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Before you pull your gun out you might try hitting the vehicle alarm.
My rig lights up like a Christmas tree flashing on/off when in alarm mode.
When I add a train horn, I don't need no stinking gun.

 

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When I read postings of this nature, no matter on which forum, the first thing that has always come into my mind is: have the majority of us in this country lost all faith in ability of local, state and federal law enforcement agencies to protect us?  There are bad people in this country, always has been and always will be but so many people seemed to think that by them allowing them to open carry or conceal carry a firearm will make it better?  Media hysteria along with instantaneous news access is not helping either.  News people, who I put in the same category as car-rv salesmen, will take a story that is "thrilling"  and report it until they find something better.  What I find disturbing/somewhat frightening are laws that allow a lot of people to obtain a open/concealed carry of permit sorts after completing almost no training what so ever.   

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I carry in the rustbelt. (SW Airlite) When in CA, NJ and NYC I have pepper and 600 lumen tactical light. I also have collapsible baton in the rustbelt. Never have had to use them as of yet. But have had many close calls. If trouble is brewing I try to move out asap.

Edited by slackercruster

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1 hour ago, jc2 said:

When I read postings of this nature, no matter on which forum, the first thing that has always come into my mind is: have the majority of us in this country lost all faith in ability of local, state and federal law enforcement agencies to protect us?  There are bad people in this country, always has been and always will be but so many people seemed to think that by them allowing them to open carry or conceal carry a firearm will make it better?  Media hysteria along with instantaneous news access is not helping either.  News people, who I put in the same category as car-rv salesmen, will take a story that is "thrilling"  and report it until they find something better.  What I find disturbing/somewhat frightening are laws that allow a lot of people to obtain a open/concealed carry of permit sorts after completing almost no training what so ever.   

I've not lost faith in law enforcement, but I've lived in rural areas much of my life where average response time was on the order of 30 minutes and sometimes more. In sparsely populated areas law enforcement is often spread out to the extent that they are more of an "after-the-fact" force.  Also, living in a rural area made gun ownership and use a very common thing, so relying on yourself for immediate protection from criminals wasn't considered unusual. Same with feral animals. You didn't call animal control, you just dealt with it. 

I can imagine that folks who have lived their lives in more urban areas where law enforcement response was (perhaps) only moments away might find this mindset concerning, but it really is second nature to many who lived further out. 

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3 minutes ago, mptjelgin said:

I've not lost faith in law enforcement, but I've lived in rural areas much of my life where average response time was on the order of 30 minutes and sometimes more. In sparsely populated areas law enforcement is often spread out to the extent that they are more of an "after-the-fact" force.  Also, living in a rural area made gun ownership and use a very common thing, so relying on yourself for immediate protection from criminals wasn't considered unusual. Same with feral animals. You didn't call animal control, you just dealt with it. 

I can imagine that folks who have lived their lives in more urban areas where law enforcement response was (perhaps) only moments away might find this mindset concerning, but it really is second nature to many who lived further out. 

Agreed . 

Where we are now , used to take the law about 5 minutes to arrive and sometimes less . Now they use a central dispatch that is much farther away and the dispatchers know nothing of the area . There are more channels to go through . We'd be lucky to see law within a half hour and more likely 45 minutes or more .  

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7 minutes ago, mptjelgin said:

When I read postings of this nature, no matter on which forum, the first thing that has always come into my mind is: have the majority of us in this country lost all faith in ability of local, state and federal law enforcement agencies to protect us? 

In the words of the Duck Commander, "I am 911."

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3 hours ago, jc2 said:

When I read postings of this nature, no matter on which forum, the first thing that has always come into my mind is: have the majority of us in this country lost all faith in ability of local, state and federal law enforcement agencies to protect us?  

I hate to be the bearer of bad news but your idea of the police being there, in time, to protect you and your family is a little out of tune with the facts. The previous posters are just being realistic and have realized that they need to be the first line of defense, rather than hoping the police will arrive in time. 

Professor Don B. Kates, Jr., eminent civil rights lawyer and criminologist, summed it up like this in 1990. The numbers have changed some, but not the math:

Quote

Even if all 500,000 American police officers were assigned to patrol, they could not protect 240 million citizens from upwards of 10 million criminals who enjoy the luxury of deciding when and where to strike. But we have nothing like 500,000 patrol officers; to determine how many police are actually available for any one shift, we must divide the 500,000 by four (three shifts per day, plus officers who have days off, are on sick leave, etc.). The resulting number must be cut in half to account for officers assigned to investigations, juvenile, records, laboratory, traffic, etc., rather than patrol.

An op-ed article I read many years ago also exposes the brutal facts of life: It's a little over dramatic and harsh, but the sentiment is the same.

SUPREME COURT RULING: Police Have No Duty To Protect The General Public

JANUARY 28, 2013

People who don’t understand taking responsibility for your own safety often ask me why I wouldn’t just call the police to stop a crime instead of drawing a gun. Well for one, a great police response time would be 1-2 minutes, but most crimes take place in a matter of seconds. Two, police have no duty to protect me, or you.

