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Black & Gray Water Option


marytaz

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OK. If you don't have anything yet you can make an Artic Pack (or whatever the particular mfg. calls it) mandatory. That should include dual pane windows, extra insulation, and heated tanks at a minimum.

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OK. If you don't have anything yet you can make an Artic Pack (or whatever the particular mfg. calls it) mandatory. That should include dual pane windows, extra insulation, and heated tanks at a minimum.

So would that, in addition to having a fully enclosed bottom take care of freezing issues?

Mary (in CA)...following the dream to Idaho...

 

“Home is the place where, when you have to go there, They have to take you in.”
Robert Frost

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Mary....I would also consider completely enclosing the bottom of the RV in with insulated skirting and place a heater down there as well to keep it all above freezing.

 

Brrr....I simply would not do this...lol. Here in Alberta we get down to -40 and living in an RV would not be any fun at all.

<p>....JIM and LINDA......2001 American Eagle 40 '.towing a GMC Sierra 1500 4X4 with RZR in the rear. 1999 JEEP Cherokee that we tow as well.

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Not completely, but it is a good start. There is also the fresh water hose to keep from freezing unless you operate off your fresh water tank. Condensation can also be a problem, depending on the rig, and even the Arctic pack may not be enough by itself, depending on the quality of the mfg. Basically the story is, RV's are not made for severely cold weather. Can it be done? Yes. Is it easy or any fun? No.

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I'm wondering, would pvc pipe with the hoses and insulation wrapped around it work? I use that here for my garden hose when we get below temps (very usual, but it does happen).

Mary (in CA)...following the dream to Idaho...

 

“Home is the place where, when you have to go there, They have to take you in.”
Robert Frost

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I'm wondering, would pvc pipe with the hoses and insulation wrapped around it work? I use that here for my garden hose when we get below temps (very usual, but it does happen).

 

Not without heat tape on it as well.

2000 Volvo 770, 500HP/1650FP Cummins N14 and 10 Speed Autoshift 3.58 Rear 202" WB, 2002 Teton Aspen Royal 43 Foot, Burgman 650 Scooter

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Did you not say that you now life in CA? Unless that is on the top of a mountain or somewhere in the Sierra Nevada's you don't really experience what we are speaking of. I'm not sure where in ID you are going, but most of it experiences times when the temperatures go well below 0° and the high temperatures do not get above freezing for days at a time. In such situation you will need far more than some insulation a PVC. Mobile home supply stores sell heat tape that is designed for this purpose but you must use care in applying it to an RV water hose as you can melt the hose if not done right. Then you need enough insulation to prevent the heat loss that comes with very low temperatures for days at a time. You will also need something to protect the sewer hose in case you need to dump during one of these cold spells.

 

If you would share just where in ID you plan to stay we could get you better information about the extremes of temperature you may expect. The winter that we spent in Blackfoot, ID we experienced one night that the temperature went lower than -20° and times when no high temperature would get above freezing for several days to a week. You could also see this sort of weather information by using the internet.

Good travelin !...............Kirk

Full-time 11+ years...... Now seasonal travelers.
Kirk & Pam's Great RV Adventure

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According to Weather Underground it has gotten as cold as -23 during December there. That's not a place I would want to spend the winter in an RV.

2000 Volvo 770, 500HP/1650FP Cummins N14 and 10 Speed Autoshift 3.58 Rear 202" WB, 2002 Teton Aspen Royal 43 Foot, Burgman 650 Scooter

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From best_places.com

 

Month ~~~~~~Temp.(min) ~~~~~Temp. (max)~ Temp.(avg)~~~~~Precipitation

January~~~~~~ -6°F ~~~~~~~~~~53°F~~~~~ 29°F ~~~~~~~~0.6"

February~~~~~~ 9°F ~~~~~~~~~~59°F ~~~~~34°F~~~~~~~~ 0.5"

March ~~~~~~~~18°F ~~~~~~~~~72°F ~~~~~~43°F~~~~~~~ 1.2"

April ~~~~~~~~~~19°F ~~~~~~~~~86°F ~~~~~~50°F ~~~~~~~0.6"

