Verizon to disconnect unlimited data user who use "extraodinary" amounts of data.

[chiefneon]

Howdy!

 

http://www.droid-life.com/2016/07/20/verizon-unlimited-data-rip-tetherers/

 

Looks like Verizon is once again going to do away with unlimited data means of disconnecting those they deam use to much data, but they don't say how much is to much.

 

Verizon has forced us to remain in a grandfathered unlimited 3G data plan not allowing us to upgrade to 4g without going into a data plan. We still use 80 to over 100 gbs a month of data. So I'm guessing they will also use this to force us out of our unlimited 3G plan. Glad we decided to improve our coverage as fulltime RVer's not long ago by switching our phones and tablets to AT&T unlimited data by bundling with DirecTV. So now if we lose our Verizon MiFi 3G unlimited we have a fall back plan.

 

"Happy Trails"

Chiefneon

[LFDR3116]

Excessive users should be disconnected. We are on our computers ( 2 of us with a computer each) at least 8-10 hours per day and we use 12 G per month between the 2 of us. We do not stream. The price that we pay is artificially high to support everyone using the ungodly amounts under the unlimited plans. Many are running businesses and passing the costs on to the individual users. Another words, we who don't use our devices to stream movies or run a business are paying artificially high prices per gig to help support what you do. You should pay your own way.

[chirakawa]

The price that we pay is artificially high to support everyone using the ungodly amounts under the unlimited plans. Many are running businesses and passing the costs on to the individual users. Another words, we who don't use our devices to stream movies or run a business are paying artificially high prices per gig to help support what you do. You should pay your own way.

 

The price you pay for data has nothing to do with what others are using or paying. It is set by the marketplace. Verizon charges as much for data as the competition will allow. However, you are thinking exactly what Verizon wants you to think. Truth is, they could do away with unlimited data plans tomorrow and your cost wouldn't go down a penny. Three years ago, 22% of Verizon plans had unlimited data. Today, that number is less than .5%. Did your data cost reduce by 50%?

 

What do you consider an "ungodly amount" of data?

[shaman52]

In reading the article and the comments. It looks like non-steamers should not be on Verizon's "excessive Use" list. I read it they are after heavy movie streamers and other heavy data users.

Do not stream movies so my monthly data usage should not trigger their threshold, whatever they decide on.

 

Saw several lawyer type comments that seems to indicate that Verizon could be brought into state small claim court by unlimited data users. If the threshold for action is set too low,Verizon could spend big bucks defending in states small claim courts against each individual. Hope the bean counters and lawyers convince management to set a reasonably high excessive use trigger amount. So most of us unlimited data users would not have to worry. My guess is 100G triggers. Time will tell.

[Technomadia]

We've been tracking this very closely since the story broke this time yesterday. Here's our constantly updated article as we find new details:

 

Breaking News: Verizon Moving Against Unlimited Plans?

 

At present time, both CNet and ArsTechinica have Verizon quotes that the targeted customers are 'well in excess of 100GB'.

 

- Cherie

[TXiceman]

60 to 80 gB per month seems to be very excessive. My wife and I generally stay around 6 to 8 GB per month, but we do not stream movies, music of videos.

 

The high volume users gobble up band width and make it hard on the normal users.

 

Ken.

[Max Signal]

Someone in the know told me a few years ago , eventually data we will be billed like Utilities. By your usage . Seems fair.

[Pat & Pete]

Someone in the know told me a few years ago , eventually data we will be billed like Utilities. By your usage . Seems fair.

 

I really don't see why it isn't that way now . Every other commodity seems to be .

 

" Pigs get fat . Hogs get slaughtered . "

[docj]

60 to 80 gB per month seems to be very excessive.

 

 

With all due respect, that's very much "one person's opinion." My view is that we pay for an unlimited plan and hotspot use and, therefore, we're entitled to use it. At our present location with an exceptionally fast Verizon signal our streaming usage is high because pretty much everything is HD. So we're running 100-150 GB/mo depending on what we watch. That's the result of watching an hour or two of streaming video on most nights.