Based on the headline of this article you might think this is an important new ruling, but it’s not. The court has kept this stance for over 30 years.

The Supreme Court has repeatedly ruled that police officers at all levels of the government have no duty to protect the citizens of this country.

It is the job of police officers to investigate crimes and arrest criminals.

We are on our own for protection.

While we are quite sure most police officers will help someone in need when required, just remember the next time you feel you might need protection that police officers have no duty to provide that to you.

Sources:
– Warren v. District of Columbia

As a cop, I have full faith in my brothers in blue. I know that they are there for all of us to call in our time of crisis. But I am also intelligent enough to know the bitter truth. If a maniac kicks in the door to your house, accosts you in your vehicle, in a parking lot as you walk to your vehicle or at the ATM machine, you have seconds to react. Do you want to defend yourself or make a phone call to someone that will do it for you....when they get there in 5 or 10 minutes? When the stove catches fire, do you use your fire extinguisher or just stand there and wait for the fire department?

If you are into horror movies or just want to understand why you need to be prepared to defend yourself then go read Warren v. District of Columbia. Do you believe that today, knowing what was coming their way, any one those women doesn't wish that she had been in possession of a firearm that night? And that knowing what they know now do you think they would have hesitated to use it? A previous poster in this thread says that killing another changes you forever. And he advocates against handgun usage. After reading "Warren" which position would you rather have "change you forever"? I know that Warren was an "extreme" case. But when that guy kicks in your door, do you want to wait to see if your case is going to be that extreme? 

THAT is why you need to be prepared, in whatever manner you think is best for you, to DO SOMETHING other than just calling 911 and hoping it works out alright. 

Edited by Big5er

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Big5er is right on. The law can help protect you but in reality they write the report after the fact. We have a duty to try to protect ourselves and our property so there report is shorter. It is like people who don't lock there doors should not complain when they get robbed.

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Law enforcement is just that...law enforcement.  It's not a protection force.  I have total faith in law enforcement.  If they can help you in a dire situation, they will.  But often they can't.  Even in an urban area where their presence is much denser, a cop isn't going to show up when some dude on a drug fueled bender breaks your door down in the middle of the night.  You can call 911 and hide in your closet...and hope...but some of us prefer to take a more active approach to our security.

And don't take that to mean I ever want to pull a gun on another human being.  I don't.  Few do and even fewer still feel that way after they have to.  Its a last resort when all else fails, like you locks, alarms, good judgement, common sense.  And so back to the OP.  I'd rather have it an never need it than need it and not have it.  I don't want the option of deadly force taken off the table just when I need it most.  I don't carry concealed.  I have been known to open carry when we lived in a rural area...people love to let their dogs run around harassing people and livestock :angry:

I have a pistol next to my bed and a shotgun in the closet.  I'll probably never use them.  And I'm probably safer out in the boondocks in an RV than I am in my bedroom at night.  There's a reason crime is more pervasive in urban areas...lot's of opportunity.  Not a lot of money in wandering around in the middle of nowhere hoping to stumble across an RV to rob.  But again, better to have it and not need it...

But I've never been truly threatened.  I've felt threatened and it turned out to be nothing.  I can promise you, when you think someone is knocking on your bedroom window at midnight and you feel compelled to grab your gun it's not fun (New Years Eve fireworks sound a lot like knocking :unsure:).  But how much worse would I have felt if I had nothing to protect myself and my family while I waited 25 minutes for the deputies to show up?

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10 hours ago, Cat Lady said:

Rich&Sylvia, unfortunately I have one of those horns that is just loud enough to piss people off...then they'll pull their gun, lol.

You need an upgrade.  Check this out:
153 db Kleinn 230 train horn - and let it run for about 5-minutes.  Ain't nobody gonna' hang by your camper for more than a few seconds.  (you might want to buy some ear plugs too)

http://kleinn.com/product/the-beast-230-triple-train-horns/

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11 hours ago, jc2 said:

When I read postings of this nature, no matter on which forum, the first thing that has always come into my mind is: have the majority of us in this country lost all faith in ability of local, state and federal law enforcement agencies to protect us?  There are bad people in this country, always has been and always will be but so many people seemed to think that by them allowing them to open carry or conceal carry a firearm will make it better?  Media hysteria along with instantaneous news access is not helping either.  News people, who I put in the same category as car-rv salesmen, will take a story that is "thrilling"  and report it until they find something better.  What I find disturbing/somewhat frightening are laws that allow a lot of people to obtain a open/concealed carry of permit sorts after completing almost no training what so ever.   

Unfortunately, a U.S. law enforcement agency cannot prevent a crime from occurring, they can-by law, only react after a crime is committed.  The popular slogan on many police cars, "to protect and serve" is somewhat misleading, they can only protect you from a crime in progress.

Getting back on topic; the decision to arm oneself is a serious matter, not to be taken lightly. I do agree with one talking point, not everyone should be allowed to carry a firearm; witness the recent mass shootings, and after-the-fact information about the shooter.