May ~~~~~~~~~~28°F ~~~~~~~~~96°F ~~~~~~61°F ~~~~~~~1.1"

June ~~~~~~~~~37°F ~~~~~~~~~102°F ~~~~~~68°F ~~~~~~~0.9"

July ~~~~~~~~~~48°F ~~~~~~~~108°F ~~~~~~~79°F ~~~~~~~0.1"

August ~~~~~~~~41°F ~~~~~~~~104°F ~~~~~~~74°F ~~~~~~~0.2"

September ~~~~~32°F ~~~~~~~~~98°F ~~~~~~~63°F ~~~~~~~0.4"

October ~~~~~~~14°F ~~~~~~~~~84°F ~~~~~~~49°F ~~~~~~~0.7"

November ~~~~~~10°F ~~~~~~~~~73°F ~~~~~~~38°F ~~~~~~~1.0"

December ~~~~~~-4°F ~~~~~~~~~58°F ~~~~~~~27°F ~~~~~~~1.7"

 

Historical Wiser, ID weather information...

Good travelin !...............Kirk

Full-time 11+ years...... Now seasonal travelers.
Kirk & Pam's Great RV Adventure

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What can I say. I have ice water in my veins. I'm not concerned about my comfort ability. It's going to happen; just determining the logistics of how.

Mary (in CA)...following the dream to Idaho...

 

“Home is the place where, when you have to go there, They have to take you in.”
Robert Frost

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Nobody is telling you that it can't be done. What we are telling you is that it will not be easy, it may not be very comfortable, and equally importantly it will be expensive. Wintering in Wichita, KS our friends were using an average of 100# of propane each week in addition to the 2 electric heaters they had to keep their RV warm in the coldest weather. You are looking at a smaller RV than they had but will experience more cold weather. I'd expect that you will need to budget a lot more than you my be planning for keeping warm.

 

It is important is for you to understand what it is that you are attempting before you start. If the RV is to be permanently set up, you can improve things a great deal by using substantial, insulated skirting under the RV. You will also need to do advance planning to deal with the other issues folks are bringing up here. There is a lot of good experience in those who are trying to help you so please pay attention to the advice offered. We all do what we feel that we must, so advance planning is vital. :)

Good travelin !...............Kirk

Full-time 11+ years...... Now seasonal travelers.
Kirk & Pam's Great RV Adventure

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Oh, I know, Kirk. I am getting a lot of advice here and I don't discount any of it. Everyone has been extremely helpful and I am very grateful!

 

I did speak with my brother and he likes the macerator idea. I'd only need about a 50' hose to make it work. :)

 

I'm weighing the option of spending more $ up front vs. spending less and doing some of the work myself. Cost isn't much of an issue, but $ is $. I've looked at some of the higher end models on-line and they do have higher r factors with enclosed underbelly and double pane windows, but they also have many things I don't need and won't use. It's disappointing, for example, to see a trailer that has an outdoor kitchen. Waste of space and $ for me. I'm planning on taking all the notes I can next Saturday at the RV show and grabbing any information I can. If I purchase a used trailer that's in good condition (that's 1-5 y/o), then the new ones out today would be one of the used ones I would look at in 5 years. It's a toss-up and I really don't know which way I'll go since everything right now is just research. And lots of things change in 5 years time.

 

One option is to keep it on wheels and move it into my brothers garage during the colder months. Or, disconnect everything and move into my brother's house during that time. I'm just trying to research every possibility. I'd rather not depend on my brother so much, even though I know he would gladly do anything for me.

 

The only thing for certain is the location right now. Good or bad, that won't change. :)

Mary (in CA)...following the dream to Idaho...

 

“Home is the place where, when you have to go there, They have to take you in.”
Robert Frost

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From everything you've described, please have a good, hard look a Roughneck. The are rated to -40 as is and can reach -50 with extra belly foamed insulation.

 

The only others I would touch are Bigfoot and Artic Fox and they won't be as comfortable.

