FED UP With MIcrosoft!

[Jack Mayer]

Derek, you will appreciate this.....

I finally decided to buy a Surface product. Almost bought the new Surface Pro with a Bridge keyboard addition. At the last minute I bought the Surface Laptop. It is a pretty incredible piece of hardware....I moved it up to W10.  The only better piece of hardware in that form factor I've seen is the Dell XPS (properly configured). And it costs at least $400 more.

I'll stick to Microsoft for now...but I'm willing to move if the incentive is there.

[DJW]

Jack

Does that come with a larger screen than the 13.5"?.  Which is what I have seen.

Dennis

 

[RV_]

Jack,

Moved it up to Win 10? What did it come with? Is this what you bought? Sorry you confused me with the moved it up to Win 10 comment.https://www.microsoft.com/en-us/store/d/surface-laptop/90FC23DV6SNZ?WT.mc_id=pointitsem+Microsoft+Bing+Ads+USA_gaPMG_STR_SEM_SurfaceLaptop_B_English_NA_NA_NA_NA_NA_Bing_ALL&s_kwcid=AL!4249!3!{creative}!e!{placement}!o!!&cl_vend=bing&cl_ch=sem&cl_camp=290088996&cl_adg=1265537905020901&cl_crtv=79096128999099&cl_kw=surface laptop&cl_pub=bing.com&cl_dvt=c&cl_mt=e&cl_gtid=kwd-79096129439511&cl_dim0=WYpa-wAAAevraioY:20170809004447:s&ef_id=WYpa-wAAAevraioY:20170809004447:s

Jack, I always used laptops as desktops because with the fastest, top configurations, in the 80s and 90s, they were just too dang hot in my lap. But many folks love typing in their laps. I type with three fingers on each hand. So I do need to see the keyboard. But I do love the tablet and on screen keyboard for shorter typing one fingered. I also can't text with my thumbs and the phone sideways. I can only take forever and do one finger, or use the voice. Thank goodness for accurate voice commands today for phones and tablets.

I am so tablet and AIO oriented now that laptops to me are not even an interest. When you look at a touch screen AIO, it is just a giant heavy tablet on a stand that you can't hold in one hand. Funny too that I never use tablet mode on either, preferring the desktop and more keyboard but then switching to the touch screen for special characters not on a keyboard, fast resizing, and fast or accurate scrolling.

I did use a laptop and desktop combo, and as you know a netbook, which ran too hot and waaaaay tooooo sloooow - compared to Windows tablets today. Remember when I had the two Galxy Tabs, the 10.1 and 7"? And got my first cell phone? I was bitching all the time about not being able to load the printer drivers to network my printers wirelessly with Android or iPhone/Pads back in the first couple of years of them. I wanted tablets to act like a Windows desktop or laptop. THen came Windows 8 in October 2012 through Jan 2013, my first Surface RT tablet which performed acceptable but no email if I did not want to use outlook.com? Then the HP and Lenovo 11.6" Windows tablets sold me. But I wanted 1080p, full size USB 3, Micro SD card slot, The Venue 11 Pro gave me it all first and my wife still uses it. Fantastic machine, I even got her the Dell dock for it. But I got it open box for $35 not the $129.99 they sold for new. I use the Voyo MIni PC attached via HDMI to the spare bedroom TV, My tablets are the Surface Pro 3 and ASUS T100CHI. But for Kindles, we have to make some decisions because we have two Fire HDX 7" one with 16GB and the other 64GB built in because that was the last Fires with no microSD cards. But they were very expensive new and have better than 1080p resolutions. I also have one Fire HDX 8.9" with 32GB storage. We got them used with the magnetic Amazon origami cases as well as a Defender Otterbox for the 8.9 inch Fire. Then I bought one Fire 8"new model Tablet a few months back on sale for $69.99 with 16GB but it has a micro SD slot with a 128GB card in it. And we still have one Kindle paperwhite. I mention those because I don't like the 11.6" Windows size and weight for reading in bed or on "the throne." Jack you really need to stop by on your way up or down when near Shreveport. Bring trade stuff! <wink>

Pieere,

OS wars between Apple and Microsoft users ended when Jobs switched Apple to the Windows chipsets. We are all using the Evil Wintel today. Linux always used Windows hardware. Linus invented it in 1991, before Windows, but then they were PCs. Linus Torvalds was a Dos person who made his own kernel, borrowing heavily from Unix.