[LFDR3116]

3 years ago everyone wasn't streaming everything and using 75+ gigs per month. The average monthly usage was much much lower than it is today.

[chirakawa]

Thirty years ago nobody was streaming anything and cellphones were in their infancy. The world changes. The electronic world changes faster. Your world changes at the pace you choose.

 

Verizon sold unlimited data plans as unlimited data plans. Then, they sold cellphones capable of connecting up to 10 internet devices to. Next, they developed applications which allowed one to stream football games, movies, television, etc. and encouraged us all to use them. As the internet grew, Verizon realized that selling data is their cash cow and they regret selling unlimited data plans. Of course, they want to recall all those plans and convert those customers to piecemeal data plans. It's not about limited bandwidth or a lack of available data. The technology is keeping up, 5G cellular is just around the corner. It's about money. They've made several changes to their policies to encourage people to give up their unlimited data plans.

 

That's Verizon's privilege. It may work for them. It may backfire on them.

 

I, for one, will hang on to my unlimited data plan. I use about 10-12 gbs per month and I enjoy the freedom of not worrying about how much I've used. If I decide to use more data, I will. If Verizon takes my unlimited data plan away, then I'll re-assess my situation and look at the available options. What I won't do is cry on a public forum about what other people have and I don't have.

 

Don't criticize me for having the foresight to enroll in unlimited data when Verizon offered it, just because you didn't.

[docj]

3 years ago everyone wasn't streaming everything and using 75+ gigs per month. The average monthly usage was much much lower than it is today.

 

3 years ago streaming on cellular was difficult in many locations. Furthermore, there was a lot less content available to stream.

[Pat & Pete]

Everything changes , always .

[Newt]

Excessive usage is who ever uses more than you do!

 

Newt

[JC and Angie]

Excessive users should be disconnected. We are on our computers ( 2 of us with a computer each) at least 8-10 hours per day and we use 12 G per month between the 2 of us. We do not stream. The price that we pay is artificially high to support everyone using the ungodly amounts under the unlimited plans. Many are running businesses and passing the costs on to the individual users. Another words, we who don't use our devices to stream movies or run a business are paying artificially high prices per gig to help support what you do. You should pay your own way.

So, because we use Netflix and stream movies we should be disconnected. Why???

I pay my bill and play by the rules as I signed up for. Maybe you should reconsider your contract and not force others to " come down to your standards of data usage.

 

JUST MY OPINION

 

Have a good night and I'm login onto nexflix and watch a movie.

[mrschwarz]

Excessive is a subjective term. The rates Verizon charges are excessive, in my opinion. Is there a scientific definition for excessive? Is there a meter that measures when you reach excessive? Unlimited is an objective term. It has an absolute meaning. You can't have something that is a little unlimited. It either is or it isn't. Excessive is subject to someone's opinion. You know what opinions are like, right?

 

You cannot compare selling metered bandwidth like electricity. When a user consumes electricity, it must be generated somewhere. Fuel must be burned. When a user consumes bandwidth, nothing is generated. Once the infrastructure is built, it doesn't cost more or less if no one uses it. When you get an electric bill, there is a fixed service charge and a usage charge. Allegedly, the fixed charge is to maintain the infrastructure that is used to deliver the power. When it comes to wireless service, we pay the service charge for the infrastructure.

 

The cost for delivering bandwidth is falling. The cost we pay for it is rising. Ain't competition great?

[Max Death]

What you are paying for when you pay for service through any carrier is very simply a number of things.

The cost of developing and maintaining the infrastructure needed to generate that wireless signal.

This includes such things as building new towers, replacing failing equipment. Electricity to power those towers 24/7, even backup generators. Technicians and clerical staff, even the CEO. Then there are the commercials needed to convince you to use one company over another.

Prices and wages keep going up so prices for data need to go up. Hard to charge more for data if you have a grandfathered price for unlimited data.

As has already been stated we are finding more ways to increase our data usage so this means enlarging the infrastructure to handle this. More cost that can't be passed along to the consumer if you have a grandfathered plan.

