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Ordering a new Volvo and could use some opinions


13speed

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18 hours ago, Av8r3400 said:

 

My 2012 730 has the D13 Ecco-Torque 425, non-overdrive iShift, 2.47 rear with 275/80R22.5 tires.  (Very similar spec to what 13speed is proposing)

Here is the PRM to speed ratios:

70 mph @ 1487 RPM
68 mph @ 1450 RPM
66 mph @ 1400 RPM
65 mph @ 1380 RPM
63 mph @ 1350 RPM
61 mph @ 1300 RPM 

 
 

Do you know what the top get ratio is on your truck?

 

 


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33 minutes ago, 13speed said:

The shortest WB you can get on a VNR400 is 173" and if I had the axle moved forward that would be more expensive then just putting the hitch where I want to in the first place........I would only do the hitch behind the axle as a last resort. 

Just wondering why you don't like the hitch aft of the drive axle?

Drive on..........(where is my axle and hitch.....today?)

 

 

97 Freightshaker Century Cummins M11-370 / 1350 /10 spd / 3:08 /tandem/ 20ft Garage/ 30 ft Curtis Dune toybox with a removable horse-haul-module to transport Dolly-The-Painthorse to horse camps and trail heads all over the Western U S

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28 minutes ago, Scrap said:

Um, no, the trucks were sold a year ago.  Don't forget the original questions:  Can the truck be built and hold under 12K in the front, and will a 13L engine put it over the tipping point?  It turned into a Weight Watchers thread because a 13K truck spec is a truck that has graduated from weight watchers.  A cornfed 16K is natural.

The four trucks were built and measured across a real scale for real dry numbers.  Look closer, you'll find that all are close to your spec, then that one is small engine, one is same spec big engine, and the last is similar spec that dropped out of Weight Watchers.  That'd be your three questions.  Add your numbers to them and it'll answer your questions.  Again, they are real world trucks, really sitting on the ground, somehow are 1000 lbs heavier than Volvo can do, and if you can make your payload fit them then you should have real good confidence that your truck spec will work.  Nothing worse than building a truck that won't scale then having to sell it and build another.  Seen it (and done it myself) many times.  Just trying to help avoid that.

Well Scrap that darn KWooper grill emblem must be made out of spent plutouuunumm or something....... this does beg the question .......how does Volvo make the same truck 1,000 lbs lighter? ?  ?

Or how does KWooper make the same truck 1,000 lbs heaverrrrr.....?  ?   ?

Drive on.......(who's scale is......off??)

97 Freightshaker Century Cummins M11-370 / 1350 /10 spd / 3:08 /tandem/ 20ft Garage/ 30 ft Curtis Dune toybox with a removable horse-haul-module to transport Dolly-The-Painthorse to horse camps and trail heads all over the Western U S

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14 minutes ago, Dollytrolley said:

Just wondering why you don't like the hitch aft of the drive axle?

Drive on..........(where is my axle and hitch.....today?)

 

 

A really long RV, and he wants to stay as short as possible.  The magic 65 foot rule that some states like to use.

Alie & Jim + 8 paws

2017 DRV Memphis 

BART- 1998 Volvo 610

Lil'ole 6cyl Cummins

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43 minutes ago, wild wolf products said:

Do you know what the top gear ratio is on your truck?

The rear end is 2.47 and 12th gear in my iShift is 1:1

 

Av8r3400
2012 Volvo VNL 730 D13 iShift & 2021 Grand Design Momentum 397TH

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I'd rather die trying to live - Than live trying not to die.   -Leonard Perry

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Just now, Alie&Jim's Carrilite said:

A really long RV, and he wants to stay as short as possible.  The magic 65 foot rule that some states like to use.

Alie & Jim.....I understand that 13 wants to stay short overall so that's why I ran the numbers with a drive axle moved forward 36" and the the hitch in the same location so his overall length stays unchanged from his original posted location. However the VNR 400 can not be ordered under 173" so.........seems like 13 has some conflicts with his desires and most of the hardware vendors in the program so far.