Today when I run into an Apple hater or Windows hater I just shake my head.

[RV_]

Oh and on edit, only the 8.9" Fire HDX 4th generation is still updated as it did today for OS updates not the 7" ones but they all work great anyway. Fire Tablets have security by obscurity. For those who want to start inexpensively on an Android like tablet for ~ 80 bucks the 8" HD today is a helluva deal! Not 1080p but it looks like it. Very light, and just a kool tablet with SD card slot. I use them for downloading movies from Prime easiest although I can do it now with my Windows systems from Prime and Netflix. And my 5.5" Moto Z Play phone does it all pretty much too! All I can say is that I am glad I can play like I do, and that the hard and soft ware are always interesting.

I am having trouble deciding which to keep and which to sell because I am just playing any more, and unlike when I was younger I don't need to sell the old soon enough to recoup at least half. My friends down here all are pretty much not into computers and phones. I need to find some other old computer nerds here.

When some of my friends from here stop by or like when Roger was my surgery partner last November it was a real treat. Bill and Diane too! Most of the other RVrs that have visited weren't into tech all that much.

[DJW]

RV

Would you recommend a refurbished  MS Surface Pro 4 core i5 128GB SSD and 4 GB of Ram Win 10 Pro from MS for $729?  It's just for e-mail, pictures, lite home admin, surfing the web.  It's on MS

 

Dennis

 

[RV_]

Dwnnis,

Unless you are getting the typecover pen with it that may not be the best deal Check these out new:

https://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=9SIA5E65M36580&cm_re=surface_pro_4_i5-_-34-735-073-_-Product

Or this:

http://www.ebay.com/itm/Microsoft-Surface-Pro-4-i5-256GB-SSD-8GB-Ram-Factory-Warranty-/112504990620?var=&hash=item1a31d1eb9c:m:mecfmmvRv_i7AY68EbMP6kw

That refurb has better specs and a warranty through April 2018

Many more will come out and be cheaper as the new un-numbered Surface Pro  makes it into the mainstream.

[Pieere]

 RV Derek, not saying one is better than the other, just got (sic) of arguing with the other party! Tried to explain some like coffee and some like tea and he couldn't accept it! I'm just sick of long winded Upgrades and Updates! 

[DJW]

RV

Thanks

Yes the 2nd example which is refurb by the seller has better spec's but more than twice as expensive.!  Looking for my DIL.  Trying to stay around the $700 mark.  The first example at Newegg is even a better deal than the MS store as it is the same machine only new.  Both have the pen but neither has the cover/keyboard

Dennis

 

[Jack Mayer]

 Depending on how you intend to use it I'd suggest NOT buying the Surface keyboard and instead look at the Brydge keyboard. A better keyboard for most people, and it makes the Surface into a useable laptop. The standard Surface cannot reasonably be used on a lap. Or any irregular surface.  That may or may not be a factor, but is something to consider.  Typing wise, I'm a fast touch typist and the Brydge keyboard that I have tried works a LOT better for me....I do not own one but have compared it to the Surface keyboard. Something to think about.....

[eddie1261]

The shortest answer is that NO product will live through it's entire life cycle  without needing updates. How do you feel when your car or RV discovers a flaw and sends out a recall? Until someone has a seatbelt fail or an ignition module suddenly start to see a flaw where after 14 months or so many run cycles it fails. Nobody can see the future. Hacking teams work on exploiting vulnerabilities for a living. When they find one, they report it, and it gets patched. The reason Mac doesn't have this issue is that the computer world it 97% Microsoft, and the black hat type hackers who try to do damage with viruses don;t go after the 3%. They go after the 97%. I worked in that field for decades and have several advanced certifications, and there is simply never going to be a "finished" OS. 

