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Newbie needs help prioritizing equipment


bghouse

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4 hours ago, Barbaraok said:

....... even when paying it might be cheaper with electricity since propane appliances are not very efficient.

I use propane for all of my cooking and for hot water and daily showers.  A 20 pound tank lasts me about 2 months.  I typically pay in the range of $12-20 for a refill.  I would say that is pretty efficient.  I do use electric for heating water anytime I am charged a flat amount for electricity.  A flat nightly rate is typical for campgrounds that charge by the night.

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8 hours ago, jkoenig24 said:

The Escapees RV Club run an EXCELLENT RVBC, often over a weekend. RVSEF, FMCA, RV~Dreams and other groups offer RVBCs too,

The Escapees RVers' Boot Camp is not a driving school, although the do often have a driving school available at the location. The Escapee Boot Camp is, to the best of my knowledge, unique in that it covers a wide range of subject areas including safety but very little of it is driving.  RVSEF offers a range of safety related courses which include driving school. FMCA hosts an RVSEF course and I believe that you must be a member to attend. There is also a driving school which calls themselves RV Basic Training and seems legitimate, but I have no knowledge of them.  The RV Driving School is a commercial member of Escapees and they are available at all Escapades and most Escapee events. 

If you have not yet done so, I suggest that you get yourself one or two books on the subject of living in an RV to read and study. There are several excellent ones and they would go a long way to help you know what is most important. 

Good travelin !...............Kirk

Full-time 11+ years...... Now seasonal travelers.
Kirk & Pam's Great RV Adventure

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Some good advice...or suggestions here so far.  I'd like to follow up on the TPMS system.....as Kirk mentioned, they can be pricey.  However, consider if you have a blow out and it tears up the side of your rig......what is your deductable on getting that repaired?  It's a whole lot easier, at least for me, to go down the road with a bit of piece of mind knowing that a particular tire is heating up so that I can stop and take a look at it.....maybe get it changed to the spare before it blows out.  Just something to consider.

Also, people usually choose a class C over a class A simply because they think it's more like a pickup or van and therefore easier to drive.  Consider that a 30' class C and a 30' class A are the same length and the class A may have a sharper turning radius and will definately have more storage and probably rated for a higher pay load, weight wise.  At least test drive both, so that you'll know first hand.  The basement storage of a class A is huge and you will have it filled up!

And the purchase of an RV....if buying new you should be able to negotiate 30% below MSRP and even more or some extras thrown in.  Or.........let somebody else take the hit.  RVs are not used like our cars.....often only a few times a year.  Possibly find a used one that's only a few years old.  It will have very low miles on it, many of the "extras" have already been added by the original buyer and you'll get it for much less than new.  I would suggest not more than 5 years old at the most.  Our current 5th wheel is a 2017 model that we bought from a private party, used.  He had already added the 160 w solar panel on the roof, the Splendide washer/dryer combo, a new residential mattress that still had the plastic on it and a new Kurig coffee maker and toaster that had never been used.  He went from a 42' 5th wheel toy hauler to a little class C.

2017 Grand Design Momentum 376TH pulled by a 2014 Ford F-350 Lariat, FX-4, dually, longbed

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Me, again, with suggestions for water things.  Water pressure regulator is a must, but you can also buy a water filter that attaches to your water hose.  So starting from water source, put water regulator, water filter, and water hose that attaches to RV.  

Also, the C you buy will probably already have:

  - a full-house water filter built in.

  - a built-in generator,

  - a propane and CO detector, plus a smoke detector.

And if I ever bump into you, I have a roll of metal screening and will cut you off a chunk to cover those outlets to keep bugs out.  So don't do shopping for these things until you get your motorhome and know what it already has.

JudyJB

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Agree with Kirk on the metal valve stems.  If you get a TPMS that attaches to the end of the valve stems (like the TST system), you need the metal stems.  They can be found online in a few different lengths.  BTW, I think you'll find most blowouts are on trailers/fifthwheels.  Partially because trailer tires seem to be more Chinese junk than well built tires.  It took me 3 yrs, 2 blowouts, and one slow leak to decide to spend the bucks on a TPMS.  