Now my question is still why is the hitch aft of the axle not desired?

I would listen to Scrap he has a LOT of new truck scars that he is willing to share and what he says about ordering a truck that does not fit the .......dream......is often the start of a expensive nightmare.......

One of the main features of a new truck is the "warren-teeeeee"  and hacking a bunch of hucks out of a new truck frame might be grounds for divorce from your Volvo gods......maybe.....maybe not?? 

I'd listen HARD to Scrap......he is not far off most of the time from where I stand.....

Drive on.......(Hardware and dreams sometimes don't .........mesh very well)

 

97 Freightshaker Century Cummins M11-370 / 1350 /10 spd / 3:08 /tandem/ 20ft Garage/ 30 ft Curtis Dune toybox with a removable horse-haul-module to transport Dolly-The-Painthorse to horse camps and trail heads all over the Western U S

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Perhaps a silly question....  Can the ET be gotten with the base un-assembled, so it can be put together inside the rails?  It would solve all the problems.

KW T-680, POPEMOBILE
Newmar X-Aire, VATICAN
Lots of old motorcycles, Moto Guzzi Griso and Spyder F3 currently in the front row
Young enough to play in the dirt as a retired farmer.
contact me at rickeieio1@comcast.net

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I do not want the hitch in the rear because,

1. Overall length not only for the 65" states but just to be as compact as possible with this big of a trailer.

2. I don't really like having 8K pushing down on the rear like a fulcrum. In the longer trucks with a lot more weight it might not be bad but in a lighter shorter one I just don't like it.

3. I think it looks better not to have a 10' gap between the truck and trailer. 

The ET angle iron pieces can be removed but the 5/8 plate that is the bottom of the hitch is too wide to fit from the top. In my case the huck bolts for the spring retainers have to be removed anyways so it really would not help much. 

The reason the truck is around 13K is because it has no 5th wheel, a small sleeper and one rear axle not because of super weight watching or magic tricks. Other wise it would be in the 16-17 range like my 630 is. 

Chris, Tracey, Aria & Lola

2018 Volvo VNR 400, D13 I-Shift

2018 NH 48' Majestic

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How much too wide is the base plate?      The rails are 10" flange to flange, if you dropped the hitch in at an angle would it clear?    Perhaps the base plate could be narrowed to fit, if you are using a 1 inch plate under the 5/8 plate it would support the hitch.    If the mounting holes get close use socket head screws to mount the hitch.    This is a very solvable situation.    It just takes a bit of imagination.

 

Steve 

2005 Peterbilt 387-112 Baby Cat 9 speed U-shift

1996/2016 remod Teton Royal Atlanta

1996 Kentucky 48 single drop stacker garage project

 catdiesellogo.jpg.e96e571c41096ef39b447f78b9c2027c.jpg Pulls like a train, sounds like a plane....faster than a Cheetah sniffin cocaine.   

 

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30 minutes ago, Steve from SoCal said:

How much too wide is the base plate?      The rails are 10" flange to flange, if you dropped the hitch in at an angle would it clear?    Perhaps the base plate could be narrowed to fit, if you are using a 1 inch plate under the 5/8 plate it would support the hitch.    If the mounting holes get close use socket head screws to mount the hitch.    This is a very solvable situation.    It just takes a bit of imagination.

 

Steve 

What is Henry's comfort level or.........un-comfort level with a take-apart-ET Sr????