Given the number of Microsoft powered computers in population, their failure rate is quite low. The best analogy is that the news doesn't cover the 87,000  successful plane flights every day. They only report the crashes. I have 6 computers here running Windows . I never have an issue. No virus problems, no crashes.... 

But, that's me. If you prefer make a switch to Mac, have at it.

[Pieere]

10 hours ago, eddie1261 said:

The shortest answer is that NO product will live through it's entire life cycle. 

But, that's me. If you prefer make a switch to Mac, have at it.

Did and Done! Everyone has opinions like everyone has .......s! Upgrading a whole system twice a year is absurd! And after 114 years they still cant make an automobile without dangerous defects! In so much of a hurry to get the vehicles into the customers hands to make huge bucks. Not even caring about human lives! Sad world this has become!

[TxExile]

After looking for a couple years, for something to replace Microsoft Streets and Trips (SnT) for planning our annual cross country road trip I finally located something I've not seen referenced on any of the forums.  It's almost as good as SnT and in some areas even better.  Find it here: https://trips.furkot.com/register 

It's free!!!  It allows you to opt to use Google Map or Apple Map.  It has most of the features of SnT which are absent from all the other options I've tracked down.  For example, one of the SnT features missing from other 'alternatives to SnT' and one of the most valuable options for me is the ability to plug in start and stop driving times.  This option results in showing your end of day on the map much as SnT does/did.  Additionally, Furkot offers the ability to set your speed of travel in MPH or you can accept the default of 100% of the 'average' drive speed for the route OR edit that percentage.  This option, which was on the very early versions of SnT vanished with later upgrades (or I was just unable to find it) AND this option allow you to really hone in on the big question my wife always ask:  where are we spending the night tonight.

You can use Furkot on and off line and if you have internet connection, you're not restricted to using a particular device - which is another upgrade to SnT of old.

Enjoy!

[RV_]

Tx Exile,

Please start a new topic with that information on it in the connecting on the road forum here. I just realized that buried in one of my threads it may not get seen by the folks that need it.

There are lots of fans of MS S&T today. Back before Android phablets like my 5.5 inch Moto Z Play I used Delorme Street Atlas.

Today I have phone holders and hands-free phone service that is as good as anything I have used. It is just the default Google maps/navigation App and I believe that it can do all or most of what S&T can do. It is much better on complicated intersections than Street Atlas was while underway.

[Chalkie]

On 8/7/2017 at 8:41 AM, Pieere said:

 I don't need to waste my time when I only use computers for browsing, Emails and RV forums.

Sounds to me like you don't need Apple or Microsoft. Just get yourself a tablet running Android and be done with it. 

[eddie1261]

On 8/4/2017 at 10:19 AM, Pieere said:

Why can't they make a final version and just do updates instead of a whole new build twice a year!!!

Why do auto manufacturers have recalls? To fix things that turn up as problems after the release, right?

This is like saying "Why did we have 486 CPUs when they could have just made i7s from the beginning!" 

If you waited for a flawless OS, you would still be on DOS 3.0. They patch Windows whenever a flaw or a possible exploitation hole is found, usually on Wednesdays. The benefit of using a Mac OS is not that they are necessarily bettor out of box. It's that Windows has about 97% of the market share, and those despicable people who think it is funny or clever to write a virus to exploit a hole is written for Windows, because they want to do as much damage as possible. I have lived IT since 1982 when I got my first IBM Big Blue, which by 1982 standards was a Cadillac. By 2017 standards it is a boat anchor. $4000 for am 086 CPU. Horrible, slow computer, but one of the first home PCs to hit the market. 