Along with the TPMS, you need an ACCURATE tire gauge, such as https://www.amazon.com/Accutire-MS-4021B-Digital-Pressure-Gauge/dp/B00080QHMM/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&qid=1499083712&sr=8-1&keywords=accutire+ms+4021b  Gauges (and TPMS systems) can vary as much as 4% from the actual pressure.  This gauge is accurate to 1% or better.  That way, you set your pressure using the gauge, then see what the TPMS displays, and write it down.  After that, you only have to use the TPMS instead of getting down on the ground with a gauge.

Since you said you'll be at TT parks most of the time, hold off on the propane issues and just run on shore power.  See how you like it.  I assume you have a microwave.  If you have or get a "convection" microwave, and learn how to use the convection cooking, you may never use the RV oven.  My wife feared convection cooking initially, then a friend of ours who also RVs told her how great convection cooking was and my wife gave it a shot.  She loves it now.  The oven is just storage.

Have fun!!

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I don't remember seeing this but the best way to feel safe on the road is to take lessons from the RV Driving School. http://www.rvschool.com  We took our first lesson in a small rig then took them again when we bought a Class A. Well worth the money!

Linda Sand

Blog: http://sandcastle.sandsys.org/

Former Rigs: Liesure Travel van, Winnebago View 24H, Winnebago Journey 34Y, Sportsmobile Sprinter conversion van

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Sorry for the delay in responding - life had other plans for me it seemed - haha

 

@jkoenig24 - thank you.  I have been keeping an eye on boot camp dates and locations.  Yes, I've spent the last 4 years on rvtrader.com - haha.  I'm being pretty thorough in my research, and resisted the rush to purchase over the last few years. Thank goodness :-)

@LFDR3116 - definitely have the water pressure regulator on the list.  I forgot that the water heater might be able to run on electric or propane, I'll have to be aware of that when looking at rigs. 

@Barbaraok - I would probably keep mine on electric also.  I need to conquer my propane fears for sure...

@Kirk Wood - my kindle overflows with every book I could find on RV living in the last 5 years, haha.  Driving school is on the list also.  I've already done most of my lists based on everything I've learned from books and forums, but some things - like the autoformer, were not covered in books so I figured I'd ask here for folks "in the trenches" so to speak :-)

@JCZ - thanks. Class C works for me and I want to stay small for a number of reasons. Since everything I own fits in the trunk of my Chrysler Crossfire, I'm pretty good at living with less.  I will be buying used and will pay for an inspector to assist me.

@Solo18 - high JudyJB, I didn't know you were up here also :-) Definitely have that water filter outside on the list also. 

@remoandiris - thanks for the link!

@sandsys - thanks Linda, bookmarked :-)

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  • 2 weeks later...

@Barbaraok  I was just looking at the pictures I took of the rig I'm wanting to buy, and realized that it has one of those combo CO / LP monitors at floor level on the side of the dinette bench closest to the front... sigh...

Can I leave that one doing the LP, and then get a separate CO monitor to instead up and back in towards the bed.  Would that work do you think?

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56 minutes ago, bghouse said:

Can I leave that one doing the LP, and then get a separate CO monitor to instead up and back in towards the bed.  Would that work do you think?

You can but if you want the present one to only sense propane you will need to replace it with one that doesn't have both sensors. May I ask why it bothers you to have one of the dual purpose sensors? If you are planning to remove the dinette, you just need to find a similar location to what it is now located in and move it. Of course, that will also mean moving/rerouting the wires that supply the 12v power. 

Good travelin !...............Kirk

Full-time 11+ years...... Now seasonal travelers.
Kirk & Pam's Great RV Adventure

            images?q=tbn:ANd9GcQqFswi_bvvojaMvanTWAI

 

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CO monitors need to be at breathing level - generally mount at shoulder level will do, especially if your bed is up on a platform.   I did a couple of years of research work on CO binding to hemoglobin; you don't want to neglect that one.  Unlike propane, which has an odorant added, CO is odorless and you want that monitor in the bedroom area.