Drive on.........(Hitch.....itch)

97 Freightshaker Century Cummins M11-370 / 1350 /10 spd / 3:08 /tandem/ 20ft Garage/ 30 ft Curtis Dune toybox with a removable horse-haul-module to transport Dolly-The-Painthorse to horse camps and trail heads all over the Western U S

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Just as a point of information.....on the lighter trucks...... My 610 with 182" wb was 14,100 lbs with no body on it (but full fuel, and a Trailersaver hitch, mud flaps, etc). Not here, nor there .... but shorter, lighter trucks are interesting :) 

Jack & Danielle Mayer #60376 Lifetime Member
Living on the road since 2000

PLEASE no PM's. Email me. jackdanmayer AT gmail
2016 DRV Houston 44' 5er (we still have it)
2022 New Horizons 43' 5er
2016 Itasca 27N 28' motorhome 
2019 Volvo 860, D13 455/1850, 236" wb, I-Shift, battery-based APU
No truck at the moment - we use one of our demo units
2016 smart Passion, piggyback on the truck
-------------------------------------------------------------------------
See our website for info on New Horizons 5th wheels, HDTs as tow vehicles, communications on the road, and use of solar power
www.jackdanmayer.com
Principal in RVH Lifestyles. RVH-Lifestyles.com

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2 minutes ago, Jack Mayer said:

Just as a point of information.....on the lighter trucks...... My 610 with 182" wb was 14,100 lbs with no body on it (but full fuel, and a Trailersaver hitch, mud flaps, etc). Not here, nor there .... but shorter, lighter trucks are interesting :) 

They are very interesting.....To bad you do not want to help me with mine:o

Chris, Tracey, Aria & Lola

2018 Volvo VNR 400, D13 I-Shift

2018 NH 48' Majestic

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7 minutes ago, 13speed said:

They are very interesting.....To bad you do not want to help me with mine:o

May not be an issue. But I would be checking with Volvo. And making sure removing Huck bolts will not void any warranty. Because if you were to have issues. And they could point fingers that that being the issue. Would be sad to see a new truck without a warranty.

Good luck with the truck.

Pete

 

 


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On 5/24/2017 at 2:24 PM, Steve from SoCal said:

How much too wide is the base plate?      The rails are 10" flange to flange, if you dropped the hitch in at an angle would it clear?    Perhaps the base plate could be narrowed to fit, if you are using a 1 inch plate under the 5/8 plate it would support the hitch.    If the mounting holes get close use socket head screws to mount the hitch.    This is a very solvable situation.    It just takes a bit of imagination.

 

Steve 

The angles come off but the plate is still to wide. All but the upper two spring retainer bolts have to be cut anyways so I don't think it will be to hard to slide it in from the back. 

Chris, Tracey, Aria & Lola

2018 Volvo VNR 400, D13 I-Shift

2018 NH 48' Majestic

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5 minutes ago, wild wolf products said:

May not be an issue. But I would be checking with Volvo. And making sure removing Huck bolts will not void any warranty. Because if you were to have issues. And they could point fingers that that being the issue. Would be sad to see a new truck without a warranty.

Good luck with the truck.

Pete

I have thought of that but I think they would have to show that what I did caused the issue. Also I do not think that they can void all of the trucks warranty because of one area. Secondary companies modify trucks all the time for all kinds of reasons and then they warranty that part but the rest is still covered by the truck manufacturer.

Chris, Tracey, Aria & Lola

2018 Volvo VNR 400, D13 I-Shift

2018 NH 48' Majestic

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6 minutes ago, 13speed said:

I have thought of that but I think they would have to show that what I did caused the issue. Also I do not think that they can void all of the trucks warranty because of one area. Secondary companies modify trucks all the time for all kinds of reasons and then they warranty that part but the rest is still covered by the truck manufacturer.

The Black Kodiak of mine. Was Black Listed and all warranty lost. Guy had a tuner on the engine. And the second engine. Chevy caught a trace of the tuner. All warranty was Void. Truck had 20,000 miles on it. The guy tried to right it. But lost as they could prove he caused the issues. 

I would have thought only the engine would have been taken away. But no the whole warranty was Void. Also it was finished up by a company. Truck did was a Cab and Chassis when it left the factory.

