Help me think through raising my 5th wheel

[GR "Scott" Cundiff]

I'm looking at a new F350 4x4.  Right now, on my 2008 F350 the camper rides level.  The new 4x4 is  6-7 inches taller than my current truck.  

The axles on the camper are already flipped, but the springs attach to the frame at their top setting, so I can move down 2 more bolt holes, which would give me around 3 inches in height.

As I understand it, I still need 3-4 inches to get level.

My 5th wheel hitch is a Superglide, a fairly low hitch as it is.  I could get a different hitch since I'd be moving to a long bed truck, but I don't think I could get anything that would be lower without being in even greater danger of hitting the pickup bed sides.

What am I missing?  What options do I have?

Thanks.

[DesertMiner]

Why 4x4?

http://comfortridehitch.com/index.html

Different pin box?

[GlennWest]

People raising 5th wheel coaches worry me. They are top heavy to begin with. Anytime one increases length it gets weaker, as in longer shackles. I would fit truck to coach. I put a hauler bed on my dually to get clearance and level. 

[rynosback]

I had riser blocks installed when I ordered my coach.  I know of other guys that have gone to Moryde to have risers installed.  They looked at the set up and determined what size blocks to weld to the frame to tow level and have good clearance on the bed rails.

[rynosback]

15 minutes ago, GlennWest said:

People raising 5th wheel coaches worry me. They are top heavy to begin with. Anytime one increases length it gets weaker, as in longer shackles. I would fit truck to coach. I put a hauler bed on my dually to get clearance and level. 

This also is a good solution.  

[ALLOY]

Hi

Things that come to mind....

What do you have for clearance between the trailer and the top of the rails on the 2008 pick up now?

When I look at the specs for a 2008 F350 it lists the open tailgate to the ground at +/-35" . The 2017 F350 4x4  show as 37"-38"

If you've flipped the axles and then used the bottom hanger bolt this will increase the torsion on the hangers/frame.  The  hangers many need to be boxed in and the frame strengthened.

Options I can think of:

- Raise the pin box or a maybe a flatter pin box

- Larger wheels/tires on the trailer.

- Custom springs with more curve.

- Riser Blocks between the springs and axles.

- Longer (stronger) spring hangers

- Flatdeck or RV hauler body

- Lower the truck......a Google search will tell if "lowering shackles" are made for the truck you are looking at.  

 

FYI...F450 has a better turning radius than the F350......but the F450 has slightly less GVWR

 

 

 

[GR "Scott" Cundiff]

Thanks for the input  - 

41 minutes ago, ALLOY said:

Hi

Things that come to mind....

What do you have for clearance between the trailer and the top of the rails on the 2008 pick up now?

When I look at the specs for a 2008 F350 it lists the open tailgate to the ground at +/-35" . The 2017 F350 4x4  show as 37"-38"

If you've flipped the axles and then used the bottom hanger bolt this will increase the torsion on the hangers/frame.  The  hangers many need to be boxed in and the frame strengthened.

Options I can think of:

- Raise the pin box or a maybe a flatter pin box

- Larger wheels/tires on the trailer.

- Custom springs with more curve.

- Riser Blocks between the springs and axles.

- Longer (stronger) spring hangers

- Flatdeck or RV hauler body

- Lower the truck......a Google search will tell if "lowering shackles" are made for the truck you are looking at.  

 

FYI...F450 has a better turning radius than the F350......but the F450 has slightly less GVWR

 

 

 

 

Thanks to everyone for the input - all are helpful to me.  The comment about open tailgate height caused me to go back to and look at my figures again.  I have about 6 inches clearance right now.  I measured from the ground to the bed of both trucks and the difference is 4 inches.  If I use the bottom spring hanger holes, I'll gain about 3 inches.  That get's me to about an inch of where I am now - surely, that is close enough?  I know I wouldn't swear in court that the camper is absolutely perfectly level right now, just that it looks pretty good.

[billr]

Glens advice on a hauler bed is what direction I would chose. I know the cost is significant but from a safety point you will be far ahead keeping the fiver as low as possible. 

Raising that C of G just multiplys your risk to a rollover under a manouver situation. 

Bedides the hauler beds are just way cool!😎

[GlennWest]

Typing about lifting a 5ther and a current post in the hdt section where one rolled over and it wasn't lifted. This would cause me to rethink my choices.

[remoandiris]

10 hours ago, GlennWest said:

Typing about lifting a 5ther and a current post in the hdt section where one rolled over and it wasn't lifted. This would cause me to rethink my choices.

