Electric problem

[Al F]

Oldjohn,

 

You (and Kirk) have an impressive amount of knowledge,,,I am absorbing it all and if nothing else, learning an awful lot about RV electricity. I'm smart enough to not get in over my head, but curious enough to want to learn more by going hands on (with the power OFF of course).

 

Trucken,

 

You are correct also. I do that, except it only lasts for hours, not days!

 

Al,

 

Good point about the fridge-need to turn it off completely maybe to truly gauge things. Otherwise it defaults to propane.

 

Thanks all,,,truly enjoying expanding my knowledge.

I'm sorry. I wasn't clear about unplugging the fridge. It wasn't about the amount of power the fridge was using.

 

If the fridge outlet is beyond the bathroom outlet (you determine that by tripping the GFI outlet in the bathroom and verifying the fridge turns off or goes to gas operation). Now when you plug the heater into the fridge outlet and IF you don't see the voltage drop then you know the bathroom outlet is not the problem. It could be the fridge outlet or the wires leaving the fridge outlet or the wiring beyond the fridge.

[tinstartrvlr]

Al,

 

Good thought-will give it a try. I am beginning to think it is simply a matter of not beefy enough wiring with too many outlets and the fridge on too small a circuit. Have contacted the MFG to ask them about it. After so much feedback here I think I will be able to clearly convey the problem to the MFG, and see what they suggest. It is under warranty, after all.

 

Thanks

[oldjohnt]

Good evening tinstar, to your comment " I am beginning to think it is simply a matter of not beefy enough wiring with too many outlets and the fridge on too small a circuit"

 

Unfortunately, many RV's come out of the factory with at least some (or most) 14 Gauge (15 Amp) wire protected by a 15 Amp circuit breaker for convenience outlets, unlike a home with 12 Gauge (20 amp) wire, so I don't see yours as necessarily deficient or thats necessarily a warranty issue. HOWEVER if there's excess voltage drop caused by a poor connection or poor materials or workmanship NOW THAT COULD BE A WARRANTY ISSUE.

 

Similar, I don't see a fridge outlet as necessarily on "too small a circuit" if it happens to be 14 Gauge wire either, as its a relatively (as compared to a heater) light load. Likewise, ifffffffffffff the wiring was all good and there were absolutely NO poor resistive connections, due to the relatively in an RV short length of wire runs, even if you put a 12 amp load (and no other loads) out at the very last receptacle using 14 gauge wire, while sure theres going to be some voltage drop, I don't see it as overly excessive UNLESS there was one or more poor resistive connections!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! I still think somewhere in that long circuit theres a loose/burned/carboned resistive connection, or if all the receptacles are daisy chained and all are the cheap stab type NOT screw terminals, the sum of all voltage drops way out on the end (if thats where heater is plugged) could by then indeed be excessive!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

 

HOWEVER I do consider it as poor engineering (as compared to how I was trained and practiced under the NEC) to have allllllllllllllllllllllll (you spoke of 10) the outlets in an RV on a single branch circuit, and again, that's NOT how most were wired of the many many I owned or bought and sold (though no real small units) as they often had two or more outlet branch circuits (PLUS one for AC or Microwave etc)

 

Those cheap (if yours is so equipped) plug/push in wiring devices and outlets as opposed to residential or commercial types with screw down terminals could be part of your problem and if so or they are better quality screw terminal devices yet a loose/burned resistive connection is the cause of excess voltage drop due to poor quality installation, I SEE THAT AS A POTENTIAL WARRANTY ISSUE.

 

Nuff said, you have heard from all sorts of good techs and engineer types and experienced RV ers so you have the info to make an informed decision.