Barb & Dave O'Keeffe
2002 Alpine 36 MDDS (Figment II), 2018 Ford C-Max HYBRID
Blog: http://www.barbanddave.net
SPK# 90761 FMCA #F337834

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11 minutes ago, Barbaraok said:

CO monitors need to be at breathing level - generally mount at shoulder level will do, especially if your bed is up on a platform.

That has long been my belief as well and if you look at the instructions that come with either monitor that is for only 1 gas, the CO always says to mount it above the floor while the propane detectors say at floor level or even in a stairwell since propane is heavier than air and so settles to a low point. Yet the two sensors combined into a single device have become very common and lately, I have seen a few that add a third in a smoke detector. I have one of the CO/propane detectors and it is inches above the floor and on the base of the bed platform and the device has the U/L seal on the back? 

Good travelin !...............Kirk

Full-time 11+ years...... Now seasonal travelers.
Kirk & Pam's Great RV Adventure

            images?q=tbn:ANd9GcQqFswi_bvvojaMvanTWAI

 

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CO monitors should be in sleeping areas, 3-5 feet above the floor.  CO monitors should be at least 15 ft from fossil fuel burning appliances (ie from the stove).  

 

Propane monitors should be at floor level (or down in a stairwell) because propane sinks and should be in proximity of propane using equipment.   If you have a propane monitor in the bedroom, you can end up with an explosive situation in the kitchen area before alarm is triggered, triggering of which could instigate an explosion.  

CO and Smoke alarms combined is a good idea.   Both rise and need to alert in bedroom areas.

CO and Propane combination is a bad idea and should be banned.  Yes, they are out there and RV Manufacturers will offend go the cheapest route they can.  At some point, someone will die because of this and then new regulations will come into being.

Barb & Dave O'Keeffe
2002 Alpine 36 MDDS (Figment II), 2018 Ford C-Max HYBRID
Blog: http://www.barbanddave.net
SPK# 90761 FMCA #F337834

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So would I need to replace the combo one that is on the floor built into the dinette?  Or can I just leave it as a combo, knowing it's in a good place for the propane sensing, and then add a separate CO back by the bedroom and get it up off the floor?

Hmm - I'm not sure I can get 15' away from the stove in either direction - I'm only 25' total.  So on the back way under the cabinets above the bed then for the CO2?

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43 minutes ago, bghouse said:

...So would I need to replace the combo one that is on the floor built into the dinette?  Or can I just leave it as a combo, knowing it's in a good place for the propane sensing, and then add a separate CO back by the bedroom and get it up off the floor?...

I can not think of a reason why not. Our trailer came with a combination smoke/CO detector mounted near the bedroom door. I added a stand alone battery powered CO detector near the bed head board. You will just have to monitor the CO detector battery since the propane/CO detector is likely wired to the RV 12 volt system.

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19 hours ago, trailertraveler said:

the propane/CO detector is likely wired to the RV 12 volt system.

I'd bet that it is. I don't believe I have seen one in an RV that isn't connected in that way. It is done to be sure that if you are in the RV it will be working. Of course, they do have a 5-year lifespan.

Good travelin !...............Kirk

Full-time 11+ years...... Now seasonal travelers.
Kirk & Pam's Great RV Adventure

            images?q=tbn:ANd9GcQqFswi_bvvojaMvanTWAI

 

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I have one that is included with my propane detector.  I have another that is operated by a 9 volt battery.  I change the battery every year.

In spite of a self proclaimed expert, do not worry about the height of the detector of the floor.  CO is very slightly less dense than air but readily mixes even with minimal air currents.  Years ago there was a recommendation to hang detectors about 5 feet off the floor.  The goal was to keep the detector in a central part of the room and to avoid any potential dead spots that would delay the detector response.    The National Fire Protection Association now just recommends hanging detectors based on manufacturer's recommendations.  I have not seen recommendations from Kidde or any of the other manufacturers regarding the height off of the floor.  Consult the NFPA webpage or the detector manual if in doubt. 

The biggest concern about these detectors is loss of sensitivity due to age.  The life of the detectors has been greatly improved but most still need to be replaced in the range of about 5-7 years.  A combo propane and CO detector is actually a good idea.  Propane detectors have a limited life and often when they begin to fail they alarm when no propane is present.  They need to be replaced.  My first unit lasted 5 years.  The second only lasted 2-3 years.  I have 2 CO detectors, not because the location is sensitive but because they can silently fail and the test circuit only tests the actual alarm not the detection system. 