Nothing in that thread implies height had anything to do with the crash.

[GlennWest]

Didn't say it did. Simply stating it can happen without it. Op is wanting to lift his. Then it will be more likely to do just that.

[Chalkie]

On 2/14/2018 at 7:12 PM, GR "Scott" Cundiff said:

The new 4x4 is  6-7 inches taller than my current truck.

Are you talking about a SRW? The DRW models are lower at 36.4". 

My previous truck was a SRW 4x4 and the trailer was always a bit nose high when towing. The new truck (DRW 4x4) sits lower and the trailer tows dead level now. 

[packnrat]

better to go flat bed on the truck.

higher spring mount (aka lower hole) is not a great way to fix this as the mounts and where they mount to the frame. get a lot more stress. and your tip over point increases.

much safer to lower the trucks bed rails at this point.

[GR "Scott" Cundiff]

Just an update for any who are interested, I've refocused on getting a 4x2 rather than 4x4 - that would make the new truck less than 2 inches taller.  I've been towing for nearly 5 years with a 4x2, and think I would do fine for the future.

Just an interesting comparison, we are 12'8" right now - even if we go up a few inches I think we will still be shorter than most 5vers out there right now.  

[GlennWest]

Height not issue we discussing. Raising camper raise center line of weight. This increases lean which can cause it to go over and increases stress on suspension. Your solution is a good one. 

[remoandiris]

deleted.

[GR "Scott" Cundiff]

Truck shopping is getting interesting.  Apparently, the only 4x2 configuration on a F350 is at the work truck level.  All the others are 4x4 and, thus taller.  I'm back to needing to raise the 5th wheel.  Won't know just how much until after I get the truck, but I'm guessing 5 inches.   

[GlennWest]

You can find 2X4 trucks but they are area ordered. Find a dealer that will find you one. 

[Darryl&Rita]

You need a better dealer. Ford.com lists 2 wheel drive all the way up to the Platinum model.

[GR "Scott" Cundiff]

24 minutes ago, Darryl&Rita said:

You need a better dealer. Ford.com lists 2 wheel drive all the way up to the Platinum model.

No need to blame the dealer.  I know the truck can be ordered in that configuration and the dealer has told me that they have found a couple of them 750 miles from here. Also Autotrader shows a few farther away than that.  

However, I'm not all that sure I don't want a 4x4.  We've had a few times when it would have certainly come in handy.  Both times I got stuck while on grass surfaced camp sites.  Once I managed to wallow my way out, the other time I had to be towed out.  Having 4wd would have been nice both times.  

In other words, I'm not sure I want to battle my way through to finding a 4x2 only to regret it later on,

And, friends, beyond all that, I really started this thread to get opinions on ways to raise the 5th wheel.

BTW, I'm still researching options and may pick the one that just kicks the can down the road a couple of years.

[garyl53]

I would stay with a 4X4 if that is what you like. The F350s come with 3-4" axle block (if I recall correctly) that can be replaced with shorter blocks (OEM or third party) which will lower the rear by a few inches. Also the truck will squat for sure as it is loaded for another few inches. I would hook it up and make a measurement before doing anything.  If you decide to pick up the 3" increase in height by lowering the springs to the lower bolt holes you might consider adding the Mor/Ryde X-Factor bolt-on cross-members to provide some extra support for the spring mount brackets.

Good luck.

[lockmup68]

if you are buying new, you should really look at an HDT. I was in same boat and saved a bunch of money going HDT and getting 10x the safety factor, amenities, etc. 

[GlennWest]

2 hours ago, lockmup68 said:

if you are buying new, you should really look at an HDT. I was in same boat and saved a bunch of money going HDT and getting 10x the safety factor, amenities, etc. 

Now you went and done it. Lol. I agree. I have so much less money in my HDT and so very much more truck. Even if I was towing a travel trailer now I would keep my truck. So much safer. 

[Dreaming Dreamers]

Mr Cundiff: I highly recommend that you visit the Ford Truck Enthusiast web site!! Like this awesome website, it is chock full of info from Ford lovers like us. I read it everyday like this one. Frankly I don't recall anyone with your issue. But signup and ask. I'll be looking out for it !! Again let me say this discussion forum is the best!!!! It has allowed me to know that I too can be a full timer!!!!!

[Ronbo]

Scott is not the type to drive a HDT. He would also have to have another vehicle for a daily driver and I don’t know how he feels about a smart. His rv isn’t anywhere near heavy enough to need a HDT. He also doesn’t do his own vehicle maintenance and it has worked out well for him.