The simple solution is to try and find a way to drop the grandfathered plans without landing in lengthly court battles which may or may not be won.

The bad news is use your data the way you want but be prepared because the days of the grandfathered unlimited data are numbered.

 

Just my opinion yours may very

[Jack Mayer]

60 to 80 gB per month seems to be very excessive. My wife and I generally stay around 6 to 8 GB per month, but we do not stream movies, music of videos.

 

The high volume users gobble up band width and make it hard on the normal users.

 

Ken.

You may feel that way....but I pay for and use 40 gig a month, pretty much every month. I do watch "some" youtube videos, for educational purposes, but I don't watch movies, TV or any other typical streaming usage. Including music. My 40 gig is typically all "regular" data. Just because YOU don't use that much data does not mean others do not....and I don't mean streaming.

[GlennWest]

We find this is true of us also. We have a 40 gig plan with At&t. They were offering double data when Millicom went out so we had to go with someone. Pay for 20 get 40. We don't stream movies. A few youtube checking out stuff, educational.

[ms60ocb]

I'm on the side for Metered data and time of use.

MRSCHWARZ wrote "When a user consumes bandwidth, nothing is generated" That is a true statement but the more one's and zero's sent means the coverage area of that cell phone tower is a smaller area.

With Windows & I used 8-10 G per month and then Windows 10 came along and some months I have problems staying below 15G (ads ads and more ads).

I use a smart phone and Hot Spot for data, I very aware of the time of day that people stream data. Right at this moment on my smart phone (Verizon) I'm at 1x and was at 3G earlier this morning and saw 4G yesterday afternoon.

Clay presently in NE Minnesota

[JRP]

""...

You cannot compare selling metered bandwidth like electricity. ... Once the infrastructure is built, it doesn't cost more or less if no one uses it. ...

The cost for delivering bandwidth is falling. The cost we pay for it is rising. Ain't competition great?""

 

Actually its much better to compare it to a water delivery system. The overall internet consists of several interconnected layers of networks; a local network, a regional network, a national network and the main internet backbone. Each of those layers is sized for the expected capacity needs and when the capacity is exceeded on a regular basis, significant costs are incurred to upgrade that section. Just like a water delivery system is designed with different pipe sizes to handle the expected flow from the source to the main to the region to the individual neighborhoods. The 6" pipe feeding water to a subdivision can only carry so much water. If everyone in the subdivision turns on their sprinklers, their showers and their washing machines at the same time, the flow and pressure to all of them goes down and that 6" pipe has to be replaced with an 8" pipe if this condition continues. Its exactly the same for each layer of the internet. If you're in a big city area that has fat bandwidth pipes connecting you upstream to the Backbone, you may not feel the impact of 1000 folks streaming HD movies. But if you're in a rural area like many RV'ers visit, the connection is a much smaller pipe, based on less expected traffic & lower population, and when just 10 folks on that tower start streaming HD video at the same time, everyone on that tower slows down. In an ideal world, we'd have fat fiber optic cables everywhere, but we can't afford that and we're far from that in many areas of the country. Its not just a matter of who pays how much, its also how you impact your neighbors by using more than your fair share of the limited bandwidth resource that we all share. We share a limited supply of water and sometimes have to limit water use in certain areas temporarily, and until we pay to install fatter internet pipes in all the less populated regions, we either control bandwidth use better or we suffer ongoing slow downs.

[Jack Mayer]

Jim2, your assessment is pretty accurate. The only thing it overlooks is that many people feel "entitled" to streaming. And they demand that they be able to do so - despite it's negative effect on others. This is TYPICAL in RV parks. It only takes a couple of people streaming to cause everyones Internet experience to be negatively affected. Most RV parks DO NOT have enough backhaul capacity to support streaming. Even if they have fiber connections. For example, I'm running 100 mbps fiber backhaul in this park. It cannot handle streaming. Not even close. I could run 1 GB backhaul, and IT would not handle streaming very well, although most of the time it would work OK. You cannot push that much HD video from 140 sites across it....and yes I KNOW not everyone would use it at once. But actual usage statistics PROVE that you cannot do streaming on a 100 or even 200 MBPS pipe. With average usage. There is no real solution to this issue in the typical infrastructure situation.