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On 7/21/2017 at 6:00 PM, Barbaraok said:

CO monitors need to be at breathing level - generally mount at shoulder level will do, especially if your bed is up on a platform.   I did a couple of years of research work on CO binding to hemoglobin; you don't want to neglect that one.  Unlike propane, which has an odorant added, CO is odorless and you want that monitor in the bedroom area.

I would just add that you should get a CO detector with a digital readout. That will give you lots more information than just one that beeps. I would also consider adding another so you have two in the class C.

Yes, I am a little paranoid when it come to CO. AND I even sleep with the windows open all year round!!! 

A trailer is a very small space. Get a digital readout meter and watch it during the day as various appliances come on and off. You will learn a LOT.

Vladimr Steblina

Retired Forester...exploring the public lands.

usbackroads.blogspot.com

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We were at a Escapade one time,  everyone had generators going and there would be CO monitors going off from fumes of another rig nearby.   One of the reasons of no generators after 10:00 pm.  You don't want people sleeping with CO migrating into their rigs from generators nearby. 

Barb & Dave O'Keeffe
2002 Alpine 36 MDDS (Figment II), 2018 Ford C-Max HYBRID
Blog: http://www.barbanddave.net
SPK# 90761 FMCA #F337834

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4 hours ago, Barbaraok said:

 Jim, would you give people your background in safety, health, toxicology, etc.?

I started as a chemist.  Worked most of my career in healthcare including boarded in clinical toxicology.

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And CO poisoning is no big deal to you?  OK, good to know.  Having done research in that area as an undergrad, I understand why the monitor should not be anywhere near furnace, stove, other fossil fuel burning areas, which is where propane monitors must be located.  

Good to see fellow chemist.  Where's you BS from?  MS?

Barb & Dave O'Keeffe
2002 Alpine 36 MDDS (Figment II), 2018 Ford C-Max HYBRID
Blog: http://www.barbanddave.net
SPK# 90761 FMCA #F337834

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I have two detectors in a small truck camper so I have no idea why you think I am not concerned about monitoring CO.  I don't trust CO detectors because with time it seems they lose sensitivity.  The test button only tests the power and the alarm.  It does not test the ability of the detector to detect CO.   The issue being discussed is the location.  Don't take my word for it.  Read the NFPA codes and the instructions from the individual detector manufacturers.  There is no need to hang a detector any specific distance from the floor.   BS, SUNY Binghamton; Ph.D, Cleveland State U/Cleveland Clinic but I am old and often out of date.

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I have read NFPA codes till my eye glaze over.  You and I both know that CO monitors should never been next to a source of flame, like the stove, as they will become fouled rather quickly.  They are meant to monitor in the breathing zone of people, especially when they sleep.  IIRC, 5-15 ft from combustion source (such as furnace, stove, etc) is what is preferred so as not to false alarm due to small amounts of CO that may occur at start up.  Exactly the opposite of propane - you want it at floor level NEAR/Next to source of fuel so that it detects first hint of a leak.    Would have expected you would go with a digital CO monitor so that you get an actual reading of CO amounts in your breathing zones, especially in such a tight area.    And I realize that in a truck camper (assume you mean slide in) you are very limited in terms of feet from one area to another.   In most RVs there is at least 5 feet between the cooking area (where the propane detector would be located at the floor) and the sleeping area (where the monitor should be at around 5', especially if one gets a digital monitor).

I think we should agree to disagree and suggest that people make sure they have a CO monitor in their sleeping area.

Barb & Dave O'Keeffe
2002 Alpine 36 MDDS (Figment II), 2018 Ford C-Max HYBRID
Blog: http://www.barbanddave.net
SPK# 90761 FMCA #F337834

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Yup.  At least one detector, not very old, and if it runs on a battery change the battery every camping season.  That is easy for me since I have a display clock and an alarm clock and the batteries die on them about once a year.  I replace all the miscellaneous camper batteries at the start of each season. 

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