 

The Roughnecks are designed for the use of a supervisor at a well site. Rough access roads, light enough to tow behind a 1-ton truck. Tons of insulation including the tank area. Big tanks.

 

If a Drilling Foreman can be comfortable in one at -45, you should be fine in Idaho.

 

Suggest you don't buy any of the normal RV junk you will see at the shows. It isn't just R values, you need the total package designed and proven to work for extended periods of extreme cold.

 

Geo

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Thanks, Geo. It looks like the newest Roughneck is out of my maximum available length though, which is 29'. I'll keep a look on this one though for any shorter ones.

Mary (in CA)...following the dream to Idaho...

 

“Home is the place where, when you have to go there, They have to take you in.”
Robert Frost

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What kind of adapter would that be? I don't think that creating another sewer cleanout would be an option as it would require a permit, and also expensive.

 

Just take your cleanout plug and hose to the store, the folks there will be able to pick out the parts needed to connect the two. You might also check sites like campingworld.com for something pre-made but it will likely cost more.

 

Heating pads: http://www.campingworld.com/category/holding-tank-accessories/1370

 

Hose connector: http://www.campingworld.com/shopping/item/rotating-grey-water-bayonet-fitting/31208

and: http://www.campingworld.com/shopping/item/ez-coupler-90-degrees-bayonet-fitting/27867

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Since, as you say, you won't be buying for 5-6 more years, it would be a good idea to print this information since it is likely that the thread will be gone by then. There is also the possibility that both the available manufacturers and the options available to you will change dramatically between now and then. While I applaud your desire to do some advance planning, I would not worry too much about the details at this point. A lot will change in the next few years. When you get closer to actually buying something it would be a good idea to come back to the forum and ask the same questions again. An even better idea would be to continue to participate in the forum every day and soak up as much information from reading other peoples questions and answers as you can. If you do that, by the time you are actually ready to do something you will be an expert!

2000 Volvo 770, 500HP/1650FP Cummins N14 and 10 Speed Autoshift 3.58 Rear 202" WB, 2002 Teton Aspen Royal 43 Foot, Burgman 650 Scooter

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Thanks, Rif! That's my plan. Good thinking on the print out. I also found another forum (4 season campers) http://www.4scf.com/ that I've joined to glean info from. I've gotten wonderful information from here and I am so very grateful to all of you. I doubt I'll ever be an expert, but at least I won't feel so lost when the time comes. :)

Mary (in CA)...following the dream to Idaho...

 

“Home is the place where, when you have to go there, They have to take you in.”
Robert Frost

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Mary, you seem to be a long range planner and that is good. Be sure the laws/covenants/restrictions in your brothers city/county allow an inhabited trailer on his lot. Some places severely restrict the use of your own land. Red tape can foul up the best of plans. Wish you the best. Charlie

Don't ever tell a soldier that he doesn't understand the cost of war.

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Does it snow there? Are you going to have to dig through snow to find that cleanout?

 

Do be aware that you'll need to pack up your macerator hose between uses. Don't leave it out to freeze.

 

Linda Sand

Blog: http://sandcastle.sandsys.org/

Former Rigs: Liesure Travel van, Winnebago View 24H, Winnebago Journey 34Y, Sportsmobile Sprinter conversion van

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FloJet macerator costs more than Sewer Solution but the FloJet has a positive set of grinder blades versus a water jet to break up solids.

 

Also the FloJet pumping action is stronger. We have pumped 275' on a slight downhill with 3/4" hose.

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Also the FloJet pumping action is stronger. We have pumped 275' on a slight downhill with 3/4" hose.

I've pumped 200' (two sections of 100' 3/4" hoses) with at least a 5' head. But you have to be careful not to overheat the pump....

 

The macerator is a better solution than the Sewer Solution for remote dumping, IMO. For normal dumping I use a macerator but the Sewer Solution would work fine.

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The Sewer Solution works as long as you have plenty of water and decent water pressure. When boondocking we use our macerator to pump our tanks into a portable tank. We then take the portable tank to the dump station. I see many people doing this in places like Q. A Sewer Solution would be a bad choice for this.

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