[GlennWest]

Those of us that had a unlimited line at home and now full time is spoiled. I still miss my DSL line I had in NC. We want it on our cells since that is all we have. Oh Well.

[RV_]

RVing and use in a park is a different ballgame from us folks in a stix n brix with a 350GB "limit." Verizon is looking to get into more, buying Yahoo. What is making a difference and competes are the new agreements not to charge data plans for streaming music or other content from certain providers. I'm not sure that is going to work but the deals are with the cell provider, not throttling.

 

What I am reading is that they are about to terminate 100 GB users.

 

Excerpt:

 

"The decision seems to be aimed at customers who've held onto an unlimited data plan that the telecom giant no longer offers, and are using that plan to the fullest. According to Verizon, not that many people are affected by the switch, but there are enough of them to prompt the company to make this unusual move. Verizon's largest data plan on offer is a 100 GB plan -- designed to be a shared plan -- that costs $450 a month. Customers receiving these warnings are using more than that on a single device.

 

"Currently less than 1% of our customers are on unlimited data plans; a small fraction of a percentage of those customers are using extraordinary amounts of data," the telecom giant said in the statement.

 

The company also made clear that it's sending the notifications only to customers whose contracts are up. "The users receiving notifications have completed the terms of their contracts and are using data amounts hundreds of times more than the average user," the statement said.

 

Using Verizon's own data calculator, an hour of streaming 4G video per day accounts for 10 GB of data use. So streaming 10 hours a day is an example of what it would take to hit 100 GB.

 

Verizon and other networks have been moving away from unlimited plans for years, as the average users' data consumption has increased -- thanks to an jump in video viewing and app use, not to mention an overall uptick in traffic from phones in general. In fact, Cisco has predicted that, by 2020, smartphones will be responsible for more web traffic than PCs."

 

The whole Washington Post article is here with a lot of comments at the bottom: https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/the-switch/wp/2016/07/22/verizon-confirms-it-will-boot-data-hogs-off-its-network/?wpisrc=nl_tech&wpmm=1

[docj]

 

 

Using Verizon's own data calculator, an hour of streaming 4G video per day accounts for 10 GB of data use. So streaming 10 hours a day is an example of what it would take to hit 100 GB.

 

 

I'm not saying that Verizon doesn't know what it's talking about but with HD video our experience is a bit different than this.

 

Last night we streamed exactly one hour of HD video and my WiFiRanger's Usage Tracking app showed that the Roku downloaded 2.10 GB during that hour. That would mean that an hour a day of video a day would account for 60 GB of day not 10 as claimed by Verizon which is much more consistent with the monthly totals we are seeing.

 

I think the issue is that Netflix (and some of the other streaming services) use an algorithm which dynamically alters the bandwidth of the stream you are receiving relative to the instantaneous data rate your internet connection can handle. This is why we rarely get "buffering" pauses any more while we used to get them frequently. Sure, some of that is due to better internet connections but quite a bit of it is due to the compression algorithms.

 

If you're feeling "geeky" try watching something like a Netflix stream and pay attention to the perceived resolution throughout the program. Almost assuredly, from time to time you will see subtle changes in resolution. If you do get a buffering/loading pause watch the resolution carefully when the stream is first restored, it will be at SD quality for at least a few minutes.

 

I believe that the data usage cited by Verizon is probably for an "average hour of video streaming" on its network. At most locations where we've streamed video the available bandwidth isn't enough to get full HD for any significant length of time. OTOH at our present location we're pretty much getting full HD all the time with no dynamic quality reductions at all.

 

Verizon chose to use its data for this press release because it wants to paint a picture of users who abuse the system by watching hours and hours of streaming video. In fact that's a rather gross exaggeration. Using my numbers it would be possible to use 100GB by watching less than 2 hours a day of programming, not 10 hours a day.