All that said, I will likely buy a Mac to add to my network here soon. I now run Windows on 3 desktops and 2 laptops, Linux on one desktop, and I have an old Mac Mini but it's so old it's just junk now.

[Pieere]

16 hours ago, Chalkie said:

Sounds to me like you don't need Apple or Microsoft. Just get yourself a tablet running Android and be done with it. 

As i said i already have a Macbook Air! Have been selling the MicroCrap and have just one old banged up 12" DELL WITH CORE I3 a 320 GB HD  3 GB memory and 2.4 ghz processor but works like a champ!

[RV_]

Pieeere,

Have you tried Linux Mint 18.2 Cinnamon yet? I actually ordered the disks from their website for $5.99 each, for the 32 bit and the 64 bit versions. The test old computer had difficulty being fast with it but it ran fine. I am going to get a nice test bed or keep my Surface Pro 3 and make it a dual boot computer. I will sell it eventually as I just got a Surface Pro 4 with the i7, 8GB RAM, and the 256GB SSD.

I really like Mint. If I ever get really good with it I may set up a PC in the guest bedroom with it exclusively. I don't want to try it on my two main systems, my SH's 21" touchscreen and my 27" quad HD touchscreen. Same with the three windows tablets, my Surface Pro 3, Surface Pro 4, and Dell Venue 11 pro.

If you or anyone has luck with Linux high end touchscreen systems on UEFI hardware and software do let me know here, or in a PM.

Enjoy your systems. Aside from the utterly strange to me commands and command line syntax. But I am able to open a terminal and copy them into it just fine. I used to really like my DOS expertise back in the day. I like my Windows systems but I am not on the road, limited in broadband speeds or data limits, nor financially constrained from pursuing my hobby, computers and their/other gadgets.

Have fun! Life is too short to do what others try to impose.

 

[k4rs]

1 hour ago, RV_ said:

Pieeere,

Have you tried Linux Mint 18.2 Cinnamon yet? 

<snip>

I really like Mint.

<snip>

RV

Be careful.  It does not take much to convert to the dark side...  

[TheDuke]

RV: just some thoughts for you. 

Two years ago I looked at Mint but I was using too much software to switch. Now I use much less software and am looking at it again. 

One problem, not having a large SSD C drive, 128G. So I moved to portable software. I should have done that years ago. Much easier to install a new computer. And frees up space on C drive.

After having sync issues with chrome on PC and P.O.S. IPad, switched to Opera. 

Sure keeps my brain active. 

Read that Surface sales are almost 1 billion dollars this year. Not bad for a system that nobody likes except the NFL.

Tesla is way tool up and down for me anymore. 

 

 

 

[RV_]

Roger,

I was glad to hear you guys are safe and out of town. Irma made a direct hit on your place but was down to a tropical storm by then. you being up near Tampa. 

I do like Linux to play on, and yes I could switch but I prefer touch screens and Windows apps. I'll try to run it live on my main system, but I doubt it will let it load unless I drop my security down and switch to legacy support. We'll see. drop by if you do I-20 any time soon. next year we are moving up to the Denver area. 

[RV_]

Duke,

I hear ya, and I don't need any of my systems with all the bells and whistles. But I like my toys. I can do fine with this surface as I have the stylus and  backlit typecover. The accessories for the Pro 3 fit the Pro 4 and vice versa. But I love the 27" touchscreen and quad hd. I have a Fire TV 4k capable with my screen. So I have my mail taking up the right half of the screen, and either Sling TV or my Over the air tuner on the left bottom 1/4 screen, with my browser on top taking the last top left quarter screen. To watch the Fire TV I have to use it only for that via the HDMI 2.0 in port.

Duke, I'm still long and strong Tesla. China just announced they were going to ban all ICE age vehicles from being made, sold, or owned in China. They haven't set a date yet but like the UK, France, India, and most of the rest of the first world all of them are saying NLT 2030, 2030, or 2040. 
In 2032 I'll be 80 years old. Assuming we don't have a nuclear exchange.