bakers Hole, Eagle Creek, Soda Butte, Rex Hale and Wapiti or disperse camped in the Forests. I have visited many of the thermal features and hiked to the top of Mount Washburn and other trails. I have fished the Upper Meadow of Slough Creek, Nez Perce, Blacktail Deer and Soda Butte Creeks, the Yellowstone, Madison, Gibbon, Fire Hole, and Gardner Rivers. All while travelling with dogs.

Teri,

There are many ways to RV, and even visit National Parks, that do not require that pet owners choose between Rving and their pets. I have visited 104 facilities operated by the National Park Service, hiked many trails and taken many guided tours. I have never felt overly constrained by the fact that I RV with dogs.

[JimK]

The difference might be exactly what you described.  Your dogs have lived their entire lives indoors or in the RV.  Apparently you are able to get away with leaving them and hiking on your own.  That may not be the case for others.

Anyway the facts are clear.  Every National Park will have a policy.  Most do not allow dogs on trails or in the backcountry. Some do not allow dogs to be left alone in an RV. 

http://www.ournationalparks.us/park_issues/bringing_dogs_into_national_parks_can_be_dangerous/

https://www.tripadvisor.com/ShowTopic-g60999-i481-k2608082-First_Time_to_YNP_and_travelling_with_a_dog-Yellowstone_National_Park_Wyoming.html

[Kirk W]

17 hours ago, TCW said:

There are many ways to RV, and even visit National Parks, that do not require that pet owners choose between Rving and their pets. I have visited 104 facilities operated by the National Park Service, hiked many trails and taken many guided tours. I have never felt overly constrained by the fact that I RV with dogs.

That has been our experience also. I suspect that if we could determine it accurately, about half of the fulltime community travel with pets, possibly more. There are accommodations to be made but behaved pets seldom are a major problem.