 

 


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1 hour ago, Jack Mayer said:

Just as a point of information.....on the lighter trucks...... My 610 with 182" wb was 14,100 lbs with no body on it (but full fuel, and a Trailersaver hitch, mud flaps, etc). Not here, nor there .... but shorter, lighter trucks are interesting :) 

Jack,

Just spitballing here......but maybe...... just maybe there might be a market for a ......"Jack-Bee-Nimble-Sport-Feather-Weight" HDT--RV tractor ?  ?

As 13 says, it is a bit out of the box but.........maybe some out-of-the-box folks might want a "HDT-Lite".......

I'll start a new thread and maybe slice and dice some of the example trucks that Scrap tossed into this thread........worse that could happen is that the spreadsheet get so light that it might float up into the Fantastic-Fan..........

Late tonite maybe I can toss some numbers around in a new thread.......

 

Drive on......("Jack-Bee-Nimble-Sport-Feather-Weight"HDT might be a kick in the pants.....)

 

97 Freightshaker Century Cummins M11-370 / 1350 /10 spd / 3:08 /tandem/ 20ft Garage/ 30 ft Curtis Dune toybox with a removable horse-haul-module to transport Dolly-The-Painthorse to horse camps and trail heads all over the Western U S

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DollyT,  As I think I said somewhere here I intend to build a short daily driver hauler at some point. Not everyone wants to carry a smart on deck, and a 630 makes a great daily driver, yet still can be used for overnight adventures, and for a "man cave". Been there, done that one. And the addition of the "modern amenities" these new Volvo's have make for a pretty luxurious ride. 

Putting the hitch forward is not really necessary...you can put it right at the axles and still have a very short and viable daily driver. That is where my 610 hitch was.....about 24" behind axle center line. In its forward position. 

I think you could build a pretty sweet daily driver with that setup and a variation of my new bed design.  Would not work for everyone, but it would be pretty flexible and usable.

Jack & Danielle Mayer #60376 Lifetime Member
Living on the road since 2000

PLEASE no PM's. Email me. jackdanmayer AT gmail
2016 DRV Houston 44' 5er (we still have it)
2022 New Horizons 43' 5er
2016 Itasca 27N 28' motorhome 
2019 Volvo 860, D13 455/1850, 236" wb, I-Shift, battery-based APU
No truck at the moment - we use one of our demo units
2016 smart Passion, piggyback on the truck
-------------------------------------------------------------------------
See our website for info on New Horizons 5th wheels, HDTs as tow vehicles, communications on the road, and use of solar power
www.jackdanmayer.com
Principal in RVH Lifestyles. RVH-Lifestyles.com

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OK, am I the only backyard fabricator that sees the simple solution here?  According to the drawing posted above, there is about an inch lacking on the baseplate from being able to slide the hitch assembly into the frame from the top at an angle.  It would look like it would be possible to narrow the baseplate of the hitch with a plasma cutter (or good old fashioned torch with a guide by 1/2" per side and it would drop in.  And yes, I understand the upper structure of the hitch may also be an issue which would require a better drawing.  For this discussion I am just looking at the baseplate and the supplied drawing.  The narrowed base can be compensated for by using a wider (and possibly heavier) angle iron mount.  If there is not enough base plate left for normal mounting bolts, simply weld the baseplate to the angles after everything is in place.  From what I understand this is a long term truck so removability should not be a issue.

I basically did the same thing mounting my trailersaver in my MDT.  I had the 5/8 mounting base plate cut to be as wide a possible and still drop between the rails at an angle as discussed.  Then bolted the mounting angles to the frame rails, and then took it to a professional welder (I'm a decend welder, but I know I suck at overhead) to weld the 5/8 mounting plate to the angles both top and bottom.  I have no doubt whatsoever my base plate will outpull the hitch or the truck itself.

Am I oversimplifying something here?  I know the hitch manufacturer could never sign off on such a modification for liability reasons if nothing else, but from a practical standpoint?