 

John T

[Al F]

If it was too small wire size followed by to many outlets, you would see very little voltage drop when the heater was plugged into the outlets closest to the CB, followed by an increasing greater voltage drop the farther you get away from the CG. In fact with a good meter, even with 12 gauge wire and a 12amp load you could start at the first outlet and measure and see a small decrease in voltage at each outlet the farther away from the CB you get. The thing is, this voltage decrease is small, more like 1/4 to 1/2 volt per outlet(maybe less if good solid wire connections). From your description no matter which outlet you plug into, other than the bathroom, you see a significant drop. I don't remember the exact numbers, but I think it was like 6-8 volts on all outlets.

[Kirk W]

I am absorbing it all and if nothing else, learning an awful lot about RV electricity. I'm smart enough to not get in over my head, but curious enough to want to learn more by going hands on (with the power OFF of course).

Let me suggest that it is time for you to invest in a reasonably good meter ang. It doesn't take a lot of practice to learn to use one and you will be able to trouble shoot at any suspect location. d to stop depending upon the very questionable one that you are using. Amazon has a wide range of them and some acceptable ones cost less than $20. If it were me, I' plan to spend more in the range of $30 and my personal meter is much more expensive than that, but I choose one like it to get a degree of accuracy that most amateurs would never need or use. For most purposes a meter with a +/- 10% accuracy if very acceptable. You can also find one for a very modest price at Harbor Freight or at Northern Tool which will serve you well in your RV.

 

I may be only a technician, but I did manage to earn a living with my tools and a little knowledge over many years and I still manage occasionally.

[tinstartrvlr]

Thank you again EVERYONE!

 

I now have tons of info to digest, and as Trucken suggested, I am stepping away for awhile while I ponder it all.

 

Then I will know where to begin...

 

Hands down this is the best RV forum out there!

[SCClockDr]

MnTom,,,sounds good, but a thought just occurred to me. Plugging in a high draw appliance at the gfi seems ok, but is it? Do I need to check from the box to the outlet? I can't figure out which fuse (not breaker) goes to the gfi as it's not labeled. The reason I ask is that I have no way to check for voltage drop at the first outlet, being the gfi, when it's being used...unless the meter would show the drop on the downside of the circuit, which it doesn't....

You can check the voltage at the empty half of the GFI or any of the other outlets. If no drop is noted then it is safe to conclude the pedestal to the GFI is good. A loose connection is indeed a serious issue due to the heat generated which can lead to fire. For me 6 weeks delay is unacceptable for a hazardous issue. If you have no other warranty service options, I would purchase a quality GCFI receptacle and 9 quality receptacles and replace them all. I would also note where each receptacle is in the daisy chain and Ptouch label them.

I would then demand the dealer split the kitchen off with a 20amp breaker 12 awg wired circuit to a separate GCFI receptacle and at least 1 sub receptacle. Think coffee maker & toaster etc. That I might wait 6 weeks for.

15 amp 14awg wired circuits are iffy for heavy loads.

A 12-15KW space heater would never get plugged into a 15 amp outlet anywhere I dwelld.

[oldjohnt]

Yo Clock Doctor, can you restore my Seth Thomas Weight clock???????????? It runs BUT only when set off level on the shelf grrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrr

 

"15 amp 14awg wired circuits are iffy for heavy loads"

 

I agree, if you have a 1500 watt space heater that draws 12.5 amps at 120 volts, THATS SLIGHTLY OVER 80% OF 15 AMPS and NOT what I would recommend or design for as its I believe considered a continuous current draw (no warranty would have to check the definition) ESPECIALLY if the receptacles are the cheap stab type as opposed to screw down terminals grrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrr

 

Unfortunately many RV's use 15 amp 14 gauge wire circuitry and tons of folks plug 1500 watt heaters into them to run all night. And this thread concerns like alllllllllllllll 10 RV receptacles (including fridge I think???) on a single 15 amp branch circuit hmmmmmmmmmmmmmmm Lets see, 10 outlets with each dropping lets say 1/2 volt, yields a 5 volt drop at the last in the string..............Lets plug a 1500 watt heater there YEAH RIGHT

 

Yall take care now

 

John T