Even the TSA can only enforce regulations that reduce the odds of a crime, not prevent a crime.

Edited by Ray,IN

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We carry a .357 wheel gun, mostly because of it's simplicity to use in a stressful situation. 

My wife isn't sure that she could shoot to kill, I think I could.  To overcome this, I have the gun loaded with the first two rounds being snake shot, the next two are .38's and the last two are .357's.  If the problem keeps coming, the potential damage gets greater.  It's not the perfect answer, but it's what works for us.

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I protect myself by not carrying a gun since it would more likely be used against me than me use it on someone else. My primary means of protection is my good sense about where to be or not be. In all my years on this earth that has so far always been enough. I don't personally know anyone who has had to use a firearm of any type to protect themselves although I do know Nick Russell who used a door to protect himself from a guy holding Nick's own gun.

Linda Sand

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Where we live professional  help of any kind is usually hours away.  In fact a few years ago someone broke into our garage and took a number of items from our boat.  When I found it the criminal was long gone so the sheriff told me it would be a few days before someone would be in the area.  A plan to protect ones family is a personal responsibility.   That doesn't necessarily mean a gun if you are not willing and able to use it.  I believe a gun may be more of a problem than a solution for some but nonetheless we are on our own.  Waiting for a problem to devise a plan may not end well.  Where we live guns are common and most have them.  Many carry but most are not trying to be a hero and hope they never have to use a gun on another person.

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On ‎6‎/‎10‎/‎2017 at 7:55 PM, DunellenGuy said:

As my wife and I look forward to boondocking in some remote places, we've both confessed a concern about our personal security when far from civilization. We know that many full-timers carry a handgun that they can access if they feel threatened when calling for help isn't really an option. Maybe we've seen too many movies or read too many suspense novels, but there are bad people out there who might find a couple of retired RVers in the wilderness to be easy prey.

So, here's the question:
-FOR THOSE WHO CARRY: Have you ever had a time when RVing when you've felt the need to take out your gun for defense, even if you didn't have to shoot it? What happened?

-FOR THOSE WHO DON'T CARRY: Have you ever been in a remote setting and felt you were in danger from other human beings, and wished you had a gun for personal protection? How did it turn out?

We are in the first category and no, never had a situation that required drawing a gun.  Owning firearms and choosing to carry concealed is a personal choice.  If you feel comfortable and competent doing so, then exercise your right.  There is no doubt "bad people out there" and, should the unfortunate situation ever happen to any of us, better to have a means of defense and never need to use it as opposed to not having it and wishing you did. 

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I alway carry a .380 when on the road. Only time I thought I might need it was at a roadside park outside the Arkansas Welcome center at the Missouri line. Watching TV, got a very loud rap on the door, a 6'5 250 lb guy was standing there saying he was out of gas and stranded, I'm sure it was a scam, I gave him a 20 and he left. I had peace of mind he wasn't going to stab my tires, I didn't have to confront him.  I had my gun near my hand and by the bed all that night. 

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The "very loud rap on the door" is first clue "not a rv'er'r" - I have to remind my own family "I'm not downstairs in the rec room watching tv" when they knock...:lol: ... 

I don't want to jump through the hoops to carry one of my firearms in the USA as an alien foreign visitor with the "no guns aboard" (or is there? hmmmm)  foreign license plates - other methods will have to suffice... 

Main one is stay away from "civilization..." 

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5 minutes ago, noteven said:

The "very loud rap on the door" is first clue "not a rv'er'r" - I have to remind my own family "I'm not downstairs in the rec room watching tv" when they knock...:lol: ... 

I don't want to jump through the hoops to carry one of my firearms in the USA as an alien foreign visitor with the "no guns aboard" (or is there? hmmmm)  foreign license plates - other methods will have to suffice... 

Main one is stay away from "civilization..."

That word may have been the inspiration for the word 'oxymoron' . ;) 

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We carry a 26" long 12 gauge pump action shotgun and his and her pistols.  The 12 gauge carries 7 bird bird shot and 7 double 0 buck (yep twin tubes).  So far we have had no reason to use either to defend ourselves.  As an Eagle scout I firmly believe in the scout motto "Be Prepared".

Later,

J  

Edited by KodiakJack

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On 6/14/2017 at 1:28 PM, jc2 said:

Wonder how many hours of training, in states that allow open carry/concealed carry, are required before a person is allowed to do so?   4hrs, 8hrs, 16hrs? 

In Washington, Zero hours! Pretty amazing in a Liberal controlled state.

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I recently went to Glacier and did some hiking so I bought bear spray. Having not used it I decided to keep it by the front door of the RV. It won't kill someone but my guess is it will stop them in their tracks. $35 

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12 minutes ago, jpcoll01 said:

I recently went to Glacier and did some hiking so I bought bear spray. Having not used it I decided to keep it by the front door of the RV. It won't kill someone but my guess is it will stop them in their tracks. $35 

Just remember to shoot that stuff long range, downwind and keep the can out of the sun. ;)

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