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1 hour ago, Hot Rod said:

OK, am I the only backyard fabricator that sees the simple solution here?  According to the drawing posted above, there is about an inch lacking on the baseplate from being able to slide the hitch assembly into the frame from the top at an angle.  It would look like it would be possible to narrow the baseplate of the hitch with a plasma cutter (or good old fashioned torch with a guide by 1/2" per side and it would drop in.  And yes, I understand the upper structure of the hitch may also be an issue which would require a better drawing.  For this discussion I am just looking at the baseplate and the supplied drawing.  The narrowed base can be compensated for by using a wider (and possibly heavier) angle iron mount.  If there is not enough base plate left for normal mounting bolts, simply weld the baseplate to the angles after everything is in place.  From what I understand this is a long term truck so removability should not be a issue.

I basically did the same thing mounting my trailersaver in my MDT.  I had the 5/8 mounting base plate cut to be as wide a possible and still drop between the rails at an angle as discussed.  Then bolted the mounting angles to the frame rails, and then took it to a professional welder (I'm a decend welder, but I know I suck at overhead) to weld the 5/8 mounting plate to the angles both top and bottom.  I have no doubt whatsoever my base plate will outpull the hitch or the truck itself.

Am I oversimplifying something here?  I know the hitch manufacturer could never sign off on such a modification for liability reasons if nothing else, but from a practical standpoint?

I just sent a email to Henry based on what you said. I cannot see why 1/2 inch on either side would compromise the integrity of the hitch. There is plenty of metal left to bolt the two together securely. He makes them to order so I do not think it would be difficult for him to adjust the size a bit. 

Chris, Tracey, Aria & Lola

2018 Volvo VNR 400, D13 I-Shift

2018 NH 48' Majestic

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I guess I don't articulate so well on this forum, my suggestion to narrow the base plate went unnoticed.    

The idea of "light trucks" is not new or novel but when I started threads about this subject it was perceived as alien.    I may not be a prolific poster here and, I don't have a Volvo so must be too dumb to take seriously.    I will refrain from trying to offer solutions from here on out.    

 

Steve   

2005 Peterbilt 387-112 Baby Cat 9 speed U-shift

1996/2016 remod Teton Royal Atlanta

1996 Kentucky 48 single drop stacker garage project

 catdiesellogo.jpg.e96e571c41096ef39b447f78b9c2027c.jpg Pulls like a train, sounds like a plane....faster than a Cheetah sniffin cocaine.   

 

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7 hours ago, Steve from SoCal said:

I guess I don't articulate so well on this forum, my suggestion to narrow the base plate went unnoticed.    

The idea of "light trucks" is not new or novel but when I started threads about this subject it was perceived as alien.    I may not be a prolific poster here and, I don't have a Volvo so must be too dumb to take seriously.    I will refrain from trying to offer solutions from here on out.    

 

Steve   

It's not just you Steve.  I posted a similar idea near the top of this page too.

KW T-680, POPEMOBILE
Newmar X-Aire, VATICAN
Lots of old motorcycles, Moto Guzzi Griso and Spyder F3 currently in the front row
Young enough to play in the dirt as a retired farmer.
contact me at rickeieio1@comcast.net

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9 hours ago, Steve from SoCal said:

I guess I don't articulate so well on this forum, my suggestion to narrow the base plate went unnoticed.    

The idea of "light trucks" is not new or novel but when I started threads about this subject it was perceived as alien.    I may not be a prolific poster here and, I don't have a Volvo so must be too dumb to take seriously.    I will refrain from trying to offer solutions from here on out.    

 

Steve   

Sorry Sir, I did see your post. Sometimes posts in a very active thread like this can come so fast it can be hard to keep up. Hot Rod, rickeieio and you all said similar things in a short period of time and I just quoted one. I did however tell Henry that a few different people had suggested the idea in my email to him last night. I will post what he says when I hear from him. 

Chris, Tracey, Aria & Lola

2018 Volvo VNR 400, D13 I-Shift

2018 NH 48' Majestic

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